that's a hard NO from the Leaf's not even close to the value of MM or a fit for a need for the Leafs

Chicago declines both. They decline the Marner one twice just to be sure.

Like Toronto Detroit declines.

Too much for Berggren, and that Marner trade IS AWFUL for CHI.



That is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Marner isn't worth anything close to a 2nd overall pick. Treliving would accept that in a heartbeat.

Hawks decline both trades and those UFAs are all underpaid

IF your lucky Demidov will be as good as MM is. Big IF

how does that help a team that is in WIN now mode?

It gives them a ton of cap space and a massively valuable asset they can go spend on improving their roster with more affordable players leaving them with a stronger roster top to bottom rather than a top heavy one like they currently have that obviously can't get it done in the playoffs. For a an aging player with a massive contract that will be asking for an even more massive extension, and whom TOR is probably going to have to walk away from him next summer anyway, that would be a massive haul.

I think Yzerman is going to finally give Bergy his chance this season if anything to get his trade value up.

He's been excellent for the Grand Rapids Griffins in the current AHL playoffs.

Yzerman didn't draft Bergy so he could certainly be traded.

But he hasn't proven enough at the NHL level to warrant a 2nd round pick.

Oh and Stephenson gets 6 mil easy.

Copp got 5.6

Compher got 5.1

Stephenson is better than both.

Smartest Leafs fan

Aging player? He's 27 hitting his prime.

MM can be moved for 3-4 pieces if they are trading for assets the Value offered here is not enough

Explain why Marner isn’t worth 2 overall. I’ll accept that it doesn’t fit Chicagos needs right now to make that move, if that’s what you mean. But if you mean the player himself isn’t worth it then explain why Marner isn’t worth a 2nd overall

Signing Erik Gustafson for a 4 year contract?!?!? Worst idea I’ve heard today.

really? second overall pick in a year where there are 4 VERY good D in the top 10? thats a steal for toronto

Leafs are in WIN now mode and most prospects do not pan out. you overvalue draft picks

Just go back and review social media posts from Leafs fans about Marner for the past year.

So the answer is Marner isn’t worth 2nd overall because Leaf fans don’t like him anymore?

I'd argue 1 year of any player isn't worth 2nd overall.

There are lots of reasons. He is a an almost 30 year old pending UFA with a massive contract that will command an even larger extension that can't seem to get the job done when it matters most. Regardless, no team in a position to have a 2nd overall pick has any business buying a "win now" player. Value isn't just determined by how many points a player can put up in a season. It is also heavily determined by the longevity of affordability, control, and the window that player gives you. It is also determined by whether they elevate their teammates, can take over and/or break important games, and rise to the occasion in the biggest moments. Which, none of TOR's guys with big contracts have done and somehow still got those big contracts. Kane and Toews didn't even get their $10.5M contracts and Full No Move Clauses until they had won 2 cups. What did Matthews, Marner, Tavares, and Nylander do?

Whoever CHI picks will still be a young man entering their second or third contract and still be under RFA control and should be able to give CHI 10-20 years total of production. At best, Marner gives us 8 years of production, but that is probably a stretch and I'd be willing to bet that he is in decline somewhere in the last few years of an 8 year extension, which means his cap hit becomes a problem when it matters most. Also, if Marner is willing to waive for and/or extend with CHI, that means he would be just as likely in free agency. So, if CHI actually has any interest in the first place, why wouldn't CHI just wait and not spend anything?

Who in their right mind would spend a 2nd overall pick on him, knowing all of this? There is almost no precedent for a trade such as this, with the closest in recent history being Debrincat for a 7th overall pick, and he was still under RFA control. The only teams I could see using such a high pick to acquire an established player would be ones that are near completion and just happened to have a bad season where they end up with a high pick and need a "win now" piece to take the roster to the next level. Even then, I could only see a pick in the 5-15 range or multiple later picks (plus) being used in such an acquisition, not a 2nd overall. The onus is on YOU/TORONTO to prove that he is worth it, not on anyone else to prove he isn't, but this should do the trick, anyway.

Yeah. This is a great point too. TOR fans tend to scapegoat and tell everyone how much they dislike their player and then ask for a giant return on them in the same breath. Pick a lane. Why would they even want to move him if he was worth so much?

Hitting his prime? He is already well into his prime and he will be 28 when his extension comes due. At which point CHI will still be nowhere near ready to even join the playoff picture, let alone be a true contender. We would squander what is left of his prime and he would likely become a burden in the last few years of his contract.

Ok, so as I thought, it’s not about Marner the player, it’s about the fit not working right now (which I totally accept and agree with). Because the player himself, absolutely is worth a 2nd overall pick

What year exactly do you think people primes are lol 26-32 I’d argue

If no one would spend a 2nd overall pick on him, he isn't worth a 2nd overall pick.

That’s just not true. Would the Blackhawk’s have traded the first overall pick last year for Mackinnon? makar? Mcdavid? Matthews? Those guys are worth 1st overall picks

On average maybe. But it varies on an individual level. That just proves my point, though. With an 8 year extension, at 32 years old he would still have half his contract left to go. CHI isn't giving up 10-20 years of a home grown and drafted high end prospect for 4 years of an aging one with a massive contract. I doubt any team would, honestly.