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Legitimate Hall trades

Created by: Talos213
Team: 2019-20 New Jersey Devils
Initial Creation Date: Dec. 4, 2019
Published: Dec. 4, 2019
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Description
Guys, seriously. All of these Hall trades are way off the mark. The guy isn't as good as Stone and most likely won't sign an extension in season. These might need some work based on cap but should be fairly close.

Using the Stone trade as a template which included him signing an extension. However I think more teams will be in on Hall than Stone. So I'm calling it a B+ prospect, 2nd rounder and a throw in player
Free Agent Signings
CREATEDYEARSCAP HIT
Hall, Taylor
1$6,000,000
Hall, Taylor
1$6,000,000
Hall, Taylor
1$6,000,000
Hall, Taylor
1$6,000,000
Hall, Taylor
1$6,000,000
Hall, Taylor
1$6,000,000
Hall, Taylor
1$6,000,000
Hall, Taylor
1$6,000,000
Hall, Taylor
1$6,000,000
Hall, Taylor
1$6,000,000
Hall, Taylor
1$6,000,000
Trades
1.
NJD
  1. Suzuki, Ryan
  2. van Riemsdyk, Trevor
  3. 2020 2nd round pick (CAR)
CAR
  1. Hall, Taylor
2.
NJD
  1. Annunen, Justus [Reserve List]
  2. Timmins, Conor
  3. Wilson, Colin
  4. 2020 4th round pick (COL)
Additional Details:
Avs do not have a 2nd so I added Annunen and lowered the pick to a 4th
COL
  1. Hall, Taylor
3.
NJD
  1. Bow, Landon
  2. Dellandrea, Ty
  3. Janmark, Mattias
  4. 2020 4th round pick (DAL)
Additional Details:
Same thing as COL, no 2nd so added a goalie prospect. I have not followed this season closely for Bow vs Oettinger so they could be swapped
DAL
  1. Hall, Taylor
4.
NJD
  1. Benson, Tyler
  2. Gagner, Sam
  3. Manning, Brandon
  4. Puljujärvi, Jesse [Reserve List]
  5. 2020 4th round pick (EDM)
Additional Details:
Could be way off the mark with this one. But EDM needs to clear cap so it's basically Benson, 4th and Gagner for Hall and JP to take on the Manning deal this year. Pick is slightly lower because 2 prospects are included
EDM
  1. Hall, Taylor
5.
NJD
  1. Brook, Josh
  2. Kulak, Brett
  3. 2020 3rd round pick (MTL)
Additional Details:
I consider Kulak more than a throw in here. Julien seems to not like him so I could see him being moved in a deal like this. I think he's an improvement for the Devils so the pick is only a 3rd
6.
NJD
  1. Backes, David
  2. Senyshyn, Zach
  3. Vaakanainen, Urho
  4. 2020 1st round pick (BOS)
Additional Details:
NJ takes on an extra year of the Backes deal to help BOS sign Krug, cover new extension for Coyle. Price goes up to eat the salary
BOS
  1. Hall, Taylor
7.
NJD
  1. Ho-Sang, Joshua
  2. Wilde, Bode
  3. 2020 3rd round pick (NYI)
NYI
  1. Hall, Taylor
8.
NJD
  1. Smith, Craig
  2. Tolvanen, Eeli
  3. 2020 2nd round pick (NJD)
NSH
  1. Hall, Taylor
9.
NJD
  1. Braun, Justin
  2. York, Cam [Reserve List]
  3. 2020 2nd round pick (PHI)
PHI
  1. Hall, Taylor
10.
NJD
  1. Addison, Calen
  2. Galchenyuk, Alex
  3. 2020 3rd round pick (PIT)
Additional Details:
This depends on what you think of Galchenyuk. I still see him as a good player. I think he could do well if he could stay healthy. He looked good in camp. If you don't like him as a player, swap the 3rd with a 1st
PIT
  1. Hall, Taylor
11.
NJD
  1. Kostin, Klim
  2. Steen, Alexander
  3. 2020 1st round pick (STL)
Additional Details:
NJ eats the 2 years left on Steen's deal and gets a 1st for it instead of a 2nd
STL
  1. Hall, Taylor
12.
NJD
  1. Bahl, Kevin
  2. Garland, Conor
  3. Söderberg, Carl
  4. 2020 2nd round pick (ARI)
Additional Details:
Prospects aren't of as high a tier but both have a legit shot, didn't want to touch Hayton or Granstrom
ARI
  1. Hall, Taylor
Buyouts
Recapture Fees
Buried
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2020
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the BOS
Logo of the STL
Logo of the CAR
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the PHI
Logo of the ARI
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the NYI
Logo of the PIT
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the BOS
Logo of the COL
Logo of the DAL
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
2021
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
2022
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the CBJ
Logo of the NJD
Logo of the NJD
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
51$81,500,000$114,141,888$0$9,690,000-$32,641,888
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$2,875,000$2,875,000
C
NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$2,500,000$2,500,000
RW, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$4,500,000$4,500,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$2,250,000$2,250,000
C, LW
UFA - 3
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$2,325,000$2,325,000
RW, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$2,750,000$2,750,000
LW
UFA - 3
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$1,800,000$1,800,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$700,000$700,000
C
UFA - 1
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$749,167$749,167 (Performance Bonus$42,500$42K)
RW, LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$2,850,000$3M)
C
UFA - 3
Logo of the Dallas Stars
$2,300,000$2,300,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$2,850,000$3M)
C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Boston Bruins
$863,333$863,333 (Performance Bonus$450,000$450K)
RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$808,333$808,333 (Performance Bonus$32,500$32K)
LW, RW
UFA - 2
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$925,000$925,000
C, LW
RFA - 3
Logo of the New York Islanders
$874,125$874,125
RW, C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Nashville Predators
$894,166$894,166 (Performance Bonus$2,850,000$3M)
LW, RW
RFA - 2
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$750,000$750,000
C, LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Nashville Predators
$4,250,000$4,250,000
RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
$4,900,000$4,900,000
LW, C, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Carolina Hurricanes
$925,000$925,000
C
RFA - 5
Logo of the St. Louis Blues
$863,333$863,333
LW, RW
RFA - 3
Logo of the St. Louis Blues
$5,750,000$5,750,000
LW, RW, C
NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$2,600,000$2,600,000
C, LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Arizona Coyotes
$775,000$775,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Dallas Stars
$894,167$894,167
RW
RFA - 4
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$2,835,000$2,835,000
RW, C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Boston Bruins
$4,500,000$4,500,000
C, RW
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Arizona Coyotes
$4,750,000$4,750,000
C, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$5,000,000$5,000,000
LD/RD
NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$9,000,000$9,000,000
RD
UFA - 3
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$1,150,000$1,150,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$2,437,500$2,437,500
LD/RD
UFA - 1
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$4,166,666$4,166,666
RD
UFA - 4
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$697,500$697,500 (Performance Bonus$132,500$132K)
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$2,822,764$2,822,764
LD
UFA - 3
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$1,500,000$1,500,000
RD
UFA - 2
Logo of the Dallas Stars
$700,000$700,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$1,400,000$1,400,000
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$700,000$700,000
RD
UFA - 2
Logo of the New Jersey Devils
$675,000$675,000
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Carolina Hurricanes
$2,300,000$2,300,000
RD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$925,000$925,000
RD
RFA - 2
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$2,250,000$2,250,000
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$795,000$795,000 (Performance Bonus$182,500$182K)
RD
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$925,000$925,000
LD/RD
UFA - 3
Logo of the Boston Bruins
$894,167$894,167 (Performance Bonus$300,000$300K)
LD/RD
RFA - 3
Logo of the New York Islanders
$778,333$778,333
RD
UFA - 4
Logo of the Philadelphia Flyers
$3,800,000$3,800,000
RD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
$809,167$809,167
RD
RFA - 4
Logo of the Arizona Coyotes
$817,500$817,500
LD
RFA - 4

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Dec. 4, 2019 at 11:37 a.m.
#26
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Quoting: Sagecoll
I'm saying it should be probably close to the Duchene deal last year: 2020 1st + cond 1st + Top 80 prospect +. And also that last year's trades are indicative of an oversaturated market for F's (probably easiest to see in the fact that Carl Hagelin and Ben Lovejoy were traded for the same compensation) and not teams changing their valuations of draft picks


That's fine if you want to look at it through that lens. I do not agree but if that's your takeaway i can see the sense in what you are saying. I also believe 2020 is a better draft than 2019 so teams are even more likely to hold onto their 1sts
Dec. 4, 2019 at 11:38 a.m.
#27
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Quoting: MaxDomi13
Doubt NSH trades Tolvanen


Why not? he's trending down. Isn't producing as expected, skating concerns aren't getting better. That team is built to win now. Trade him while he has value
Dec. 4, 2019 at 11:39 a.m.
#28
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Quoting: Talos213
Why not? he's trending down. Isn't producing as expected, skating concerns aren't getting better. That team is built to win now. Trade him while he has value


you don't want another seth jones situation
Dec. 4, 2019 at 11:41 a.m.
#29
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Quoting: Barbs
Ok let me rephrase. Dorion fumbled that trade, I have more faith in Shero not doing the same. Inquiring teams may try to use the Stone trade as precedent but Shero will certainly get a better offer than anything posted above. Teams will be trying to outbid each other for Hall's services. Dorion was trying to pull off 3 big trades in one weekend and was left settling with Stone, Shero doesn't have that problem.


The team trading the best player loses the deal 99% of the time. Especially at the trade deadline. I see these deals as realistic, teams don't want to trade their 1sts or top prospects for rentals. If you want to argue over conditional picks here and there sure, go for it. But it certainly isn't going to be Byram and a 1st coming back from COL or Drouin+ from MTL
Dec. 4, 2019 at 11:42 a.m.
#30
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Quoting: MaxDomi13
you don't want another seth jones situation


Jones was never trending down, Jones was a stud 4th overall pick who couldn't get time on a very deep blueline swapped for a potential 1st line center that NSH desperately needed
Dec. 4, 2019 at 11:58 a.m.
#31
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Quoting: Talos213
The team trading the best player loses the deal 99% of the time. Especially at the trade deadline. I see these deals as realistic, teams don't want to trade their 1sts or top prospects for rentals. If you want to argue over conditional picks here and there sure, go for it. But it certainly isn't going to be Byram and a 1st coming back from COL or Drouin+ from MTL


If Kevin Hayes can fetch a 1st rounder, a conditional 4th and Brendan Lemieux I'm positive Taylor Hall can bring back a top prospect and 1st rounder. Every year around the deadline there are teams who overpay just like there are teams that underpay. I think you're underestimating Shero and the current market
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Dec. 4, 2019 at 12:04 p.m.
#32
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Quoting: Barbs
If Kevin Hayes can fetch a 1st rounder, a conditional 4th and Brendan Lemieux I'm positive Taylor Hall can bring back a top prospect and 1st rounder. Every year around the deadline there are teams who overpay just like there are teams that underpay. I think you're underestimating Shero and the current market


I'd turn that around and say a lot of people are overestimating Hall, in terms of his value and how good of a player he is
Dec. 4, 2019 at 12:24 p.m.
#33
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Quoting: Talos213
So Shero tells other GMs that they should ignore recent history and give him a massive package anyways? And gets left holding the bag at the trade deadline with nothing to show for a player that's leaving on July 1st? Sounds like a fireable offense to me


Hall has 22 points in 27 games on a team that is horrible right now. He would do way better on any playoff team. Since when is 22 points in 27 games bad anyway? It is turning into a bidding game and if you think the highest bidder won't be offering a 1st round pick you are incredibly incompetent.
Dec. 4, 2019 at 12:27 p.m.
#34
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Quoting: Talos213
I'd turn that around and say a lot of people are overestimating Hall, in terms of his value and how good of a player he is


When I hear people say he is worth 12M, I agree with you. Although, as a 6M playoff rental I think you highly underestimate his value...
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Dec. 4, 2019 at 12:40 p.m.
#35
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Edited Dec. 4, 2019 at 12:54 p.m.
Quoting: Hockeyguy77
Hall has 22 points in 27 games on a team that is horrible right now. He would do way better on any playoff team. Since when is 22 points in 27 games bad anyway? It is turning into a bidding game and if you think the highest bidder won't be offering a 1st round pick you are incredibly incompetent.


I'm incompetent because I can look at past deals rather than just jump to a conclusion? Nice to see you have to result to insults to try and make a point. Get over yourself

22 in 27 points is not a point per game which is usually considered (perhaps arbitrarily) as a cutoff for elite talent. As stated above, Hall is ranked 403 out of 460 forwards in the league for Goals above replacement. Saying he'd do better on a better team is completely losing sight of things. If Hall is such an elite player than he should be able to produce like one in all situations rather than looking like a sub replacement level forward who's getting their points based on ice time and favorable deployment.

Also, Corey Masisak The Athletic looked at 5 in season trades (Stone, Duchene, Staal, Gaborik and Kovalchuk) to come up with a realistic return for Hall. Duchene and Kovalchuk were the only two that included 1st round picks. I tend to value centers (especially a 1/1A like Duchene) over wingers and the Kovalchuk trade was almost 10 years ago. Stone and Gaborik were both top tier wingers moved in deals that did not include 1st round picks.

So just to clarify, I'm "incredibly incompetent" for paying attention to past deals and coming up with a projection of what I think is likely rather than just spouting out crap about a 1st round pick being the only way a trade gets done? It's also pretty clear you don't know anything about pick value, they drop off immensely after the top 20. Arguing for a high 20 first instead of a mid 40-50 and a good prospect is a gross misuse of assets
Dec. 16, 2019 at 4:31 p.m.
#36
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Quoting: MG1986
The only reason he's been "put on the market" now is so that the Devils can try and get a bidding war going. I'd agree with the description, that I don't think Hall signs an extension in season, unless he really liked the team he was going to, and the new contract numbers were that enticing. The 2 biggest players here might be the Islanders and Avalanche, for different reasons, but I'd say the underdog in all this has to be Arizona. The team is doing incredibly well, all things considered, and I could see them willing to unload a bunch of assets (other than Barret Hayton) to acquire 5-6 months of Taylor Hall.


Woah! I had to search a bit for this thread, but did I call it, or did I call it? I knew Arizona was seriously interested. Awesome
Dec. 17, 2019 at 9:45 a.m.
#37
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Quoting: MG1986
Woah! I had to search a bit for this thread, but did I call it, or did I call it? I knew Arizona was seriously interested. Awesome


You called it. I'm pretty proud of myself for getting the main piece right (Bahl). I still think they did even worse than I thought they would
Dec. 17, 2019 at 1:18 p.m.
#38
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Quoting: Talos213
You called it. I'm pretty proud of myself for getting the main piece right (Bahl). I still think they did even worse than I thought they would


I think the Devils out pretty well. I really liked Nate Schnarr when I saw him in the OHL. Skates fairly well for a kid that's 6'3, good shot, decent hands. Reminds me a lot of Lawson Crouse, but less of the rough and tumble game. Kevin Bahl is also a solid pick up. None of these prospects, or Merkley, are going to be franchise-altering BUT, I could see each of these players making an impact on an NHL roster someday soon. The first round pick is obviously a gem to what will be quite a deep 1st round round draft this summer.
Dec. 18, 2019 at 2:59 p.m.
#39
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Quoting: MG1986
I think the Devils out pretty well. I really liked Nate Schnarr when I saw him in the OHL. Skates fairly well for a kid that's 6'3, good shot, decent hands. Reminds me a lot of Lawson Crouse, but less of the rough and tumble game. Kevin Bahl is also a solid pick up. None of these prospects, or Merkley, are going to be franchise-altering BUT, I could see each of these players making an impact on an NHL roster someday soon. The first round pick is obviously a gem to what will be quite a deep 1st round round draft this summer.


Here's how I read the trade
-Bahl - potential 4/5 defender that's main calling card is being big. Minimal offensive upside. Sounds like he's mobile enough but he's not going to be a PP guy
-Schnarr - bottom 6 center with minimal offensive upside
-Merkley - the way he plays the game he has to be on a scoring line. He's boom or bust with boom being a middle 6 winger.
-1st rounder - maybe in the 23-25 range? yes it's a deep draft but the Devils scouting lately has been a little questionable and the player taken here is 3-4 years away
-conditional - another lottery ticket that won't be cashed in until next year. I'd guess it's a 2nd but another player that's a long ways away from making an impact if he does at all

Contrast all that with the Devils being perpetually rebuilding and it's not a good look. I think they would have been better targeting a developed prospect or more picks in this draft than fixating on getting a 1st. Kinda seems like they wanted quantity over quality
Dec. 19, 2019 at 12:52 a.m.
#40
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Quoting: Talos213
Here's how I read the trade
-Bahl - potential 4/5 defender that's main calling card is being big. Minimal offensive upside. Sounds like he's mobile enough but he's not going to be a PP guy
-Schnarr - bottom 6 center with minimal offensive upside
-Merkley - the way he plays the game he has to be on a scoring line. He's boom or bust with boom being a middle 6 winger.
-1st rounder - maybe in the 23-25 range? yes it's a deep draft but the Devils scouting lately has been a little questionable and the player taken here is 3-4 years away
-conditional - another lottery ticket that won't be cashed in until next year. I'd guess it's a 2nd but another player that's a long ways away from making an impact if he does at all

Contrast all that with the Devils being perpetually rebuilding and it's not a good look. I think they would have been better targeting a developed prospect or more picks in this draft than fixating on getting a 1st. Kinda seems like they wanted quantity over quality


Yeah, maybe when you get a bigger pot of cusp NHLers (to a degree, at least) there is more of a percentage 1 of 3 breaks through, plus the picks working out, then say, 1 of 1 prospects, plus maybe a higher pick (or non-conditional?) - Always risk involved. I think Schnarr could be a pretty decent #3 center, maybe #2? He showed some knack for net front presence playing for Guelph. He might be more suited to a power forward wing role at the NHL level. Bahl, hard to say. He could become that shut down guy plus top PK. Those guys still have pretty good value. Anyway, I think the Devils made out okay. Not sure there was going to ever be a better offer on the table for a rental, unless the Oilers (or some other team) really got tremendously desperate.
Dec. 19, 2019 at 8:15 a.m.
#41
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Quoting: MG1986
Yeah, maybe when you get a bigger pot of cusp NHLers (to a degree, at least) there is more of a percentage 1 of 3 breaks through, plus the picks working out, then say, 1 of 1 prospects, plus maybe a higher pick (or non-conditional?) - Always risk involved. I think Schnarr could be a pretty decent #3 center, maybe #2? He showed some knack for net front presence playing for Guelph. He might be more suited to a power forward wing role at the NHL level. Bahl, hard to say. He could become that shut down guy plus top PK. Those guys still have pretty good value. Anyway, I think the Devils made out okay. Not sure there was going to ever be a better offer on the table for a rental, unless the Oilers (or some other team) really got tremendously desperate.


We're looking at it from different lenses which is fine. My take is quality over quantity. Yes if you get 3 players there's a higher chance 1 breaks through. But those bottom of the lineup types are a dime a dozen. They desperately need top level talent. For example I love how Ottawa got Brannstrom for Stone. He's got a really high ceiling. These guys don't have that
 
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