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Fire Stan Bowman

Created by: Hockeyplayer1
Team: 2018-19 Chicago Blackhawks
Initial Creation Date: Jul. 12, 2018
Published: Jul. 12, 2018
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
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Hinostroza is EASILY top-9 forward. He probably would have played next to Toews and Saad next year. He's a 40 point player next year without a doubt. He's on a 2 year deal for ONLY $1.5M
For as much as everyone complained about Oesterle, he's the only one on the roster outside of Keith that could play against top competition last year. He was making LEAGUE MINIMUM.

Marian Hossa's contract had very little impact to the Hawks.

If you're going to trade Hinostroza why on earth do you not qualify Anthony Duclair?

This is horrendous asset management.

I'm sorry but this is the last straw. I've been hesitant to call for Bowman's head the last few years but this is pathetic.

Please name a trade or signing in the last 3 years that has made the Chicago Blackhawks a better team than the years past. I'll wait.
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2020
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ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
22$79,500,000$65,405,545$1,232,500$1,907,500$14,094,455
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LD
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G
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Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:22 p.m.
#1
Kyle from Chicago
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I’m going to level with you... I agree 100% no sarcasm.
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Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:28 p.m.
#2
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LMAO im glad that hawks fan see wtf is going on. Im a flyers fan and i can't believe stan signed brandon manning, didn't qualify duclair that ended up signing for 650k. 650k for 22 year old that you traded for lmao. he's always trying to fix his cap problem when theres not that big of a cap problem. Signs cam ward for 3 mil. also traded saad for planarian straight up lmaooooo this guy has lost his touch. The only way he fixes this is if he ships patty kane to buffalo for everything but the kitchen sink.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:28 p.m.
#3
exo2769
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I'm disappointed with the cost to shed Hossa's contract. Hino and Oesterle were too much. I also agree that I can't actually think of a good trade since Jeremy Morin for Richard Panik on Jan 3rd 2016, BUT then Bowman created his own problem by giving Panik an undeserved extension and trading him away for what has literally turned out to be nothing because of his poor asset management of Duclair. That's also a bit mind boggling. Further to your point...the last 3 years of trades...hmmm...Shaw for (2) 2nds...Debrincat...actually is a BIG winner, but that isn't even a direct trade...it's the scout team drafting the right person.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:31 p.m.
#4
ChiHawks34
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i disagree for a few reasons. First, IF/When bowman gets skinner/patches, this whole arguement is thrown out the window. Secondly, vinny scored 7 goals last year. we can all say he would be a 40 point player or more next year, but 40 points a year is not fantastic. Oesterle is and was a 3rd pairing D throw away. kruger is on a bad contract, but it is only one more year and helps toews not spend so much energy on the pk. now add skinner/patches on the top 6, with a bunch of prospects that can replace vinny's production sooner or later, the team would look solid.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:32 p.m.
#5
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Quoting: exo2769
I'm disappointed with the cost to shed Hossa's contract. Hino and Oesterle were too much. I also agree that I can't actually think of a good trade since Jeremy Morin for Richard Panik on Jan 3rd 2016, BUT then Bowman created his own problem by giving Panik an undeserved extension and trading him away for what has literally turned out to be nothing because of his poor asset management of Duclair. That's also a bit mind boggling. Further to your point...the last 3 years of trades...hmmm...Shaw for (2) 2nds...Debrincat...actually is a BIG winner, but that isn't even a direct trade...it's the scout team drafting the right person.


You named the only 2 that I could think of. Morin for Panik, great trade until Stan pays him twice what he should have. Shaw for two 2nds is only good because every team in the league passed on a 2 time 50 goal scorer in the OHL. Like come on.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:35 p.m.
#6
exo2769
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Quoting: Hockeyplayer1
You named the only 2 that I could think of. Morin for Panik, great trade until Stan pays him twice what he should have. Shaw for two 2nds is only good because every team in the league passed on a 2 time 50 goal scorer in the OHL. Like come on.


I'm not disagreeing with you! I'm actually saying that even on the good trades...Bowman needs help! Hartman is too early to tell right now, but even if Beaudin turns out to be a super stud...that's again help from the scout team. It's not like Stan's attending EVERY game everywhere making unilateral draft picks.

***EDIT*** I'd even go so far as to the signings like Rutta/Panarin/Kempny/etc... they weren't trades... More scout team assistance.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:39 p.m.
#7
Chiggy
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Quoting: ChiHawks34
i disagree for a few reasons. First, IF/When bowman gets skinner/patches, this whole arguement is thrown out the window.


Why you assuming that if/when they happen, they will be good trades? Imagine a scenario were he gives up too much for Pacioretty and turns around and signs him for 8x8 or something stupid.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:39 p.m.
#8
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Edited Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:47 p.m.
Quoting: ChiHawks34
i disagree for a few reasons. First, IF/When bowman gets skinner/patches, this whole arguement is thrown out the window. Secondly, vinny scored 7 goals last year. we can all say he would be a 40 point player or more next year, but 40 points a year is not fantastic. Oesterle is and was a 3rd pairing D throw away. kruger is on a bad contract, but it is only one more year and helps toews not spend so much energy on the pk. now add skinner/patches on the top 6, with a bunch of prospects that can replace vinny's production sooner or later, the team would look solid.


You don't need to move Hossa's contract to make those trades. You put Hossa on LTIR and free up $5.275M.
For $1.5M it sure as hell is?? A 24 year old who paced 42 points last year at $1.5M is GREAT. Find me another player like him with a contract as good as that.
"Oesterle was a 3rd pairing throwaway". Is that why he averaged more ice time than everyone except Keith. So what you're saying is every defenseman except Keith was a 3rd pairing throwaway.

The point is Hossa's contract was not a major hindrance to the Blackhawks making moves and we gave up two solid players to move his contract.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:40 p.m.
#9
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Quoting: exo2769
I'm not disagreeing with you! I'm actually saying that even on the good trades...Bowman needs help! Hartman is too early to tell right now, but even if Beaudin turns out to be a super stud...that's again help from the scout team. It's not like Stan's attending EVERY game everywhere making unilateral draft picks.

***EDIT*** I'd even go so far as to the signings like Rutta/Panarin/Kempny/etc... they weren't trades... More scout team assistance.


I know. I was just ranting in agreement.
Also all of those 3 signings were ELC so Bowman couldn't sign them to trash contracts.
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Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:42 p.m.
#10
Subbanator
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He taught Marc Bergevin everything he knows
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Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:47 p.m.
#11
exo2769
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Quoting: ChiHawks34
i disagree for a few reasons. First, IF/When bowman gets skinner/patches, this whole arguement is thrown out the window. Secondly, vinny scored 7 goals last year. we can all say he would be a 40 point player or more next year, but 40 points a year is not fantastic. Oesterle is and was a 3rd pairing D throw away. kruger is on a bad contract, but it is only one more year and helps toews not spend so much energy on the pk. now add skinner/patches on the top 6, with a bunch of prospects that can replace vinny's production sooner or later, the team would look solid.


I will agree and disagree at the same time. LOL! There is still time to make this trade look better. Right now it looks like junk. Oesterle played 20+ min a game and for over half the season looked like the only one who can handle playing against the top line with keith. He looked good and for $650k! One can argue he might not do it again or that it was only for half the season...fine, but now we add Hino...a .5ppg player. That's not made up. He played with random people and bounced all over the lines. With some consistency he might be able to even improve on that 40 points. It's just a lot to give up. Entwistle...ok fine he's playing will in Hamilton, but come on. Without that future move...which may be good...may not be good... This trade alone isn't very good.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:48 p.m.
#12
Grierless Sharks Fan
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3 cups?

He may not have drafted everyone, but he made trades and signings that built that team into a contender for half the decade.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:53 p.m.
#13
exo2769
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Quoting: goodfella
3 cups?

He may not have drafted everyone, but he made trades and signings that built that team into a contender for half the decade.


That's just not true....for the 1st cup especially too. People need to give credit to Dale Tallon. I will give Bowman credit for the Handzus trade in 2013. That was HUGE! However...and this is 110% true...His "BIG" acquisition in 2015 was (2) 2nds for Kimo Timmonen who literally played 4 minutes a game in the playoffs. One could argue that he VERY MUCH hurt the team that Trade Deadline.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 4:55 p.m.
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You all realize that for the Hawks to keep Duclair, they would have had to qualify him for double what Columbus signed him to? 30 other teams could have given him anything their little hearts desired, and all Duclair could manage was half what the Hawks would have had to pay to keep him. Sikura and Kahan will replace everything Hino and Duclair provided the Hawks and then some for half their price (1.5 Hino is signed for and the 1.25+ Duclair would have had to be qualified for) . Hino and Duclair produced NINE flipping goals for the Hawks last year and we want to act like we traded/gave up on Panarin.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 5:03 p.m.
#15
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Quoting: wojohawk
You all realize that for the Hawks to keep Duclair, they would have had to qualify him for double what Columbus signed him to? 30 other teams could have given him anything their little hearts desired, and all Duclair could manage was half what the Hawks would have had to pay to keep him. Sikura and Kahan will replace everything Hino and Duclair provided the Hawks and then some for half their price (1.5 Hino is signed for and the 1.25+ Duclair would have had to be qualified for) . Hino and Duclair produced NINE flipping goals for the Hawks last year and we want to act like we traded/gave up on Panarin.


It's not the point that Sikura can replace one of them, which is still very much yet to be seen. Kahun is coming from the DEL and to expect him to be an immediate impact player is crazy. The DEL is like the 7 best league in the world even ranked behind the AHL.
The point is we traded away a very good young player on a great contract for almost no reason. Why would you not want Sikura AND Hinostroza?

And I'm not going to argue that Duclair wasn't worth his $1.3M QO but the fact they failed to have contract negotiations in the $900k range blows my mind. Duclair's agent had to have some feeling of what the market was like for his player. The Hawks should have as well and should have started contract negotiations.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 5:03 p.m.
#16
ChiHawks34
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Quoting: Hockeyplayer1
You don't need to move Hossa's contract to make those trades. You put Hossa on LTIR and free up $5.275M.
For $1.5M it sure as hell is?? A 24 year old who paced 42 points last year at $1.5M is GREAT. Find me another player like him with a contract as good as that.
"Oesterle was a 3rd pairing throwaway". Is that why he averaged more ice time than everyone except Keith. So what you're saying is every defenseman except Keith was a 3rd pairing throwaway.

The point is Hossa's contract was not a major hindrance to the Blackhawks making moves and we gave up two solid players to move his contract.


yes hossa was actually hindering some trade possibilities for this reason. putting hossa's ltir on during th eseason would mean if you were over the cap before the season in anticipation for this, you would have to potentially risk a big name player to be picked up from waivers. also like last year, the hawks barely used his ltir money so it was basically a waste. now they can do whatever they want with that cap space. Secondly, vinny was on pace for that which is a 3rd liner production number. he scored 7 goals in 50 games. 7 goals. he was on pace for what 12 goals maybe? yet he is a big deal to lose? im sorry but i don't see how that production is hard to replace at all. thirdly, there is a reason he traded hossa and vinny this summer. he is making another move to replace vinny's spot. if bowman didn't want to make any other move why in the hell would he accept this trade offer? you are looking at this so short sighted.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 5:13 p.m.
#17
Chicago Blackhawks
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Hahaha, holy **** this is the "loud noises" reaction of the day for sure...
Jul. 12, 2018 at 5:14 p.m.
#18
Chicago Blackhawks
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Quoting: Stan_Bowman
I’m going to level with you... I agree 100% no sarcasm.


At least you enjoy good lulz...
Jul. 12, 2018 at 5:14 p.m.
#19
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Quoting: ChiHawks34
yes hossa was actually hindering some trade possibilities for this reason. putting hossa's ltir on during th eseason would mean if you were over the cap before the season in anticipation for this, you would have to potentially risk a big name player to be picked up from waivers. also like last year, the hawks barely used his ltir money so it was basically a waste. now they can do whatever they want with that cap space. Secondly, vinny was on pace for that which is a 3rd liner production number. he scored 7 goals in 50 games. 7 goals. he was on pace for what 12 goals maybe? yet he is a big deal to lose? im sorry but i don't see how that production is hard to replace at all. thirdly, there is a reason he traded hossa and vinny this summer. he is making another move to replace vinny's spot. if bowman didn't want to make any other move why in the hell would he accept this trade offer? you are looking at this so short sighted.


What "big name player" would the hawks send though waivers? Gustafsson? Kunitz?
Like what? Your statement here makes no sense.
The Hawks could have added up to $5.275M over the cap to their roster prior to the season with 24 man roster (including Hossa). Then place him on LTIR to start the season. That's a 23 man roster with Hossa LTIR as the 24th and nobody except the people who don't make the have to go through waivers. And the only players that wouldn't make the team out of camp who arent waivers exempt are maybe Gustafsson, Manningn Forsling, and Hayden.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 5:21 p.m.
#20
ChiHawks34
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Quoting: Hockeyplayer1
What "big name player" would the hawks send though waivers? Gustafsson? Kunitz?
Like what? Your statement here makes no sense.
The Hawks could have added up to $5.275M over the cap to their roster prior to the season with 24 man roster (including Hossa). Then place him on LTIR to start the season. That's a 23 man roster with Hossa LTIR as the 24th and nobody except the people who don't make the have to go through waivers. And the only players that wouldn't make the team out of camp who arent waivers exempt are maybe Gustafsson, Manningn Forsling, and Hayden.

i am saying that if the hawks wanted to get a player around his same cap hit. and they were over 5.275m in cap waiting to send him to LTIR, they would have to risk sending someone with that cap space or more to waivers. that is not a scenario that would happen but that is something that would be against the hawks. they would have to be careful who they sign and trade for in the offseason. Hossa's LTIR in the regular season is worse than just clearing it and doign what you want with the cap whenever you want.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 5:27 p.m.
#21
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Quoting: ChiHawks34
i am saying that if the hawks wanted to get a player around his same cap hit. and they were over 5.275m in cap waiting to send him to LTIR, they would have to risk sending someone with that cap space or more to waivers. that is not a scenario that would happen but that is something that would be against the hawks. they would have to be careful who they sign and trade for in the offseason. Hossa's LTIR in the regular season is worse than just clearing it and doign what you want with the cap whenever you want.


LTIR can be used during the offseason so that you don't have to send anyone through waivers. Hossa would be considered on LTIR prior to and as the season starts so they would get the $5.275M in relief the whole time. They aren't required to get below the cap ceiling with Hossa's cap. That is what they chose to do last year because it allows for more in-season flexibility.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 5:30 p.m.
#22
ChiHawks34
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Quoting: Hockeyplayer1
LTIR can be used during the offseason so that you don't have to send anyone through waivers. Hossa would be considered on LTIR prior to and as the season starts so they would get the $5.275M in relief the whole time. They aren't required to get below the cap ceiling with Hossa's cap. That is what they chose to do last year because it allows for more in-season flexibility.


yes, but that means the hawks couldn't do anything with their roster the entire season. which is horrible to do. if bowman fails to acquire jeff skinner or patches, then i will agree that this trade was a fail for next season. but if bowman does acquire one of them, this trade was a good thing.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 5:43 p.m.
#23
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Quoting: ChiHawks34
yes, but that means the hawks couldn't do anything with their roster the entire season. which is horrible to do. if bowman fails to acquire jeff skinner or patches, then i will agree that this trade was a fail for next season. but if bowman does acquire one of them, this trade was a good thing.


Not completely true. They can still do plenty with their roster, they just couldn't ADD more salary. They could make trades where they return less salary than they send. They could make transfers as long as the player being recalled has a smaller cap hit than the one being sent down or waived. They could also trade for a player with more salary than they are sending out if they were to also send someone down also.
Jul. 12, 2018 at 7:03 p.m.
#24
Grierless Sharks Fan
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Quoting: exo2769
That's just not true....for the 1st cup especially too. People need to give credit to Dale Tallon. I will give Bowman credit for the Handzus trade in 2013. That was HUGE! However...and this is 110% true...His "BIG" acquisition in 2015 was (2) 2nds for Kimo Timmonen who literally played 4 minutes a game in the playoffs. One could argue that he VERY MUCH hurt the team that Trade Deadline.


Yeah, I mentioned he didn't draft everyone.

Wasn't Vermette a big piece in 15? Didn't he draft Saad? Did he trade for Leddy?

I'm just saying. 3 cups is pretty good in terms of success.
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Jul. 13, 2018 at 11:55 a.m.
#25
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Edited Jul. 13, 2018 at 1:01 p.m.
To all of those that can't comprehend how bad this trade was let's compare similar trades in the past where the Coyotes took on a big contract for another team.

Chris Pronger Trade:
To Arizona - Chris Pronger ($7.5M) and Nicklas Grossman ($3.5M)
To Philly - Sam Gagner (3.2) and 3rd round pick.
Grossman, 31, would go on to play 58 games for Arizona on the 3rd pairing and retire the next season. Gagner, 24, coming off a 41 point season would continue to be a point producer in the league and just signed a 3 year $9.5M contract.
Philly got $7.8M in cap space, likely the better player, and a 3rd round pick.

Pavel Datsyuk Trade:
To Arizona - Pavel Datsyuk ($7.5M) and 2016 16th OA.
To Detroit - 2016 20th OA draft pick and 2016 53rd OA draft pick
Detroit got $7.5M in cap space moved down 4 spots in the 1st round AND got the 53rd pick too.

Dave Bolland Trade:
To Arizona - Dave Bolland ($5.5M) and Lawson Crouse.
To Florida - 2018 34th OA and 2017 66th OA.
Florida got $5.5M in cap space but gave up a good prospect in Crouse. However they also got a very very early 2nd round pick and a 3rd round pick.

Marian Hossa Trade:
To Arizona - Marian Hossa ($5.275M), Vinnie Hinostroza ($1.5M), Jordan Oesterle ($.65M), AND 2019 3rd round pick
To Chicago - Marcus Kruger ($2.775M), Mackenzie Entwistle, Jordan Maletta, Andrew Campbell, and 2019 5th Round pick.
Chicago gets $4M in cap space (ignoring Oesterle because he can be completely buried), Marcus Kruger a 4th line center, an OK prospect in Entwistle, an undrafted .26 PPG AHL player, a LEFT HANDED AHL D-man plug (hawks already have 6 AHL LHD D-men under contract), and a 5th round pick.
BUT they gave up a .96 PPG in the AHL and .5 PPG in the NHL player on a $1.5M contract, and a 20+ minute per night D-man on a league minimum contract.
STAN BOWMAN even gave up the HIGHER DRAFT PICK in this trade.

To recap:
Hossa, Hinostroza, Oesterle
Kruger (who we gave up for free and could have had off waivers in may), 5th
 
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