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Marleau and Nylander need to go

Created by: palhal
Team: 2019-20 Toronto Maple Leafs
Initial Creation Date: Feb. 11, 2019
Published: Feb. 11, 2019
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
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Leafs seem to want to pay overpay their RFAs, so Nylander has to go. This post is based upon the assumption that Marleau retires, due to his declining play. Leaf have to trade Nylander with no money coming back for cap reasons. (regardless of return) With some extra cap space, Leafs can extend Johnsson to better contract and sign Jensen.
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    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:08 p.m.
    #1
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    Kappy is worst more then Johnsson, and Nylander is worth more the a 2nd also Marleau will stay with the leafs till he retires
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:10 p.m.
    #2
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    Yet neither of them will.

    Marleau has a full NMC and was assured he wouldn't be traded when he signed.

    Dubas reported assured Nylander that he wouldn't trade him, despite not being eligible for a NTC.
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:12 p.m.
    #3
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    Marleau will stays, NMC!!! But nice try
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:15 p.m.
    #4
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    Quoting: tkecanuck341
    Yet neither of them will.

    Marleau has a full NMC and was assured he wouldn't be traded when he signed.

    Dubas reported assured Nylander that he wouldn't trade him, despite not being eligible for a NTC.


    Marleau only gets traded if he retires., so his cap hit is tradable. If he feels he isn't NHL good anymore, then he just might retire. We don't know know what Dubas said to Nylander in private, but what A GM, coach, or player says at a press conference is meaningless. Likely it was said so the media didn't keep on asking him about the Leafs cap problems for next year.
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:17 p.m.
    #5
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    Quoting: yanp007
    Marleau will stays, NMC!!! But nice try


    Try reading. His cap hit can be traded if he retires. I noted that in my comments.
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:18 p.m.
    #6
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    Quoting: Rylee92
    Kappy is worst more then Johnsson, and Nylander is worth more the a 2nd also Marleau will stay with the leafs till he retires


    Didn't I say that the trade only happens if Marleau retires?
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:20 p.m.
    #7
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    Quoting: palhal
    Marleau only gets traded if he retires., so his cap hit is tradable. If he feels he isn't NHL good anymore, then he just might retire. We don't know know what Dubas said to Nylander in private, but what A GM, coach, or player says at a press conference is meaningless. Likely it was said so the media didn't keep on asking him about the Leafs cap problems for next year.


    Why would he retire early? It's not like he has a Hossa-esque contract which drops to $1M or less in the final few seasons. He's due $4.5M next season. If he retires early, he gives up that money.
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:21 p.m.
    #8
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    Quoting: tkecanuck341
    Why would he retire early? It's not like he has a Hossa-esque contract which drops to $1M or less in the final few seasons. He's due $4.5M next season. If he retires early, he gives up that money.


    After July 1st he is due 1.5m.
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:23 p.m.
    #9
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    @palhal is there a trade scenario you would be interested in for Spurgeon ($2mil retained) and Zucker? I will take Marleau's contract off your hands if he either retires, or waives to come to MN. Otherwise, I want one of Nylander or Kapanen, and Zaitzev. What else would be needed from either side in your opinion? Trade can be Spurgeon and/or Zucker, +/-


    How's fishin?
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:27 p.m.
    #10
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    Quoting: palhal
    Try reading. His cap hit can be traded if he retires. I noted that in my comments.


    Yeah but why would he retire? "his declining play" seems like a reason you have for him to retire, not one that he has.

    Also I'd much rather have Nylander for a cap hit under 7 than Marner over 11. You have to consider Nylander for that much cheaper means that you get one of Johnsson or Kapanen "free" compared to if you're keeping Marner.

    Regardless the obvious one to go should be Zaitsev. The fact that it is Dermott's and Gardiner's playtime that have been reduced since the arrival of Muzzin says that Babcock can't use one of the league's worst defenders in an apropriate role. When choosing between a guy that is hardly 3rd pairing material - and a literal top 20 winger, that is 22 years old and making just 2m and change more, you're creating a problem that shouldn't exist.
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:38 p.m.
    #11
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    Quoting: MNBassman
    @palhal is there a trade scenario you would be interested in for Spurgeon ($2mil retained) and Zucker? I will take Marleau's contract off your hands if he either retires, or waives to come to MN. Otherwise, I want one of Nylander or Kapanen, and Zaitzev. What else would be needed from either side in your opinion?


    How's fishin?


    Important things first. I haven't been ice fishing. The ice huts have been out for three weeks. It's been cold for a month now and and few truly blizzard days. Might just wait to May for pickeral a.k.a walleye.

    My post was really to show the Leafs cap situation. Marleau wouldn't accept a trade if he was to play, but if he retires, his cap of 6.25m can be traded. I don't think the Leafs would have traded for 4m Muzzin unless they never that Marleau was going to retire next summer after he receives his bonus. The only reason he retires is due to his declining play. It's really dropped off since last year. So any team that has the cap space will gladly taken on Marleau 6.25m cap hit with a sweetener.
    Then the Leafs still need some cap space, hence my posted the trade for Nylander for picks. But a Spurgeon trade with retention and futures would do nicely ...but not a cap hit like Zucker.
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    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:46 p.m.
    #12
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    Quoting: MelonVK
    Yeah but why would he retire? "his declining play" seems like a reason you have for him to retire, not one that he has.

    Also I'd much rather have Nylander for a cap hit under 7 than Marner over 11. You have to consider Nylander for that much cheaper means that you get one of Johnsson or Kapanen "free" compared to if you're keeping Marner.

    Regardless the obvious one to go should be Zaitsev. The fact that it is Dermott's and Gardiner's playtime that have been reduced since the arrival of Muzzin says that Babcock can't use one of the league's worst defenders in an apropriate role. When choosing between a guy that is hardly 3rd pairing material - and a literal top 20 winger, that is 22 years old and making just 2m and change more, you're creating a problem that shouldn't exist.


    Again just an assumption of my part that Marleau retires. His motivation is the he is not NHL good, and wouldn't be seeing the ice next year as Leaf. I don't think Dubas would have traded for 4m Muzzin unless he knew he could jettison Marleau's cap.
    You made a good point about Marner. And that certainly Marner would get a sweet return, plus some additional cap space.
    I find most these Zaitsev trades impractical. If Zaitsev is of negative value that so many think he would be impossible to trade a 4.5m X 5 contract.... And it's not like it's LTIR...it's real money. Plus then the Leafs would have to fill RHD with extremely cheap players which may not be practical either.
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:50 p.m.
    #13
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    Quoting: palhal
    After July 1st he is due 1.5m.


    That's $1.5M that he won't get if he retires.
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:50 p.m.
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    Quoting: palhal
    Important things first. I haven't been ice fishing. The ice huts have been out for three weeks. It's been cold for a month now and and few truly blizzard days. Might just wait to May for pickeral a.k.a walleye.

    My post was really to show the Leafs cap situation. Marleau wouldn't accept a trade if he was to play, but if he retires, his cap of 6.25m can be traded. I don't think the Leafs would have traded for 4m Muzzin unless they never that Marleau was going to retire next summer after he receives his bonus. The only reason he retires is due to his declining play. It's really dropped off since last year. So any team that has the cap space will gladly taken on Marleau 6.25m cap hit with a sweetener.
    Then the Leafs still need some cap space, hence my posted the trade for Nylander for picks. But a Spurgeon trade with retention and futures would do nicely ...but not a cap hit like Zucker.


    I've been ice fishing a few times this winter. I am one of 8 hockey dads who own a shack together. So far, we have found a lot of spots that don't hold walleyes...

    As for the Spurgeon and futures idea...sadly, the Wild have almost no futures to trade. What would you part with for just Spurgeon and $2 mil retained?
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    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:51 p.m.
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    Quoting: palhal
    Again just an assumption of my part that Marleau retires. His motivation is the he is not NHL good, and wouldn't be seeing the ice next year as Leaf. I don't think Dubas would have traded for 4m Muzzin unless he knew he could jettison Marleau's cap.
    You made a good point about Marner. And that certainly Marner would get a sweet return, plus some additional cap space.
    I find most these Zaitsev trades impractical. If Zaitsev is of negative value that so many think he would be impossible to trade a 4.5m X 5 contract.... And it's not like it's LTIR...it's real money. Plus then the Leafs would have to fill RHD with extremely cheap players which may not be practical either.


    Alright, that's fair then. I think the point about Zaitsev is that this perception hasn't caught up to everyone around the league. And if you can sell low on Nylander I think you're better off taking a hit in losing/trading down a pick to get rid of Zaitsev is all
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:56 p.m.
    #16
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    Quoting: tkecanuck341
    That's $1.5M that he won't get if he retires.


    True, but he's made 49m during his career It's his decision obviously. Datsyuk left retire 7m owing, minus what he made playing in the KHL.
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 2:59 p.m.
    #17
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    Quoting: MNBassman
    I've been ice fishing a few times this winter. I am one of 8 hockey dads who own a shack together. So far, we have found a lot of spots that don't hold walleyes...

    As for the Spurgeon and futures idea...sadly, the Wild have almost no futures to trade. What would you part with for just Spurgeon and $2 mil retained?[/quote

    I think Nylander and his five full years is worth more than one year of Spurgeon....but if the Leafs are desperate and that's the best offer....think the Leaf would do it. PS, could you get Spurgeon scoring some points. I have him in my hockey pool.]
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 3:01 p.m.
    #18
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    Quoting: palhal


    He's been scoring pretty regularly since Dumba went down.
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 3:01 p.m.
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    Quoting: tkecanuck341
    That's $1.5M that he won't get if he retires.


    That's true. But Marleau has banked, like, close to $100M over his career.. as crazy as it sounds to peasants like us, 1.5M probably isn't a massive consideration. It's all relative, and comparable to the importance of the $1.25 in my pocket right now when weighted against what I've made in my life... which is pretty meager ;(
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 3:02 p.m.
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    Quoting: palhal
    True, but he's made 49m during his career It's his decision obviously. Datsyuk left retire 7m owing, minus what he made playing in the KHL.


    49M? I think its well north of that.. but, either way, we're talking a different reality here related to decision making than the ones that most of us work with..
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 3:02 p.m.
    #21
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    Quoting: palhal
    True, but he's made 49m during his career It's his decision obviously. Datsyuk left retire 7m owing, minus what he made playing in the KHL.


    Datsyuk left $5.5M on the table in Detroit to go home to Russia and pull in an annual salary of $3.9M in the KHL. Marleau is from Canada. He's not going to bolt to a European league. He's not going to just hang up the skates before he's ready to retire either.

    The Leafs are stuck with Marleau until his contract expires.
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 3:04 p.m.
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    Quoting: MelonVK
    Alright, that's fair then. I think the point about Zaitsev is that this perception hasn't caught up to everyone around the league. And if you can sell low on Nylander I think you're better off taking a hit in losing/trading down a pick to get rid of Zaitsev is all


    Actually I'm not as down on Zaitsev as many people. Babcock trusts him to play big on the PK. For some reason his puck handling this season has a been awful, until the last few games. If he regains his confidence and skill with the puck, he'll be a big asset. During the summer he goes to Russian and spends a lot of energy on his fitness. Wish he stayed in Toronto and under Leaf coaching work on his hockey skills more. Same with Nylander, don't have him go to Sweden all summer. Have him back in Toronto working on hockey .
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 3:06 p.m.
    #23
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    Quoting: tkecanuck341
    Datsyuk left $5.5M on the table in Detroit to go home to Russia and pull in an annual salary of $3.9M in the KHL. Marleau is from Canada. He's not going to bolt to a European league. He's not going to just hang up the skates before he's ready to retire either.

    The Leafs are stuck with Marleau until his contract expires.


    That's true *2. But he might hang them up to take a job within the leafs org and succession his career and keep himself involved... and paid. either way, Marleau holds all the cards here, and like Pal points out the Muzzin add combined with this magic 6M fix of next years cap crunch seems like fair speculation
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 3:06 p.m.
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    Quoting: tkecanuck341
    Datsyuk left $5.5M on the table in Detroit to go home to Russia and pull in an annual salary of $3.9M in the KHL. Marleau is from Canada. He's not going to bolt to a European league. He's not going to just hang up the skates before he's ready to retire either.

    The Leafs are stuck with Marleau until his contract expires.


    Quoting: palhal
    Actually I'm not as down on Zaitsev as many people. Babcock trusts him to play big on the PK. For some reason his puck handling this season has a been awful, until the last few games. If he regains his confidence and skill with the puck, he'll be a big asset. During the summer he goes to Russian and spends a lot of energy on his fitness. Wish he stayed in Toronto and under Leaf coaching work on his hockey skills more. Same with Nylander, don't have him go to Sweden all summer. Have him back in Toronto working on hockey .
    Feb. 11, 2019 at 3:11 p.m.
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    Quoting: tkecanuck341
    Datsyuk left $5.5M on the table in Detroit to go home to Russia and pull in an annual salary of $3.9M in the KHL. Marleau is from Canada. He's not going to bolt to a European league. He's not going to just hang up the skates before he's ready to retire either.

    The Leafs are stuck with Marleau until his contract expires.


    " He's not going to just hang up the skates before he's ready to retire either." Thanks for agreeing with me. That's exactly what I'm saying. Marleau will decide when he wants to retire. I just gave the option...and it's logical one that he might retire July 2. If he retires during the summer, his 6.25m unpaid cap hit is certainly tradable.
     
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