Looks like someone hit the vodka bottle and its gone too. Blues decline!

HAHAHAHAHA. I was about to comment saying how brutal the trade was for the Leafs, but your response takes the cake.
Blues decline? That is priceless

The trade doesn't really make sense for both teams, but value-wise, getting Matthews for those 2 assets alone is a steal

So, to be clear, @Copenhagen believes this is a bad deal for the Blues and @Madlin27 believes this is a bad deal for the Leafs? Very interesting.

I would make the argument that this deal makes a ton of sense for both teams especially and IF the Blues can resign Pietrangelo.

You don't trade a young superstar like Matthews unless you're getting a better player back which the Leafs are not

Yeah agreed, but those guys are fan favourites in St Louis.. They don't want to trade those guys. But yeah. Matthews is a superstar in exchange for 2 good players

Generally, that would be true, but I honestly believe the Leafs have enough "superstars", and at this point, I would consider Parayko a borderline top-pairing D. There is no doubt that he offers a significant upgrade beyond what the Leafs have right now, and what the Leafs could get in UFA (with their cap issues) or in a trade if they didn't want to deplete their prospect cupboard.

didnt you just win 4-1 tonight

Yep, fan favourites forsure, and I really love O'Reilly's game. That said, I would make the argument that the Blues GM Armstrong is one of the few GMs that I could see actually making this deal considering his history and reputation with trades.

I don't understand the comment. The outlook of this deal is long-term, both in terms of this season, and playoff hockey, but beyond for cap-related issues, playing a more well-rounded style of hockey, etc.

I’d say add dermott and it’s a fair trade. Really interesting trade - it makes sense for both sides IMO. Leafs have a much better shot at winning the cup with oreilly and parayko than Matthews.

Both O’Reilly and Parayko had a higher WAR than Matthews last year so at least in the short term the Blues get smoked. That being said, I can understand why the Leafs would say no considering it’s Matthews.

didnt you win tonight

I appreciate your acknowledgment about the creativity of my proposed deal. I'd be hesitant to add Dermott, if, for no other reason, that the Leafs have control over him for a number of future season than some of their other D (Muzzin, Barrie, etc.). Perhaps there is an alternative to Dermott that doesn't include Rielly, Sandin or Liljigren?

Maybe literally, but not emotionally :P

I would argue that the Blues would benefit greatly from a pure offensive superstar such as Matthews IF they were confident that they could find back-checking and defensive play from other areas of their roster. I don't think the Leafs would automatically say no. If I was the Leafs, and regardless of the "moving forward" mentality of the management group (or at least what they've said publicly), I would still be a little ticked off with him, not necessarily on what he did in Arizona that caused that issue, but how he dealt with it. Additionally, and I have no updated news or report to back that up beyond what Matthews says publicly, but I don't think the Leafs are happy with how he's called out the team.

If the trade happened right now, I would go with Reilly-parayko , muzzin-barrie, marincin holl. The first two pairings would eat up so much ice time that the 3rd really won’t have a large effect on the outcome of most games. Sandin steps in next season in place of muzzin. Oreillys line would be the line I would match up against other teams top lines because he’s elite defensively, allowing Tavares-marner to take advantage of lesser competition.

I think dermott is necessary or a LD prospect, but I wouldn’t give up sandin as he has more upside than dermott

Still feels like a raw deal for the Blues. Sure it would be fun to have a player like Matthews, but I don’t think anyone’s arguing the Blues are a better team with him than they are with ROR and Parayko. It’s basically trading the 5th best center for like the 10th best center and the 12th best defenseman.

Certainly an interesting take, at least for the rest of this season, assuming this happens sometime during the season. I don't like Marincin on principle, especially because he seems to constantly make the same mistakes, especially getting himself into penalty trouble. My concern would be next season. There is no way the Leafs can resign Mikheyev, Barrie and Muzzin, regardless of this deal, unless they were willing to part with a top-6 forward (other than Matthews). I think the Leafs would be more willing to give up, potentially, a conditional 1st round, IF that's what it took to get this deal done, if the Blues included a prospect, and Dermott was off the table. So for next year, assuming Muzzin was resigned, the D would be Rielly-Parayko, Muzzin-Dermott, Sandin-Liligren. That looks pretty good.

Everything that you've mentioned with respect to O'Reilly, I fully and wholeheartedly agree with. I would add that of interest to me would be O'Reilly playing with Johnsson and Kapanen, based on the fact that both aren't affraid (and Johnson more than Kapanen) to get a little physical and go into the corners, but also because of Kapanen's defensive work.

I hear you. I just wanted to propose something that I thought MIGHT benefit both teams, in different ways. And as for your ranking, and I know it's just an example, it would totally depend on how you were ranking the centre (is it based on overall play, pure offensive, possession, goals, etc.). Additionally, I would be very curious to see how Matthews and Tarasenko, as 2 dynamic goals scorers, would, or could interact, playing on the same line. You'd have to balance out the line with a third, more gritty and defensive player perhaps, but that would, presumably, be a dynamic duo. Thoughts on that?

They’d be a lot more fun that’s for sure, but I’m almost positive they’d be worse. If you remove the Selke winner and Parayko who’s either the best or 2nd best defensive defenseman, you’re removing a lot of defense tha I don’t think is replaceable internally. They’d still have Dunn, Faulk, and Pietrangelo, but all three of those guys mostly provide offensive impact. And then Matthews, Schenn, Bozak down the middle is almost exclusively offense as well. It would be a fun experiment, but I don’t think it would work out.

You want to know how you know Matthews is good? The guy has 9 goals in 12 games and people are complaining that he isn't playing his best

It's hard to offer feedback there, because I definitely do not watch St. Louis play much at all, so I am just relying on stats, recap vids of games, etc. I'd have to think though Schenn and Bozak and others like Thomas, Fabbri, Schwartz, have worked hard on their defensive game. At least, it sure looked like it in the playoffs last year. Here's an interesting note, @Isles777 mentioned that St. Louis would agree to the deal IF the Leafs included Dermott. Would that change your mind at all?

That's not my complaint. In fact, I am not complaining at all, I am just trying to imagine a situation where the Leafs, as a whole, and as a team, is better, than that of the individual player (ie Matthews can do it alone and get goals, great, but can he stop another player from equalizing that production). My answer is no. So far in his career, Matthews has not proven that he can defend as at least a top-2 centre should be able to. And with Tavares out, that gets magnified, unfortunately.