Forums/NHL Trades

(NJD/ARI) - Hall, Speers for Bahl, Merkley, Schnarr, 1sr round pick, conditional 3rd round pick

Who won the trade?
The chart has been hidden

Poll Options

 

Dec 16, 2019 at 5:08
#26
Isles for life
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 333
Likes: 109
Quoting: Random2152
Grabner got 5 B/C prospects
Hall got a 1st, 3 B/C prospects and a 3rd ( likely another B/C prospect).

Hall got more, but not a ton more


Oh yeah, because 4 AHL players and an AHL goalie is comparable to at all to a first and a third at the LEAST, two solid future prospects and a wild-card in Schnarr.
HabsForEver, OldNYIfan, George_Kush and 1 other person liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:08
#27
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 219
Likes: 37
Quoting: Random2152
Why don't you re-read what I read.

you EITHER make the playoffs OR win the lottery.


That can literally be said about any player.... Not original by any means.
George_Kush liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:08
#28
Cale 4 Calder
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 2,868
Likes: 1,177
Quoting: Random2152
To anyone who thinks this is a fair deal or good for the Devils in any way just remember this:
The islanders received a similar package for Michael Grabner.

Shero got fleeced! He needed to get quality over quantity and he just... didn't.


How is this even remotely close to the grabner deal? I don't see any resemblance
MoreOfAnIslesGuy, OldNYIfan, George_Kush and 1 other person liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:10
#29
First NY Then LA
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 8,916
Likes: 3,789
Arizona got what it wanted -- Taylor Hall.

New Jersey got a good return for a player they weren't going to be able to re-sign: an excellent prospect (Nick Merkley), a pretty good prospect (Kevin Bahl), a first-round pick, and a conditional pick.

I think that both teams did fine, and I don't think that Shero got fleeced. And note that everyone's opinion on this trade will change drastically the moment that Hall signs a new contract in the summer -- with Calgary.
Curtas_Glencrosby and BCAPP liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:11
#30
The evil stats guy
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,953
Likes: 2,250
Quoting: MoreOfAnIslesGuy
Oh yeah, because 4 AHL players and an AHL goalie is comparable to at all to a first and a third at the LEAST, two solid future prospects and a wild-card in Schnarr.


Look at it for what it likely will be 5 years down the road.
4 guys who never made it or are tweeners at best and a 1st.
Vs
5 guys who never made it or are tweeners at best.

He got one less guy and a late first (similar in value to a 2nd).
That isn't a ton more man.

Quoting: moli92
How is this even remotely close to the grabner deal? I don't see any resemblance


See the above.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:13
#31
Dom6Yotes
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 197
Likes: 212
Quoting: worcat
I really like this move for the Devils. Great job getting assets in return for a player that was all but gone in the off-season. Not just prospects, but draft picks on top of that. Excellent trade for the rebuilding Devils. Now if they can continue this trend and build around their future. Looking at you Subban...

Coyotes already have a good lineup that, IMO, has over achieved. We can debate if they will stay the course and continue this level of play but Hall is really a mystery at this point. Who knows which player he will show up as? And a possible rental? That's alot of talent to give up. I'd pump the brakes if I were a 'yotes fan. It really seems like a feast or famine situation with this trade.


The Coyotes Haven’t over Achieved at all there still in the basement in the league when it comes to scoring
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:13
#32
Isles for life
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 333
Likes: 109
Quoting: Random2152
Look at it for what it likely will be 5 years down the road.
4 guys who never made it or are tweeners at best and a 1st.
Vs
5 guys who never made it or are tweeners at best.

He got one less guy and a late first (similar in value to a 2nd).
That isn't a ton more man.



See the above.


Late first? IF the Arizona Coyotes make the playoffs (admittedly likely), they probably won't go any further than the 2nd round (if they win the cup I'll just look like a jackass), but that means they'll have received a first and a second (assuming they dont somehow find the cap to bring Hall back) and 2 B prospects and a B/C prospect.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:15
#33
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 219
Likes: 37
Quoting: DSZ
The Coyotes Haven’t over Achieved at all there still in the basement in the league when it comes to scoring


42 points in a weak division can be seen as overachieving. Eventually teams are going to catch up to them and as you stated, their +13 goal differential is going to need to improve to stay afloat.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:16
#34
The evil stats guy
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,953
Likes: 2,250
Quoting: MoreOfAnIslesGuy
Late first? IF the Arizona Coyotes make the playoffs (admittedly likely), they probably won't go any further than the 2nd round (if they win the cup I'll just look like a jackass), but that means they'll have received a first and a second (assuming they dont somehow find the cap to bring Hall back) and 2 B prospects and a B/C prospect.


yup. and that is only marginally more than Grabner got. They needed to get quality, even if it was a 1st and one quality guy (high end/1st round prospect) and they didn't.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:17
#35
Nazaleaf
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 113
Likes: 99
I don't think this was as lopsided as being declared. Didn't think ARI would get him, but it speaks to the character of the franchise which seems to want to be taken seriously. And I'm all for it! Smaller market teams need this to keep the NHL exciting. Plus, I was sick of seeing fans of other teams continually sh*t on the Yotes. Hopefully Hall makes them more competitive and they can go on a run.. Team needed a jolt of late. Plus, I hear guys wanna play for their coach, so that ought to help light a fire under Hall!
OldNYIfan and Kylonetic8 liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:18
#36
Isles for life
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 333
Likes: 109
Quoting: Random2152
yup. and that is only marginally more than Grabner got. They needed to get quality, even if it was a 1st and one quality guy (high end/1st round prospect) and they didn't.


All I heard was "I'm drastically overrating Hall's value because I don't have a grasp on the New Jersey Devils' situation with Hall"

He's not playing out of his mind this year and they lost leverage as SOON as it became clear that they HAD to trade him. This is a very solid return for a player who has a bad reputation when it comes to teams he's on (Duchene stuff) and who HAD to be traded.
OldNYIfan, George_Kush and RawDeal liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:19
#37
Retired V2 & V3 GM
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 2,212
Likes: 381
Hall and Kessel line?? OH YEAH!!
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:20
#38
Go for the Repeat
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 18
Likes: 9
Finally. I hated the "Hall to St. Louis" speculation.

Also, win for Arizona. It's not even close.
Random2152 liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:21
#39
The evil stats guy
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,953
Likes: 2,250
Quoting: MoreOfAnIslesGuy
All I heard was "I'm drastically overrating Hall's value because I don't have a grasp on the New Jersey Devils' situation with Hall"

He's not playing out of his mind this year and they lost leverage as SOON as it became clear that they HAD to trade him. This is a very solid return for a player who has a bad reputation when it comes to teams he's on (Duchene stuff) and who HAD to be traded.


They still could have done better If they had gone for quality > quantity. Full value Hall rental is much more I agree, but even this low end stuff should have been a 1st and Soderstrom? (I don't know the yotes prospect pool very well).
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:22
#40
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 8,483
Likes: 1,744
It's way to early to say anyone actually "won" this.

Honestly, I look at this trade and it boils down to a 1st and a possible 2nd. Maybe Hall resigns, who knows I doubt it.

The rest in there is basically AHL level and probably not going to play in the NHL. Maybe Bahl makes the jump but his ceiling is limited.

Hall on the other hand has to actually do something. If he plays for AZ like he did in NJ, AZ got took.
If they cant win a playoff round, than AZ got took.
In general I think most put him at a 1st and a B level prospect. I think they got that. It's fair.
But who wins this won't be known till later.
TheWolfe, George_Kush and RawDeal liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:24
#41
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 7,185
Likes: 1,646
SHOCKED that nobody offered a better package. It wouldn't have been difficult...
ThatGuy liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:25
#42
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 4,067
Likes: 1,443
Quoting: CD282
SHOCKED that nobody offered a better package. It wouldn't have been difficult...


Not a lot of teams are willing to offer 2 potential 1st round picks and 3 B prospects for a 6 month rental
worcat, OldNYIfan, George_Kush and 1 other person liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:26
#43
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 8,483
Likes: 1,744
Quoting: thelastlongbow
I don't think this was as lopsided as being declared. Didn't think ARI would get him, but it speaks to the character of the franchise which seems to want to be taken seriously. And I'm all for it! Smaller market teams need this to keep the NHL exciting. Plus, I was sick of seeing fans of other teams continually sh*t on the Yotes. Hopefully Hall makes them more competitive and they can go on a run.. Team needed a jolt of late. Plus, I hear guys wanna play for their coach, so that ought to help light a fire under Hall!


AZ plays in the 5th largest metro area in the US. I hardly call it a small market.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:27
#44
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 7,185
Likes: 1,646
Quoting: HabsForEver
Not a lot of teams are willing to offer 2 potential 1st round picks and 3 B prospects for a 6 month rental



I think Arizona's 2021 1st is safe, they don't have the cap space to sign Hall.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:29
#45
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 8,483
Likes: 1,744
Quoting: Random2152
They still could have done better If they had gone for quality > quantity. Full value Hall rental is much more I agree, but even this low end stuff should have been a 1st and Soderstrom? (I don't know the yotes prospect pool very well).


who was going to give them more. No one.
You could see that a mile away. 1st and a prospect was basically the ceiling on this and they got that. If he resigns they get more, but we have to wait and see how that goes.
OldNYIfan, worcat and George_Kush liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:32
#46
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 308
Likes: 151
Well I'd say win for Coyotes. I honestly don't understand this trade from Devils perspective. You got Hischier, Hughes, Zacha and McLeod as centers and you trade for two centers who aren't better than those 4. Sure Bahl is a pretty good prospect, but it doesn't hurt for the Coyotes with OEL and Chychrun as top 4 LD's. Sure those draft picks are good. Probably a mid 1st and a 2nd or 3rd. But when you get a quality top 6 player at 3M cap hit without giving up anything special, you win the trade
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:33
#47
TheWolfe
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 174
Likes: 69
Quoting: CD282
I think Arizona's 2021 1st is safe, they don't have the cap space to sign Hall.


And this is why NJ's return was what it was. Arizona would have to do some pretty major restructuring to resign Hall past this year. So while they did get a good player, they really are just renting his services.

As pharrow said, we won't really know who won this deal for awhile. Or at least until after the playoffs.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:40
#48
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 4,067
Likes: 1,443
Quoting: CD282
I think Arizona's 2021 1st is safe, they don't have the cap space to sign Hall.


Pretty much guaranteed to become a 2nd. Chayka will be fired if they don't make it past the 1st round. I also think they aren't done
TheWolfe liked this.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:44
#49
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 23
Likes: 0
Quoting: WellIDK
Well I'd say win for Coyotes. I honestly don't understand this trade from Devils perspective. You got Hischier, Hughes, Zacha and McLeod as centers and you trade for two centers who aren't better than those 4. Sure Bahl is a pretty good prospect, but it doesn't hurt for the Coyotes with OEL and Chychrun as top 4 LD's. Sure those draft picks are good. Probably a mid 1st and a 2nd or 3rd. But when you get a quality top 6 player at 3M cap hit without giving up anything special, you win the trade


I was hoping the Devils would have tried to get someone like Chychrun as the centerpiece in this trade [even if the devils had to add more to their side in the trade]. The Devils do need more grit & size on defense, so I'm happy with the acquisition of Bahl.
Dec 16, 2019 at 5:50
#50
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 308
Likes: 151
Quoting: worcat
42 points in a weak division can be seen as overachieving. Eventually teams are going to catch up to them and as you stated, their +13 goal differential is going to need to improve to stay afloat.


Well their goal differential is 2nd best in the Conference. Only Avs is way better with +31. Vegas has the 2nd best goal differential in the division with +6
 
Reply
To create a post please Login or Register
Question:
Options:
Submit Poll Edit