Forums/Armchair-GM

Rask for Ryan - A bold idea for MIN to get SOMETHING out of him

Created by: Random2152
Initial Creation Date: Oct 11, 2019
Published: Oct 11 at 8:29 pm
Team: 2019-20 Minnesota Wild
Team Explanation
I was looking around the league for a bad contract idea to move around and I figured this would be the best bet.

MIN's owner wants to win right? You trade a wholly unproductive player making 4 mil for 3 years for a semi-productive but overpaid player making 7.25 mil for 3 years.
Rask's contract has no signing bonuses and so is cheaper for Melnyk both if he plays or if they buy him out (SB's are a big problem for OTT by their own admission) and Ryan has been showing signs of life and could be a good reclamation project for the team. He also is actually an NHL player which is nice. Not sure who would add so what are your thoughts?

I don't know lines or anything so feel free to let me know.
Trades
MIN
  1. Ryan, Bobby
OTT
  1. Rask, Victor
Buyouts
  • Tyler Ennis: $1,216,667
DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
2020
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
2021
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
2022
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES BONUSESCAP SPACE
23$81,500,000$80,237,755$0$1,232,500$1,262,245
Left WingCenterRight Wing
MIN
Zucker, Jason
$5,500,000
LW, RW
NTC
UFA - 4
MIN
Koivu, Mikko
$5,500,000
C
NMC
UFA - 1
MIN
Zuccarello, Mats
$6,000,000
RW
NMC
UFA - 5
MIN
Greenway, Jordan
$916,666
LW
RFA - 1
MIN
Kunin, Luke
$925,000
RW, C
RFA - 1
MIN
Parise, Zach
$7,538,461
LW
NMC
UFA - 6
MIN
Fiala, Kevin
$3,000,000
LW
RFA - 2
MIN
Staal, Eric
$3,250,000
C
UFA - 2
OTT
Ryan, Bobby
$7,250,000
RW, LW
NMC NTC
UFA - 3
MIN
Donato, Ryan
$1,900,000
RW, LW, C
RFA - 2
MIN
Eriksson Ek, Joel
$1,487,500
C
RFA - 2
MIN
Hartman, Ryan
$1,900,000
LW, RW
RFA - 2
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
MIN
Suter, Ryan
$7,538,461
LD
NMC
UFA - 6
MIN
Dumba, Matt
$6,000,000
RD
UFA - 4
MIN
Dubnyk, Devan
$4,333,333
G
NTC
UFA - 2
MIN
Brodin, Jonas
$4,166,667
LD
UFA - 2
MIN
Spurgeon, Jared
$5,187,500
RD
NMC
UFA - 1
MIN
Stalock, Alex
$785,000
G
UFA - 3
MIN
Soucy, Carson
$750,000
D
RFA - 1
MIN
Hunt, Brad
$700,000
RD
UFA - 2
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
MIN
Shaw, Mason
$792,500
C
RFA - 2
MIN
Pateryn, Greg
$2,250,000
RD
UFA - 2
MIN
Seeler, Nick
$725,000
LD
UFA - 2
MIN
Foligno, Marcus
$2,875,000
LW, RW
UFA - 2

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Oct 11 at 8:35
#1
Shibbal18
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 8,029
Likes: 1,535
Not a bad idea imo. Put him with Koivu and Parise
Oct 11 at 8:42
#2
Wqrrior
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 1,955
Likes: 318
This might be the one time I see in theory a legitimate trade and don't side with it.

1. Ottawa is the team that doesn't do this. Ryan is still a decent mentor and the cap space issue is pretty much irrelevant. They are pretty full on center and Rask would most likely be a healthy scratch.
2. Lots of times we make trades with guys who have NMC and assume they waive it. I get this trade was made with that conclusion, but I cannot see Ryan waiving to play on what some might consider a team with a worse future ahead of them.
3. Minnesota is trying to get younger, not older. Rask might not fetch a young talent, but if he is a scratch, do they really want to pay a guy 7.25M to take a spot from a 2nd/3rd line prospect in development (Ex. Kunin playing on the fourth line)


I typically make these longer replies for trades that are legitimately worth considering. This is a decent look and I am treating this as a legitimate proposal instead of a hypothesis. It's the minor details that I see overturning this.
(Rask for Smith on NYR and JJ on PIT are still the two trades I see having most sense value, because even though those defensemen are quite bad (horrible factoring in their contracts), Minnesota has a weak third pairing and it wouldn't take much to build on that need)
Oct 11 at 8:48
#3
Thread Starter
The evil stats guy
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 3,999
Likes: 1,659
Quoting: Wqrrior
This might be the one time I see in theory a legitimate trade and don't side with it.

1. Ottawa is the team that doesn't do this. Ryan is still a decent mentor and the cap space issue is pretty much irrelevant. They are pretty full on center and Rask would most likely be a healthy scratch.
2. Lots of times we make trades with guys who have NMC and assume they waive it. I get this trade was made with that conclusion, but I cannot see Ryan waiving to play on what some might consider a team with a worse future ahead of them.
3. Minnesota is trying to get younger, not older. Rask might not fetch a young talent, but if he is a scratch, do they really want to pay a guy 7.25M to take a spot from a 2nd/3rd line prospect in development (Ex. Kunin playing on the fourth line)


I typically make these longer replies for trades that are legitimately worth considering. This is a decent look and I am treating this as a legitimate proposal instead of a hypothesis. It's the minor details that I see overturning this.
(Rask for Smith on NYR and JJ on PIT are still the two trades I see having most sense value, because even though those defensemen are quite bad (horrible factoring in their contracts), Minnesota has a weak third pairing and it wouldn't take much to build on that need)


1) Has nothing to do with cap space and everything to do with money paid out (and signing bonuses in particular). Ottawa is tanking at the moment and so there is no reason for them to keep the better player over the financially sound move.
2) Somewhat valid point. I imagine you could convince him a change of scenery would be beneficial. Look what it did for Staal's career.
3) Losing the Rask contract for an actual player may not make them younger, but it does make them better and that is what the owner seems to be going for. I agree that they SHOULD be re-building, but their ownership doesn't want that so this is one way to get better on the cheap.

MIN doesn't move Rask for JJ because JJ is a buyout candidate as well and RASK would be cheaper for less term in that sense due to SB's.
I don't think Smith is still an NHL player which is the essence of this move, getting something for 'nothing' so again I don't think either of those moves work.
Oct 11 at 8:58
#4
Thread Starter
The evil stats guy
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 3,999
Likes: 1,659
@TanSor @Claesson4Norris
Need input from the respective fan bases. What do you think? (Feel free to tag in others who might have something to say on it).
Oct 11 at 9:08
#5
Wqrrior
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 1,955
Likes: 318
Quoting: Random2152
1) Has nothing to do with cap space and everything to do with money paid out (and signing bonuses in particular). Ottawa is tanking at the moment and so there is no reason for them to keep the better player over the financially sound move.
2) Somewhat valid point. I imagine you could convince him a change of scenery would be beneficial. Look what it did for Staal's career.
3) Losing the Rask contract for an actual player may not make them younger, but it does make them better and that is what the owner seems to be going for. I agree that they SHOULD be re-building, but their ownership doesn't want that so this is one way to get better on the cheap.

MIN doesn't move Rask for JJ because JJ is a buyout candidate as well and RASK would be cheaper for less term in that sense due to SB's.
I don't think Smith is still an NHL player which is the essence of this move, getting something for 'nothing' so again I don't think either of those moves work.


The point I was making is I don't think Ottawa is desperate enough to move Ryan for a healthy scratch, and even though it makes MIN better (and that might be what their management desires), it's a worse move for them overall long-term. Ottawa is definitely tanking, however Ryan has been a good (and one of only) veteran presences on this team that has the ability to have some impact.
Not faulting the trade. Typically the best trades require the most in-depth analysis.
Oct 11 at 9:17
#6
Thread Starter
The evil stats guy
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 3,999
Likes: 1,659
Quoting: Wqrrior
The point I was making is I don't think Ottawa is desperate enough to move Ryan for a healthy scratch, and even though it makes MIN better (and that might be what their management desires), it's a worse move for them overall long-term. Ottawa is definitely tanking, however Ryan has been a good (and one of only) veteran presences on this team that has the ability to have some impact.
Not faulting the trade. Typically the best trades require the most in-depth analysis.


I understand what you're getting at, but I have much less faith in Melnyk to do right by the team when good finances go against it. I think the financial benefits are great enough that they would do it.
Oct 11 at 9:18
#7
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,534
Likes: 1,722
Quoting: Random2152
@TanSor @Claesson4Norris
Need input from the respective fan bases. What do you think? (Feel free to tag in others who might have something to say on it).


I could definitely see it making sense. The Wild somehow think they might be good, so having Ryan over definitely makes them better. The cash savings is a pretty easy answer for Melnyk.

The biggest problem for me is that the Sens trade a solid middle six player, and don't get an NHL player in return. Not a huge problem, as Ottawa has depth options to fill the open space, but it puts another 4mil man in the press box. Just can't see Ottawa paying 8mil for guys who won't play for them ( sens seemingly have no faith in Boedker).

Besides that, I think it's definitely a good idea.
Random2152 liked this.
Oct 11 at 9:20
#8
Thread Starter
The evil stats guy
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 3,999
Likes: 1,659
Quoting: Claesson4Norris
I could definitely see it making sense. The Wild somehow think they might be good, so having Ryan over definitely makes them better. The cash savings is a pretty easy answer for Melnyk.

The biggest problem for me is that the Sens trade a solid middle six player, and don't get an NHL player in return. Not a huge problem, as Ottawa has depth options to fill the open space, but it puts another 4mil man in the press box. Just can't see Ottawa paying 8mil for guys who won't play for them ( sens seemingly have no faith in Boedker).

Besides that, I think it's definitely a good idea.


I think the idea would be to buy rask out at the end of the year for the sens, but in the mean time I guess there is no harm in trying him in the lineup.
Are they really scratching boedker? I thought he was decent (but overpaid).
Oct 11 at 9:22
#9
Wqrrior
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 1,955
Likes: 318
Quoting: Random2152
I think the idea would be to buy rask out at the end of the year for the sens, but in the mean time I guess there is no harm in trying him in the lineup.
Are they really scratching boedker? I thought he was decent (but overpaid).


If their goal was to buy out rask in the end, would a pick back or retention on rask be the difference to making both teams jump on this?
Random2152 liked this.
Oct 11 at 9:29
#10
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,534
Likes: 1,722
Quoting: Random2152
I think the idea would be to buy rask out at the end of the year for the sens, but in the mean time I guess there is no harm in trying him in the lineup.
Are they really scratching boedker? I thought he was decent (but overpaid).


He is decent. He's a 3rd/4th line guy. Problem is he's not a good defensive player, and he doesn't work hard. He doesn't seem to have DJ's trust, and with Scott Sabourin still managing to make the most of his ice time (tied for team lead in point lmao), it's unlikely that we see Boedker any time soon.
Random2152 liked this.
Oct 11 at 10:40
#11
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 4,359
Likes: 2,411
Quoting: Random2152
@TanSor @Claesson4Norris
Need input from the respective fan bases. What do you think? (Feel free to tag in others who might have something to say on it).


Hm... it's not a terrible idea player for player, but at the end of the day we already have too many roster forwards so we don't really have room for Ryan. Rask has been collecting dust in the press box and I'd much rather it be him than Foligno since Foligno was arguably our best PK'er last year (I believe we were the 7th or 8th best PK team last year as well). If it's not Foligno collecting dust, it's Hartman or another young forward, and again I'd rather it be Rask than any of those guys or even Ryan since he would take up more cap. The Wild are probably stuck with Rask who will just be bought out next year.
Oct 11 at 10:48
#12
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,534
Likes: 1,722
Quoting: TanSor
Hm... it's not a terrible idea player for player, but at the end of the day we already have too many roster forwards so we don't really have room for Ryan. Rask has been collecting dust in the press box and I'd much rather it be him than Foligno since Foligno was arguably our best PK'er last year (I believe we were the 7th or 8th best PK team last year as well). If it's not Foligno collecting dust, it's Hartman or another young forward, and again I'd rather it be Rask than any of those guys or even Ryan since he would take up more cap. The Wild are probably stuck with Rask who will just be bought out next year.


I get Foligno is an incredibly strong defensive forward, but Ryan is a significant improvement over Foligno or Hartman. Having either of those two in the press box isn't going to hurt you that much imo
 
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