Quoting: Copenhagen
One of the worst trades ever, 2 cap dumps for a fantastic D
Exactly!
Quoting: awatt
For someone living in anaheim, you should know Eaves isn't playing anymore either. If you want Marleau traded, Kapanen will also be added to the trade. This isn't helping anaheim with the rebuild at all either.
Even adding Kapanen wouldn't be enough. We'd be losing our only RD to add a RW. We're stacked on the RW. It's just a terrible trade all-around and doesn't take into consideration our needs.
Quoting: Ryminister_27
I agree that this isn't the kind of offer that would get Manson, but to say that Manson is a "fantastic d-man" or that Toronto needs to "add a lot more than a 1st round pick" are both completely false.
Manson's a slightly above average 2nd pairing d-man which is far from fantastic.
& with how strong of a draft that 2020 is expected to be, a 1st in that draft might be more valuable alone than Manson.
But yet again, a player falls into the "right handed d-man that Toronto is interested in" and therefore is frequently highly overrated. Another classic example.
I agree with your assessment of Manson. I think he tends to get overrated because of "advanced stats". At his best, he's a gritty, borderline #2 willing to make hits and fight if called upon. However, more often than not, he's an inconsistent 2nd pairing D-man. He'll still make those hits and fight if necessary, but he's prone to mistakes.
However, I think what makes Manson so attractive is that he's a RD with a rare skillset (size, willing to fight and hit, mobility) and on a beauty of a contract. Not many teams have a player that does what Manson does. He's very valuable asset. I agree he often gets talked about as if he's an out-and-out top pairing D-man. He's not, but he's worth more than 2 cap dumps and late 2nd round pick. Given that he's our only RD, I don't think I'd trade him for anyone realistically available in TOR and I certainly wouldn't move him for a package.
Quoting: Ryminister_27
Did you not read anything that I posted? .. just cause it's a late 1st doesn't mean as much when it's a very strong draft. The 2020 draft will be very similar to the 2015 draft. Top line potential players and current top line players even went in the 2nd round of that draft.. a late 1st round pick in 2020 had substantial value actually. & there's also no guarantees that it's a later pick right now. Depends how Toronto does next season.
The position of a 1st does matter to some degree. Regardless, would you trade your only RD and a player with a skillset that is very hard to replace for 2 cap dumps and 1st round pick next year? Forget the cap dumps, I wouldn't do it for the 1st alone.
The offer is quite frankly ridiculous and doesn't consider our team needs at all.