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A New Argument

Created by: HatterTParty
Team: 2019-20 Chicago Blackhawks
Initial Creation Date: Sep. 22, 2019
Published: Sep. 22, 2019
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Legend
Left Handed
Original Team
Waivers Exempt
Right Handed
Position
Trade Clause
Max Perf. Bonus
Expiry Status
Term Remaining
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
Waivers ExemptMcDavid, Connor
$12,500,000 (Performance Bonus$250,000)
C
NMC
UFA - 5
Description
According to bowman, Colliton, and toews, dach is still in the conversation to make the team for the season. Bowman has at least said a decision will be made when the time comes, which is the vaguest answer any GM could give. Colliton stayed that he will always be in contention but time is needed to see where he is at, which is understandable but also concerning when you consider the other prospects who have worked harder and earned it more than dach. Then toews stated that if dach can help the team be successful this season, he should and will be on the team, to which I ask where does he help?

So then I thought about it in another way. Let’s consider that by Colliton’s rational, it would seem dach, not necessarily through hard work or drive, would always be considered even if he didn’t play a single preseason game or rep in camp due to his concussion. Why he feels this way, I assume is simply because 3OA. Then, consider that toews believes, cut and dry, that if he makes us better this season, he makes the team. So here’s my thought/problem: if we follow this logic on Dach (if he makes us better, he stays, in spite of not proving anything camp), why are giving the golden boy a pass despite getting laid out by a 5’10’ player never to be in the nhl, but boqvist is doomed to play in the ahl for the year? Seriously, has boqvist not earned a spot? Is he not better than each defenseman? Forget his defensive game for one goddamn second, he is thee best this organization has. By sending him down, yes you want him to mature his game and improve defensively, but imagine the good he can do on the hawks. Karlsson wasn’t perfect when he started, and we don’t need boqvist to be, he just has to allowed to play his game. Otherwise, what the hell does dach do for this team that’s more important than boqvist? As far as I’m concerned, it really should be both of them or neither of them this season. Dach hasn’t earned anything and he doesn’t make this team any better than boqvist could, who by the way has earned his spot.

Am I out of line here (or rather more than usual)? Gimme your thoughts, cuz this has really struck a nerve for me.
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2020
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2021
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2022
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ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
21$81,500,000$65,812,478$0$2,507,500$15,687,522
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$3,250,000$3,250,000
LW, C
M-NTC
UFA - 2
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$10,500,000$10,500,000
C
NMC
UFA - 4
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$2,625,000$2,625,000
RW
NMC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$1,500,000$1,500,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$3,900,000$3,900,000
C, RW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$5,000,000$5,000,000
LW, RW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$778,333$778,333 (Performance Bonus$32,500$32K)
LW, RW
UFA - 1
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$1,000,000$1,000,000
C
UFA - 2
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$1,000,000$1,000,000
RW, C
UFA - 3
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$863,333$863,333 (Performance Bonus$2,475,000$2M)
C
UFA - 1
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$874,125$874,125
RW, LW
UFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
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$5,538,462$5,538,462
LD
NMC
UFA - 4
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$6,875,000$6,875,000
RD
NMC
UFA - 5
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$6,000,000$6,000,000
G
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 1
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$4,550,000$4,550,000
LD/RD
UFA - 3
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$3,850,000$3,850,000
RD
UFA - 3
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$1,400,000$1,400,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$3,333,225$3,333,225
LD
UFA - 3
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$1,200,000$1,200,000
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$925,000$925,000
LD/RD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$850,000$850,000
LD
UFA - 2

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Top Comments

Sep. 22, 2019 at 1:02 a.m.
#1
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I agree with you on the facet that Boqvist should be in the NHL. Its okay to lose one of Koekkoek or Dahlstrom to Waivers, nobody is going to take them in a trade anyway. But the fact of the matter is, if Kampf is the prospective 3rd line center and Wedin is the only other option to that, Dach is a huge upgrade. If the 3rd line wingers are Saad and Kubalik, that line isnt going to be good with Kampf in the middle. So if you look at it from that respect, Dach brings a solution to a more immediate need than Boqvist; although Boqvist certainly would be an upgrade over whomever he would replace, his defensive issues are too common to what we have at the top of the Dman depth chart that until he is replacing Gustafsson he doesnt bring too much of a situational upgrade. In a perfect world, they are both playing for the Hawks this season.
Sep. 22, 2019 at 2:45 a.m.
#2
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Quoting: SlickWilly
I agree with you on the facet that Boqvist should be in the NHL. Its okay to lose one of Koekkoek or Dahlstrom to Waivers, nobody is going to take them in a trade anyway. But the fact of the matter is, if Kampf is the prospective 3rd line center and Wedin is the only other option to that, Dach is a huge upgrade. If the 3rd line wingers are Saad and Kubalik, that line isnt going to be good with Kampf in the middle. So if you look at it from that respect, Dach brings a solution to a more immediate need than Boqvist; although Boqvist certainly would be an upgrade over whomever he would replace, his defensive issues are too common to what we have at the top of the Dman depth chart that until he is replacing Gustafsson he doesnt bring too much of a situational upgrade. In a perfect world, they are both playing for the Hawks this season.


I get what your saying, and it makes sense. But I'll put it this way: Boqvist's defensive problems actually differ from the problems we have now in one key way. Whereas our defense now basically gives up the puck and cant keep up, Boqvist has a tendency just blow coverage. However, if that does happen, he has the mobility to recover. The NHL is so fast these days that that speed is absolutely premium. Not to mention, Boqvist is an incredible puck mover and passer. None of our dmen have either of those abilities anymore. So in point of fact, I'd say he's far more valuable than Dach.

In Dach's case, to say he upgrades the third line by replacing Kampf is the same argument as Boqvist replacing Dahlstrom or Koekkoek. Besides, Kubalik belongs in the top 6, Saad and Shaw belong on the third, at least in my opinion, and in that regard Kampf is right where he should be. From where I'm looking at this team, Offense is not the problem, so we have to stop pretending that it is, and Dach isn't the one to change anything, at least not this year. Plus, and just remember that might happen, Dach is not a center. He's very lazy, he cant win faceoffs, and he cant keep up with any of the modern NHLers i.e. he's too slow. He projects, in my mind, as a winger. So make him go back to juniors TOMORROW, let him learn how to use his body, tell him get consistent, learn to not play so lazy, get some more foot speed, literally work on ALL THE THINGS THAT SEEN AS DOWNSIDES TO HIM.

I'm not saying Dach isn't an upgrade, I'm just saying this kid is further from ready than scouting staff realized. He hasn't earned a spot, he got manhandled by non-NHLer, and he isn't even a center ability-wise. I do get where your coming from, but I would say that the way your looking at it is if Dach is actually ready for the NHL like Boqvist is, and he really isn't.
Sep. 22, 2019 at 9:10 a.m.
#3
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I don’t think Dach is going to make the team, I think he’s stuck around for so long because they want to see him play against NHL talent in a least one preseason game to see what he’s got. If he isn’t able to play in a preseason game, they might keep him for a few regular seasons games as a pseudo-tryout, but unless he really impresses I think he’s back to Saskatoon.

To address your concerns about Dach - I really don’t understand why you are trying to make his injury sound like his own fault. It was a dirty hit from behind. If he had seen it coming, or if he had been expecting the hit because he knew that it was legal for others to hit him at the time you might have a point, but he had his back turned and wasn’t expecting anyone to illegally smash his head into the boards. Just because he’s big, doesn’t mean he should be able to take every hit standing up, especially if he isn’t expecting it. Seems pretty callous to blame the injury on him if you ask me.

Also, you say you don’t think Dach should be a center because he’s “lazy”, “can’t win faceoffs” , and “too slow”. There’s this thing called development. No kid coming out of the draft is going to be a perfect, #1 center right out of the gate unless their name is Connor McDavid. Dach has some work to do on faceoffs. He probably needs to work on his skating as well. I’m not sure what evidence you have of him being lazy, but I’ll ignore that for now. Either way, my point is that you can’t write a guy off for fixable flaws he has as an 18 year old who hasn’t played in a single NHL game. The Hawks expect him to be a center in the future, so they will tailor his development to make him a good one.

As to why Dach is being considered and Boqvist is not - They both are, that’s why neither has been cut yet. The coaches clearly like Boqvist and want to see more of him, but, as Willy said in a previous comment, the open roster positions are not in his favor. If Dach is better than Kampf and Wedin, which isn’t clear at the moment because he hasn’t played a preseason game yet, then he will get the 3C job. Boqvist may be better than Koekkoek and Dahlstrom, but why would you want him as a 7th defenseman? He isn’t as good defensively as Murphy, De Haan, and Maatta, they can’t send down Keith or Seabrook, and Gus has proven that he’s better defensively than Boqvist so he’s earned the PP quarterback role (though I think Boqvist replaces him by the trade deadline).

TL;DR: Dach probably won’t make the team, but the coaches want to see him play before they send him
back to juniors. It isn’t fair to blame Dach for his own injury, and you have to let him develop before writing him off as a center altogether. The only reason he would make the team and Boqvist won’t is because he plays a position the Hawks need while Boqvist does not.
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Sep. 22, 2019 at 9:57 a.m.
#4
exo2769
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Edited Sep. 22, 2019 at 10:24 a.m.
I tend to agree with @Petrock83 . I dont think Dach will ultimately win the job, but we have a puck moving Dman with only 1 year left on his contract. This allows The Hawks the flexibility to (I think) more properly develop Boqvist. And boost Gus's possible trade value. With that said...they dont have a true #3C. AND every team had Dach ranked in the top 10. SO...if you're not in college...what top 10 player ISN'T trying to make the team. Having an injury makes this decision a little easier to me...to send him down. BUT, I think everyone wants to see him play. Even if you're not a fan of his...you're still going to want to see him on the ice with the team and see how he does for the sake of the Hawks as a team in general.
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Sep. 22, 2019 at 1:12 p.m.
#5
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Quoting: Petrock83
I don’t think Dach is going to make the team, I think he’s stuck around for so long because they want to see him play against NHL talent in a least one preseason game to see what he’s got. If he isn’t able to play in a preseason game, they might keep him for a few regular seasons games as a pseudo-tryout, but unless he really impresses I think he’s back to Saskatoon.

To address your concerns about Dach - I really don’t understand why you are trying to make his injury sound like his own fault. It was a dirty hit from behind. If he had seen it coming, or if he had been expecting the hit because he knew that it was legal for others to hit him at the time you might have a point, but he had his back turned and wasn’t expecting anyone to illegally smash his head into the boards. Just because he’s big, doesn’t mean he should be able to take every hit standing up, especially if he isn’t expecting it. Seems pretty callous to blame the injury on him if you ask me.

Also, you say you don’t think Dach should be a center because he’s “lazy”, “can’t win faceoffs” , and “too slow”. There’s this thing called development. No kid coming out of the draft is going to be a perfect, #1 center right out of the gate unless their name is Connor McDavid. Dach has some work to do on faceoffs. He probably needs to work on his skating as well. I’m not sure what evidence you have of him being lazy, but I’ll ignore that for now. Either way, my point is that you can’t write a guy off for fixable flaws he has as an 18 year old who hasn’t played in a single NHL game. The Hawks expect him to be a center in the future, so they will tailor his development to make him a good one.

As to why Dach is being considered and Boqvist is not - They both are, that’s why neither has been cut yet. The coaches clearly like Boqvist and want to see more of him, but, as Willy said in a previous comment, the open roster positions are not in his favor. If Dach is better than Kampf and Wedin, which isn’t clear at the moment because he hasn’t played a preseason game yet, then he will get the 3C job. Boqvist may be better than Koekkoek and Dahlstrom, but why would you want him as a 7th defenseman? He isn’t as good defensively as Murphy, De Haan, and Maatta, they can’t send down Keith or Seabrook, and Gus has proven that he’s better defensively than Boqvist so he’s earned the PP quarterback role (though I think Boqvist replaces him by the trade deadline).

TL;DR: Dach probably won’t make the team, but the coaches want to see him play before they send him
back to juniors. It isn’t fair to blame Dach for his own injury, and you have to let him develop before writing him off as a center altogether. The only reason he would make the team and Boqvist won’t is because he plays a position the Hawks need while Boqvist does not.


Quoting: exo2769
I tend to agree with @Petrock83 . I dont think Dach will ultimately win the job, but we have a puck moving Dman with only 1 year left on his contract. This allows The Hawks the flexibility to (I think) more properly develop Boqvist. And boost Gus's possible trade value. With that said...they dont have a true #3C. AND every team had Dach ranked in the top 10. SO...if you're not in college...what top 10 player ISN'T trying to make the team. Having an injury makes this decision a little easier to me...to send him down. BUT, I think everyone wants to see him play. Even if you're not a fan of his...you're still going to want to see him on the ice with the team and see how he does for the sake of the Hawks as a team in general.


Alright, I’ll try to address every point in order, apologies if I do kinda go astray. First of all, good points from everyone, I do like seeing and hearing the different views. Exo you crafty son of a gun, good to have you back.

So first, the hit. I played hockey for a long time, coached it for a long time, and have worked for a team for over a year now. Now, when I played and when I coached, the one thing I always preached is that the difference between good and great wasn’t skill, but rather intelligence. It’s about having that Gretzky ability to know what’s going on around you and how to anticipate the plays. Some players are gifted with this at a very young age. When dach was hit, and I have watched it 30 times just so I have evidence to go off. The only thing out of dach’s control was the ridiculous cross check the guy laid on him when he was down. I mean that was truly stupid. However, I said this elsewhere, when dach is skating in the zone, did he not think a player was backchecking? Clearly he knew because if he didn’t he wouldn’t gone so wide into the zone and he would have gone straight to the net. As such, when he passed the puck, as does happen, dach exposed his body/chest to the oncoming players. Less than a second after, the pilon brother puts a hit into his chest and shoulder area, not from behind. I’ve been hit like that before, and every time it happens I blame myself for not bracing myself or being aware of the pressure coming. As the offensive player, it was my responsibility to either bend my knees and get low, or continue skating hard after the pass, because for a second after that pass, you are heavily exposed. So I’m not blaming his injury on him guys, I’m blaming his lack of awareness on the play. Not to mention, I believe awareness and vision was a big selling point on him, no???

As for his “development,” sure everything is fixable. Face offs maybe not, because Jesus Christ take one look at strome on faceoffs, pure horror. Dach is most likely gonna sub 50% for the rest of his career, considering he’s 41% right now. Tough look. That being said, let me make it clear, I believe dach will be a center, I just don’t think it’s what he SHOULD be. Dach has been sold to us hawks fans as the center messiah of the future. So don’t worry, he’s gonna be a center whether anyone likes it or not. I just won’t cuz you could have infinitely better from other sources (god I’m gonna hate facing turcotte). As for his flaws, I only speak to them cuz I’ve seen in both junior and the blackhawks camps. For a center, he is remarkably lazy off the puck. He may strip a puck or two, but never actually assert himself onto a game. I’ve seen a lot over the last year because it’s part of my job. Yes, he can get this developed out of him, but what exactly says it will where it wasn’t for strome in arizona and nylander in buffalo? I’m not actually looking for an answer to that question, because the only answer is “time will tell.” These flaws, though, immediately sent strome and nylander back to juniors. If anything dach is nothing compared to the hype that surrounded Dylan strome. So the nhl, as of now, is not the place for him, and saying they want to see him play simply because he’s 3OA doesn’t mean a thing to me. I’ve seen him, and I’m scared of him playing actual men.

Finally, the spots. Now I’ve mentioned this before and unfortunately we just see this differently. We can both admit that for sure. I don’t care who the 3C is, this didn’t win any of its cups with 4 legit centers, ever. The closest we came was 2013 when we had toews, handzus, bolland, and no clearly defined 4th center. Point I’m making is that you two great offensive centers already and kampf as a serviceable, hardworking next center. You even have carpenter for that 4th line as well! As bowman annoyingly puts it, we now have a “tougher team to play against.” Offense is not and has not been the problem last season or for 10 years. I understand that talent wise, dach may be better, but there’s no room for him with all the players we’ve added. This is the case with boqvist on defense as well, and boqvist is wayyyyy more developed than dach is. Dach doesn’t really make us better right now because he is underdeveloped and our offense is already solid. Boqvist serves a purpose by being a great skater and moving the puck. Boqvist won’t the team permanently, I get it. I just don’t want the team to suggest that Dach has any business doing so then.

To conclude, I do accept the arguments you both made. It’s fair and as fair as anyone is concerned, dach is purely riding the a hype train as 3OA. I think people need to come off it a little, but it definitely won’t happen. People wanna see him, even those who hate him. I don’t want to see him, personally, cuz I don’t anyone that has the flaws he has should be given the tryout. Develop him properly and sending him back to juniors. He can’t learn anything here if every player back checking knows they can just plant a shoulder into his and send him flying. He needs to learn consistency against players his own age and mature into his frame more since he doesn’t really know how to use it efficiently. I’ll say it again, I’m genuinely scared for him to play against NHLers right now. We lucked into 3 OA and we went with the questionable pick and now we have to make sure it works. If it doesn’t, this team is in big trouble, not because “oh dang our future center isn’t who we thought he was,” but rather because we wasted a top 3 pick in general. Byram will thrive, cuz he is on a team that knows exactly how to grow him on a good pace. Turcotte is in an even better spot because college will do him wonders. But dach is being forced into messiah status when he’s basically had the worst summer of each of the top 5 picks. I don’t need to see him on nhl ice, I just need them to send him down so nothing bad happens to him and risks him flopping.
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