and there are absolutely no bonuses.. wow that's a steal

Good point. There’s a number of factors that go into choosing a place to play - and a place to live.

In addition to being from the area, I think many players choose quality of life for themselves and their family. They look at things like climate, quality of schools, culture, transportation and traffic, crime and safety, and health and health care. And of course taxation. There’s a number of different metrics to evaluate these but in general the top destinations mentioned above tend to be higher on those lists.

Another thing to consider is that in Toronto (and the rest of Canada) there is universal single-payer health care which lets employees and employers keep a big chunk of change that they would otherwise have to spend on health insurance (yes, drugs are not covered tho that’s a big debate nationally right now).

https://www.capfriendly.com/post_tax_calculator

Why don't you give it a shot

Maybe go up to six mil but otherwise good signing

I voted yes

This is a great signing. They got Karlsson to take less money so he could stay all 8 years. It will help them with their cap trouble as well

Vegas is a bad example. Try going to a game in Vegas and realizing the high ticket prices and they pack the stadium. Vegas merchandise is flying off the shelves too. I'm betting Vegas revenues are top 10 in the league right so they have the money is my guess. Comparing Florida to a big market team and you are right.

Not really, and the owner also just made a huge investment that he expects some return on. Like it's not that it doesn't apply to Vegas more or less than any other club, it's that club's like Toronto still has massive advantages even without considering stuff like staff, scouting, academies etc. When Anaheim is good they're doing just fine, it's when they're not good - an almost ineviteble destiny for most teams, that they struggle with money in basically all ways. You can point to Vegas *right now*, but you might not be able to in 3 years, and that's the difference from a team like NYR or Toronto that has a constant stack of cash available

If you are going to have a salary cap, the raw numbers should come out equal after tax. Yes, other cities have other advatages which players take into consideration, but none so much as take home $ after tax. This is the only thing a salary cap is supposed to make fair.

And while i get the sentiment that teams like Ottawa and Winnipeg get hurt the most, a cap in general hurts large market teams more, if there wasn't one while the leafs have been willing to spend you don't think McDavid wouldn't be in the blue and white, and likely Stamkos, Tavares, etc.

So if they are giving this opportunity up for parity in the league at the very least it should be applied fairly.

"On State income tax: Karlsson is bringing home the exact same money on a $5.9M deal in Vegas, as he would an $8M deal in Toronto"





Wow ... you directed me to a tax calculator that makes 1 calculation ... amazing!

But in reality ... taxes are complicated.

There is a North American tax treaty that can be utilized by American athletes who are playing a pro-sport in Canada.

But Karlsson is Swedish!?! Correct, but he's been living in the America & paying US income taxes for 5-6 years (long enough to qualify).

The treaty allows them to continue paying income tax through their home state (home state = any state they choose, as long as they own a home there & visit once a year).

It's also be smart for them to rent a house/apartment while living in Canada, rather than buy (to avoid any complications).

End result = Karlsson could continue paying Vegas tax rates on his Torontlo Maple Leaf income.

How do I know this? John Tavares is a client of the accounting firm I work at ... John Tavares is Canadian ... John Tavares pays Florida income tax rates.

Awesome calculator though brotha!

Hard to predict what you are saying in Vegas when it's one of the largest destination places worldwide and filled with snowbirds during the winter. Comparing this to other teams is difficult to do...it's not like we are talking about Carolina being good for a few years. I'm well aware of what you are saying, Chicago is the 3rd richest franchise in the NHL and has the all time record for the most soldout games and attendance in the league.

However, that's not true for US players and residents though just to be clear. The domicile rule for US players and US residents does not apply to their NHL salary, only investment and endorsement income and other incomes outside of their team salary. The treaty you are referring to is specific for US pro athletes who are residents operating in another country and how the US collects income taxes. I don't know the specifics on each country though.

"Establishing domicile in a low- or no-tax state can save an athlete thousands in taxes by sheltering their endorsement and investment income in a lower tax jurisdiction than where their team is located."
https://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenhausen/2017/04/18/income-taxes-for-pro-athletes-are-reminder-of-how-complicated-u-s-tax-code/#12a0771f411e

Yeah but what I'm saying is if you're implementing a system to make it more fair, then you should recognize other factors and not go "yeah but the cap is there to solve *this* problem". And also no, 50 million over 5 years with 25 in the first year is more than 60 over 5 years with 15 in the first year. That extra early money get's ROI over the rest of the contract, which the money on the back end doesn't

Is the calculator 100% accurate, absolutely not.

Tavares can not own real estate or rent on 12 month lease in Toronto, otherwise he will have to pay Canadian taxes.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/seanpackard/2018/07/06/john-tavares-could-save-nearly-12-million-in-taxes-on-his-new-contract/#6e7a26681ab7

And he bought a $3.6 million home in Toronto at the beginning of the season.

https://canadanewsmedia.ca/2018/10/09/leafs-john-tavares-buys-toronto-home/

So, please tell me how Tavares is your client paying Florida taxes, brotha.

Is it listed as his principle residence for tax returns?

Ideally this is true, but there is risk involved with this as well. If there is no risk they are making a minimal return or would need to lock it in.

The question is do you want 50M with the potential to earn 60M or more, or would you prefer 60M guarenteed, and without tax on the gains you could've made on 50M.

It should just be even across the board so that there isn't a need for tax havens, front loading, etc.

Well even with my very limited experience in economics I think not turning a profit of 15-20% on that kind of money is hard.

I don't even think most players invest all their money for return right away, as they'd rather buy a nice house etc for starters. That's also an investment over time, but it improves their life quality by a tangible margin.

I see this point, but at the same time: Health care is free in Canada, I'm sure the schooling costs differently etc. The actual purpose of the taxes still apply in that area, so the players benefit from it as well. You could make a super advanced calculation for this - and maybe it's the right move, but I feel like we'd just turn to argue about who has the worst life quality and therefore deserve the highest cap as a new point of discussion.

I'm a EU citizen, so there's a bunch of stuff I don't know the exacts of, but I'm sure you get my point

Likely the last positive move Vegas will make as a franchise until they fire Gallant, GM:GM, and Reaves ... He is their Jeff Carter, he can play PK/PP, is the best player on Vegas or least top 3-5... I figured he would cost 5-6M a year, anything below 6M is pretty good given contracts people are signing these days... Vegas wont make playoffs until they replace the trash running the organization thinking RD means they are not a right shot D like idiots listing players on here... IF you shoot left, you are a left D not a RD... You can play RD but its pretty clear its a mistake even BAbcock will talk about it in clips... Wild Bill is probably my favorite player on team or easily top 3 especially after they traded best D-man Miller for trash...