Personally, I'm of the camp that believes he should be dealt as soon as they find the RHD they want. I never thought that I'd be suggesting the Leafs trade Nylander, but the offense is very potent as is and defense is becoming a bigger need than ever.
If I were Kyle Dubas, I'd do one of two things:
1) Trade him to Carolina for one of Pesce or Faulk
2) Trade him for picks/prospects, and then signing Anton Stralman as a UFA.
Option 1 is the safer bet, considering that they can't guarantee they sign Stralman. I'm curious as to what everyone thinks should happen with Nylander.
If I'm Dubas I'd sign him as soon as he will come down to around 7.25M - 7.5M. Even if that is December 1st. Chances are that the team would gain leverage as that date approaches, especially if the offense continues to produce.
I think they can make them all fit under cap next year, and if not they can make a decision later. It doesnt help anyone for Nylander to sit out, and I doubt they'll end up with a fair trade if they go that route - Leafs dont have much leverage as long as Nylander doesnt have a contract and their biggest need (affordable top 4 RHD with term) is a scarcity.
I think you have to sign him first. You just can't have your RFAs, dictating to a team the term and salary of their next contract by signing with another team. What's next, your next group of RFA think they can get a little more money from another so they don't sign with the Leafs.
I really think this RHD is really overblown. Fact is there are fewer competent RHD that LHD, there are just fewer right shooting hockey players. So it's almost inevitable that a left handed dman is playng your right side.
And when would a playoff contending team want to trade a good dmen for a 20 goal scorer Nylander....and certainly why do these other teams offer much more. $$$$ in a contract than the Leafs are offering.
If I'm Dubas I'd sign him as soon as he will come down to around 7.25M - 7.5M. Even if that is December 1st. Chances are that the team would gain leverage as that date approaches, especially if the offense continues to produce.
I think they can make them all fit under cap next year, and if not they can make a decision later. It doesnt help anyone for Nylander to sit out, and I doubt they'll end up with a fair trade if they go that route - Leafs dont have much leverage as long as Nylander doesnt have a contract and their biggest need (affordable top 4 RHD with term) is a scarcity.
Quoting: A_K
If I'm Dubas I'd sign him as soon as he will come down to around 7.25M - 7.5M. Even if that is December 1st. Chances are that the team would gain leverage as that date approaches, especially if the offense continues to produce.
I think they can make them all fit under cap next year, and if not they can make a decision later. It doesnt help anyone for Nylander to sit out, and I doubt they'll end up with a fair trade if they go that route - Leafs dont have much leverage as long as Nylander doesnt have a contract and their biggest need (affordable top 4 RHD with term) is a scarcity.
I think hockey fans are really missing the point with this salary negotiation. Why should be Leafs pay Nylander 7.25 to 7.5m? That puts Nylander in the top 7 RWers in the NHL. He just isn't deserving of that money. So while many folks think it's all about the Leafs fitting in all their players under the cap next year....it isn't. It's about not overpaying players . Overpay Nylander and keep him, you have less money to spend on your other players. Overpay him and trade, you limit you trading partners and eventually you diminish the return for him.
I think hockey fans are really missing the point with this salary negotiation. Why should be Leafs pay Nylander 7.25 to 7.5m? That puts Nylander in the top 7 RWers in the NHL. He just isn't deserving of that money. So while many folks think it's all about the Leafs fitting in all their players under the cap next year....it isn't. It's about not overpaying players . Overpay Nylander and keep him, you have less money to spend on your other players. Overpay him and trade, you limit you trading partners and eventually you diminish the return for him.
What's more concerning to me is the amount of people that think 7.25m is some crazy overpay for 7-8 prime years of Nylander, yet they're already plugging in 9m for Marner's contract... I dont see a huge separation between the two.
What's more concerning to me is the amount of people that think 7.25m is some crazy overpay for 7-8 prime years of Nylander, yet they're already plugging in 9m for Marner's contract... I dont see a huge separation between the two.
Just by their play in last half of 2017/18 season and the first few games of this season, Marner appears to be the better player. But 9m would make him the third highest RWer...I don't think he is that deserving. 7.5m still puts in him the the top 10. If the players wanted long term....I could see 6.5m for Nylander and 7.5m for Marner. Either way both players are coming off their ELCs, no reason why are deserving of near UFA money.
Personally, I'm of the camp that believes he should be dealt as soon as they find the RHD they want. I never thought that I'd be suggesting the Leafs trade Nylander, but the offense is very potent as is and defense is becoming a bigger need than ever.
If I were Kyle Dubas, I'd do one of two things:
1) Trade him to Carolina for one of Pesce or Faulk
2) Trade him for picks/prospects, and then signing Anton Stralman as a UFA.
Option 1 is the safer bet, considering that they can't guarantee they sign Stralman. I'm curious as to what everyone thinks should happen with Nylander.
I agree that they should definitely trade him for a RHD. Ostensibly, Carolina seems like the right trade partner, but adding Justin Faulk seems to be somewhat redundant. Faulk is an offensive Defenseman who is +/- is -83 over the last 4 seasons. TOR already has an excellent PP QB in Morgan Rielly so what does Faulk actually bring to the table? They really need a shutdown D who can play the right side and match up against other team's top line. Maybe Manson or Montour from ANA would be a better fit? What about Spergeon from MIN? The Leafs can always throw in a draft pick and/or prospect to sweeten the pot, as well.
As things stand, there's no possible way for TOR to keep Nylander at over $7M AAV. If Marner and Matthews put up the huge numbers everyone expects, they'll cost $20-$22M AAV combined. The numbers don't work.
Just by their play in last half of 2017/18 season and the first few games of this season, Marner appears to be the better player. But 9m would make him the third highest RWer...I don't think he is that deserving. 7.5m still puts in him the the top 10. If the players wanted long term....I could see 6.5m for Nylander and 7.5m for Marner. Either way both players are coming off their ELCs, no reason why are deserving of near UFA money.
I hear you, but if Marner puts up, let's say, 85 points this season he's gonna ask for the moon. Like I've been saying since last season: The Marleau signing would eventually come back to bite them-Lou should given him 2 years. The 3rd year forces Dubas to cut ties w/ one of the big 3-especially b/c of the Tavares signing. Clearly Lou didn't, nor should've he anticipated Tavares becoming a UFA and landing in TOR.
I hear you, but if Marner puts up, let's say, 85 points this season he's gonna ask for the moon. Like I've been saying since last season: The Marleau signing would eventually come back to bite them-Lou should given him 2 years. The 3rd year forces Dubas to cut ties w/ one of the big 3-especially b/c of the Tavares signing. Clearly Lou didn't, nor should've he anticipated Tavares becoming a UFA and landing in TOR.
Folks really get caught up in "what players want". Especially as RFAs. Haven't the Leafs shown that a silly request (apparently) doesn't lead to a signing. Stats wise Sabres Reinhart wasn't all the much different than Nylander's. Same draft year. He settled for two year bridge at 3.625m per year. You're right the Leafs might have to move one of high priced. forwards due to cap reasons, partly because of signing of Tavares. But so what, that's what you gotta do in cap league. But the Leafs seems to be going the route....as not overpaying their RFAs, which most teams do.
But the forced trading of Nylander because of Tavares shouldn't be looked as problem. The Leafs sign 11m Tavares and are forced to trade 6.5m Nylander for young cheap assets. The other alternative would be to keep Nylander at 6.5 and have another 4.5m for another players(s). So it's not like the Leafs are "losing" a player, they are just exchanging assets, and because Tavares was a UFA, the Leafs in this case are likely better off.
The better the Leafs play without Nylander, the less leverage he has to get the contract he wants. If I'm Carolina, I don't even consider trading anyone on that blue line since it's top five in the league, in my opinion. But if I'm Toronto, I do my best to get Pesce, who is a good top pairing/great second pairing, shutdown, right-handed defenseman.
Folks really get caught up in "what players want". Especially as RFAs. Haven't the Leafs shown that a silly request (apparently) doesn't lead to a signing. Stats wise Sabres Reinhart wasn't all the much different than Nylander's. Same draft year. He settled for two year bridge at 3.625m per year. You're right the Leafs might have to move one of high priced. forwards due to cap reasons, partly because of signing of Tavares. But so what, that's what you gotta do in cap league. But the Leafs seems to be going the route....as not overpaying their RFAs, which most teams do.
But the forced trading of Nylander because of Tavares shouldn't be looked as problem. The Leafs sign 11m Tavares and are forced to trade 6.5m Nylander for young cheap assets. The other alternative would be to keep Nylander at 6.5 and have another 4.5m for another players(s). So it's not like the Leafs are "losing" a player, they are just exchanging assets, and because Tavares was a UFA, the Leafs in this case are likely better off.
Reinhart is a good comp for Nylander, but I have a very difficult time seeing Nylander put up 61 points w/ a mediocre offensive team like BUF. I'm sure that Nylander doesn't wanna wake up one morning and see Marner signed for $9M if he signs for $6M. They also have Kapanen as a top six Forward who's also a pending RFA. He's gonna want a big pay day if he puts up bug numbers on the top line. These are what they call "high class problems"
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