Forums/Armchair-GM

Dear everybody trading for Laine

Created by: capfriendlyaccount
Initial Creation Date: Sep 17, 2019
Published: Sep 17 at 8:16 pm
Team: 2019-20 Custom Team
Team Explanation
You would have to give us a package worth more than four firsts.
Think about it, it should cost more than an offersheet because you are guarunteed his rights. You can't just give us the offersheet value because if we were content with that we could just wait for a big offersheet and not match. But here's the other thing, an offersheet is so unlikely to go through. To make an attempt successful you would have to: a) give him a contract Winnipeg wouldn't match and b) (here's the important part) get him to sign it. The likelihood of that happening is very low, and is getting lower each day as new contracts are decreasing the total cap space available around the league meaning there's less teams able to help free up space so you can make this offer.
Plus him resigning was always the most likely scenario anyways. So to acquire him through trade you would need to pony up either a monster package, or a young playmaking 2C that is 1C caliber/top 4 RHD (think number 3 at least) signed for term on a good deal.
(Deep breath)
But on another note, have a good day guys! 🙂
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES BONUSESCAP SPACE
11$81,500,000$42,762,878$0$3,750,000$38,737,122
Left WingCenterRight Wing
SJS
Thornton, Joe
$2,000,000
C
NMC
UFA - 1
ARI
Hossa, Marián
$5,275,000
RW
NMC
UFA - 2
DET
Zetterberg, Henrik
$6,083,333
C
UFA - 2
DET
Franzen, Johan
$3,954,545
RW, LW
UFA - 1
OTT
Gáborík, Marián
$4,875,000
RW
UFA - 2
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
BOS
Chara, Zdeno
$2,000,000
LD
NMC
UFA - 1
ANA
Miller, Ryan
$1,125,000
G
NTC
UFA - 1
OTT
Hainsey, Ron
$3,500,000
RD
NTC
UFA - 1
OTT
Anderson, Craig
$4,750,000
G
NTC
UFA - 1
VGK
Engelland, Deryk
$700,000
RD
UFA - 1
NYR
Lundqvist, Henrik
$8,500,000
G
NMC
UFA - 2

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Sep 17 at 8:31
#1
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 150
Likes: 8
what if the offer included taking some dead weight contract/
Sep 17 at 8:37
#2
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 817
Likes: 203
You seem to fail to understand that Laine is only available in a trade if he can't be re-signed by WPG i.e. he doesn't want to play for you and/or he's too expensive and you can't get him under cap. In both cases, Laine's value drops. If WPG wants Laine, Laine wants to play in WPG and WPG can get him under the cap, there is no deal to be had. All the proposed trades for Laine are assuming the former i.e. Laine is available.
Eli liked this.
Sep 17 at 8:54
#3
Who adds what?
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 9,331
Likes: 1,572
For Columbus or Montreal to trade for Laine, with cap space to match most offers, but without any reason to believe he's worth 12M if the other somehow offer sheets him to that, the offer sheet compensation of four first round picks is the maximum they should consider trading for an un-signed Laine, because that could be all they end up with if they can't sign him before some other team offersheets him.

For teams without extra cap space, the most they should trade is the compensation for the lowest offer sheet they can't match. For instance, a Winnipeg fan commented the other day that they'd trade Laine for John Carlson. I laughed it off at first. Tonight I tried to build a Caps team to see if/how that could work for Washington. I was able to clear cap space to offer Laine an 8M AAV. If an offersheet comes in at 9M, then, I'd have to either make more trades at a loss, to match, or take two 1sts, a 2nd, and a 3rd, and call that a good enough return for seven years of John Carlson, who could fetch that as a rental.

RFA might seem pretty cool to Winnipeg, when they imagine getting four first picks from a struggling team for a guy they don't even really need, since Connor is good enough at 1L, but trading for an RFA can be a real liability in a summer that has reportedly seen two pretty big offersheets written, already. Does that make sense? Might have to work out an NBA-style sign-and-trade to move Laine to some teams. I know they don't typically happen in the NHL, but neither did offer sheets until pretty recently. Things change, even in hockey.
tsyls liked this.
Sep 17 at 9:02
#4
Thread Starter
GoJetsGo
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 500
Likes: 127
Quoting: Rocket88
what if the offer included taking some dead weight contract/


Honestly shouldn't make it that much less. If the Jets trade Laine they won't likely need the space anyway.
Sep 17 at 9:12
#5
Thread Starter
GoJetsGo
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 500
Likes: 127
Quoting: mytduxfan
You seem to fail to understand that Laine is only available in a trade if he can't be re-signed by WPG i.e. he doesn't want to play for you and/or he's too expensive and you can't get him under cap. In both cases, Laine's value drops. If WPG wants Laine, Laine wants to play in WPG and WPG can get him under the cap, there is no deal to be had. All the proposed trades for Laine are assuming the former i.e. Laine is available.


Even if he doesn't want to play, the Jets wouldn't have to trade him since they'd still own his rights. Plus if we played our cards right we should still be able to get a bridge done closer to the November deadline. Then you try to convince him to stay long term, and if that doesn't work you start listening to offers. He's still four years away from UFA. There's no need to rush.
mytduxfan liked this.
Sep 17 at 9:13
#6
get off my lawn...
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 10,198
Likes: 4,814
Why would they give up that when they could OS him for two 1st’s a 2nd and a 3rd?
Sep 17 at 9:20
#7
Thread Starter
GoJetsGo
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 500
Likes: 127
Quoting: Jamiepo
Why would they give up that when they could OS him for two 1st’s a 2nd and a 3rd?


Please reread the description. I listed all the reasons there why they wouldn't.
Sep 17 at 9:33
#8
Jet69
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 321
Likes: 91
Quoting: mytduxfan
You seem to fail to understand that Laine is only available in a trade if he can't be re-signed by WPG i.e. he doesn't want to play for you and/or he's too expensive and you can't get him under cap. In both cases, Laine's value drops. If WPG wants Laine, Laine wants to play in WPG and WPG can get him under the cap, there is no deal to be had. All the proposed trades for Laine are assuming the former i.e. Laine is available.


Agree. As a Jets fan, I want to keep Laine but if he’s got to be moved I would rather it be through a trade of either T6C or T4 RHD and then a combo of either prospect/picks depending on who the trade partner is and where those picks would fall as well as where the prospects development is.
Offer sheets get talked about but there are so many considerations to think about. What’s more valuable? A Detroit OS of 1/2/3/1. 2 potential top 5 picks in very good draft years and an early 2/3? Or say an OS of 4/1sts from day Carolina? 4 1st scattered over potentially 5 years that are probably in the 20-30 range!
I probably don’t match Detroit’s while matching Carolina’s. Now obviously this is all fantasy and innuendo but things to consider!
Sep 17 at 9:33
#9
Thread Starter
GoJetsGo
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 500
Likes: 127
Quoting: Eli
For Columbus or Montreal to trade for Laine, with cap space to match most offers, but without any reason to believe he's worth 12M if the other somehow offer sheets him to that, the offer sheet compensation of four first round picks is the maximum they should consider trading for an un-signed Laine, because that could be all they end up with if they can't sign him before some other team offersheets him.

For teams without extra cap space, the most they should trade is the compensation for the lowest offer sheet they can't match. For instance, a Winnipeg fan commented the other day that they'd trade Laine for John Carlson. I laughed it off at first. Tonight I tried to build a Caps team to see if/how that could work for Washington. I was able to clear cap space to offer Laine an 8M AAV. If an offersheet comes in at 9M, then, I'd have to either make more trades at a loss, to match, or take two 1sts, a 2nd, and a 3rd, and call that a good enough return for seven years of John Carlson, who could fetch that as a rental.

RFA might seem pretty cool to Winnipeg, when they imagine getting four first picks from a struggling team for a guy they don't even really need, since Connor is good enough at 1L, but trading for an RFA can be a real liability in a summer that has reportedly seen two pretty big offersheets written, already. Does that make sense? Might have to work out an NBA-style sign-and-trade to move Laine to some teams. I know they don't typically happen in the NHL, but neither did offer sheets until pretty recently. Things change, even in hockey.


Two big offersheets? Aho and who?
The threat of an offersheet is not nearly as big as you're making it out to be. There's three teams right now that could actually give him a serious offersheet without needing to clear space first. That's the Sens (rebuilding) the Avs ( Rantanen) and the Jackets (could do). Then below that there's four teams that could a) conceivably make the space to offersheet him and b) be okay with giving up the picks required. The two biggest threats there would be Montreal and the Islanders. And then there's still no guarantee he would sign their offer. So any acquiring team wouldn't really be worried about him getting poached via offersheet.
Sep 17 at 10:02
#10
Who adds what?
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 9,331
Likes: 1,572
Quoting: capfriendlyaccount
Two big offersheets? Aho and who?
The threat of an offersheet is not nearly as big as you're making it out to be.


Okay... so I looked it up and the best I can get from reliable sources is that the Blue Jackets reportedly made their best offer to Marner's agent verbally, and never got around to typing up a contract because they believed Toronto would match it. https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/close-blue-jackets-come-offer-sheeting-mitch-marner/ So it could just be an agent, agenting. Like, the Marner offersheet now sounds like the girlfriend-in-Canada of offersheets.

Quoting: capfriendlyaccount
There's three teams right now that could actually give him a serious offersheet without needing to clear space first. That's the Sens (rebuilding) the Avs ( Rantanen) and the Jackets (could do). Then below that there's four teams that could a) conceivably make the space to offersheet him and b) be okay with giving up the picks required. The two biggest threats there would be Montreal and the Islanders. And then there's still no guarantee he would sign their offer. So any acquiring team wouldn't really be worried about him getting poached via offersheet.


I mean, as a Caps fan, knowing that the only team to really worry about making an offersheet is the division rival your team knocked out in the first round in 2018, who may or may not have already tried to offersheet someone this summer? That's not comforting. Maybe for Montreal it is totally comforting, but I'm back to thinking the Caps would only trade for Laine if he signs at the same time, as a condition of the trade. No contract=no trade.
capfriendlyaccount liked this.
Sep 17 at 10:26
#11
Thread Starter
GoJetsGo
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 500
Likes: 127
Quoting: Eli
Okay... so I looked it up and the best I can get from reliable sources is that the Blue Jackets reportedly made their best offer to Marner's agent verbally, and never got around to typing up a contract because they believed Toronto would match it. https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/close-blue-jackets-come-offer-sheeting-mitch-marner/ So it could just be an agent, agenting. Like, the Marner offersheet now sounds like the girlfriend-in-Canada of offersheets.



I mean, as a Caps fan, knowing that the only team to really worry about making an offersheet is the division rival your team knocked out in the first round in 2018, who may or may not have already tried to offersheet someone this summer? That's not comforting. Maybe for Montreal it is totally comforting, but I'm back to thinking the Caps would only trade for Laine if he signs at the same time, as a condition of the trade. No contract=no trade.


Marner did say he got offers from multiple teams outside of the Leafs, so teams do have interest.
Historically players have wanted out of Columbus though, not into it, since they want more publicity and a bigger city/nicer place to live. So that would lower the chances of him signing there.
And letting teams negotiate with Laine would absolutely be a possiblity if needed. I think the Caps aren't likely to trade for Laine anyways, but contract status being up in the air shouldn't derail everything.
Eli liked this.
Sep 17 at 11:23
#12
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 817
Likes: 203
Quoting: capfriendlyaccount
Even if he doesn't want to play, the Jets wouldn't have to trade him since they'd still own his rights. Plus if we played our cards right we should still be able to get a bridge done closer to the November deadline. Then you try to convince him to stay long term, and if that doesn't work you start listening to offers. He's still four years away from UFA. There's no need to rush.


Very true, but what’s the point of keeping a player who doesn’t want to play for you anymore. All you do is soar the relationship further. Moreover, a player who isn’t playing is decreasing in value everyday he doesn’t play. Makes no sense. If he want 8M+ and won’t sign for less, how you going to get him on a bridge?
 
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