This looks like cap circumvention to me, I think the league would step in and stop this.

Yep.

Lol it's definitely a grey area but I don't think the league can do anything. There isn't an explicitly written rule against trading a player back and forth.

That being said, i can see this trade triggering a rule change lol

What's the difference with Washington trading Orpik to Colorado for them to buy him out so that they can sign him at a cheaper cap hit??

Big difference in the fact that the Caps didn't specifically do this to bring Orpik back. Also, Orpik could have signed with any team he wanted after being bought out (other than the Avs), he just so happened to prefer playing for the Caps. The Caps also took a diminished value for Grubauer coming off of a really good season. I believe CAR was offering a 1st for him.

COL was also trying to trade Orpik prior to buying him out, so it wasn't a straight "hey, we'll trade you Grubauer if you take Orpik, buy him out, and we'll sign him again"

Don't be Naive.

1) Everyone knew that Colorado was going to buy him out;
2) Everyone knew that Orpiks wanted to play in Washington;

DO you REALLY think Washington never thought Orpik would become available ???

What if you spread the Lucic trade a couple of weeks? And Lucic was full NMC so technically he can choose where we want to go as well. It's essentially the same scenario

Not being naive - that's why I said it wasn't a straight "buy out Orpik so we can sign him again". The NHL cleared this trade and determined no cap circumvention. It was back-alley enough that it didn't generate enough clear "collusion". This trade would be clear collusion and cap circumvention.

Colorado didnt trade him right back before the season started with retained salary. He was a UFA and free to sign anywhere

I Edited my answer.

1) Lucic has a full NMC and can choose to go anywhere
2) What if the trade was spread-out a couple of weeks ?

Wasn't Orpik bought out? If Otttawa buys out Lucic and then Lucic signs with the Oilers again, i think technically that is ok. Even though I have a feeling the NHL might have only "allowed" the Orpik deal because he was an over 35+ vet and the Caps just came off a cup, etc. By most people opinion it was cap circumvention even though there is no clause in the CBA against it specifically.

The league guarantees steps in and stops a trade back to Edmonton at half retained salary. It's clear circumvention (not to mention that I don't think Edmonton would want him back).

The difference is exactly what's been said. Orpik has the chance to sign anywhere and could've signed somewhere for more. Washington didn't make it obvious that it was clearly their intent to sign Orpik again, but it was their intent to move his salary to free up space. Something like that had never been done before in the cap era. Now that it has, once the league sees its even possible for it to happen again they'll stop it. They'd probably stop it if it was still just Lucic and a 1st for the 2nd, then Ottawa fully bought out Lucic, and Lucic tried to sign as a free agent in Edmonton again. The league is dumb. They're not insane though. They're high paid lawyers for a reason. They can see when something similar would happen again

I think all you guys are missing the point. The Oilers don't want Lucic either lol.

If Lucic really wants out of Edmonton badly enough to waive his NMC with the agreement that it wouldn't be reinstated by Ottawa to avoid him taking up a protection spot come expansion draft time then I think 2 mill retained by the Oilers, then 2 mill retained by the Sens and then a trade to a team willing to give him a fresh start at 2 mill is the only way to move him without EDM having to give away the farm to move him. A lot of moving pieces and again all comes down to Lucic, that's why giving out full NMC is just bad management.

Edmonton would propose the first trade and say "suuuuuuuuuuuuure, we'll take back Lucic at half retained if you take him from us." They'd file the paperwork to make Lucic a Senator, then Keith Gretzky would block Dorion's phone number. "Hehehe, sucker."

WHERE IS Lucic? Can't see him on the 1st line.

I understand that it's not ethical or moral! That's not what I am arguing. I am saying legally, there is not much they can do until they add a clause to the CBA. There have been a lot of immoral actions done in the past, that still play in the impact in today's NHL (e.g. Weber's contract). And by allowing Orpik to sign with the caps, they have set a dangerous president which I am sure they'll address before the 2020-2021 season. And don't give me the "Orpik was a FA, it's his right to go where ever he wants". Lucic is essentially a FA with his NMC.

Now, do you really think the league steps in if this trade gets done over the summer? No wayyyy. Yeah maybe the Sens and Oilers camouflage it a little better by adding other players and spreading the transaction over an extensive period of time. They're also wouldn't be any written agreements done beforehand, therefore, everything would have to be done in good faith. But at the end of the day, financially, it's in the league best interest to give McDavid the best chance to win. Fans don't want to see the best player in the world miss the playoffs year in, year out.

And what is the difference with this and a 3-way trade (e.g. the Brassard trade from OTT-LGK-PITS)?

Either way, I was just playing around since everyone on here thinks Lucic is coming to Ottawa for some reason. I personally don't think Lucic is moveable.

I would lose it!!! if that happened

I agree that this is the most likely scenerio

Hopefully in the Minors

Lol. You're forgetting the the league declines the first 3 way trade between Ottawa, Pittsburgh and Vegas for very similar reasons

OK but we can't just assume all chaos is plausible now either...... But who knows maybe the NHL wouldn't do anything. No one knows until you try except you don't want to be the one team that didn't get away with it because you'll be slapped with the biggest fines....

Because nothing was going back to Vegas from Ottawa, who ended up sending a 4th liner AHL player. They amended the trade and it went through?

I clearly said that EDM and OTT would have to camouflage it a little better

Lol true true...

Melnyk can't afford big fines right now

They wouldn't be able to "camouflage" it a little. The league has seen this before and knows it's circumvention. They deny it and have legal grounds to do it.

Unwritten rules don't qualify as "legal grounds"