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Pens want Tatar

Created by: Tiekv
Team: 2019-20 Montreal Canadiens
Initial Creation Date: Feb. 2, 2020
Published: Feb. 2, 2020
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Description
Q
Trades
MTL
  1. Poulin, Samuel
  2. 2020 1st round pick (PIT)
Buyouts
Buried
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2020
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the PIT
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the CHI
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the ANA
Logo of the WPG
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the FLA
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the CHI
2021
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the CHI
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the MTL
2022
Logo of the MTL
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ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
24$81,500,000$69,307,142$0$1,345,000$12,192,858
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$5,500,000$5,500,000
LW, RW
UFA - 4
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,150,000$3,150,000
C, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,750,000$3,750,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,083,333$3,083,333
C
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$2,600,000$2,600,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,400,000$3,400,000
LW, RW
UFA - 4
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,400,000$1,400,000
C, RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$2,350,000$2,350,000
RW, LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$2,400,000$2,400,000
LW, RW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,000,000$1,000,000
C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$350,000$350,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,000,000$1,000,000
LW, C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
$925,000$925,000
C, LW
RFA - 5
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$850,000$850K)
C, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$863,333$863,333 (Performance Bonus$425,000$425K)
C
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$763,333$763,333 (Performance Bonus$70,000$70K)
RW, LW
UFA - 3
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$2,000,000$2,000,000
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$7,857,143$7,857,143
RD
UFA - 7
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$10,500,000$10,500,000
G
NMC
UFA - 7
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,750,000$1,750,000
LD/RD
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$5,500,000$5,500,000
RD
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$750,000$750,000
G
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$925,000$925,000
LD/RD
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$748,333$748,333
LD/RD
UFA - 1

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Feb. 2, 2020 at 3:54 p.m.
#1
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Pens won’t go that far
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Feb. 2, 2020 at 3:58 p.m.
#2
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Deal
Feb. 2, 2020 at 4:07 p.m.
#3
BorisBagel
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Pitts adds
Feb. 2, 2020 at 4:46 p.m.
#4
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Add galchenyuk, pens want to move him, habs take his contract for this season and get a roster player... galchenyuk gets an audition with the team that drafted him.
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Feb. 2, 2020 at 4:55 p.m.
#5
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Quoting: AFOX10900
Deal


Quoting: CaptainFlynnt
Add galchenyuk, pens want to move him, habs take his contract for this season and get a roster player... galchenyuk gets an audition with the team that drafted him.


Tatar (half retained) vs 2020 1st + Samuel Poulin you’ll do it ?
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Feb. 2, 2020 at 11:42 p.m.
#6
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Pens say no. Tatar isn't that great of a skater. You aren't getting two firsts for him. We saw how awful he fit in with a good Vegas team. No Contender will pay this price.

Pens say no and go to another seller.
Feb. 3, 2020 at 12:26 a.m.
#7
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Not at that price. I don’t think they give up both the 2020 1st and a top prospect for anyone that’s available tbh. Unless someone like William nylander is available.
Feb. 3, 2020 at 7:41 a.m.
#8
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Quoting: Nights_King93
Pens say no. Tatar isn't that great of a skater. You aren't getting two firsts for him. We saw how awful he fit in with a good Vegas team. No Contender will pay this price.

Tatar not good skater lol

Pens say no and go to another seller.
Feb. 3, 2020 at 10:44 a.m.
#9
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He isn't... Go look at the Pens roster. You will see a trend. Tatar is an NHL talent and can skate perfectly fine... He doesn't zip around the ice. He is not in the same league as McCann, Rust, and Tanev.. For starters.

There is a difference between being a competent NHL skater and being a skater that is better than your current competition. Tatar is more of a sniper.
Feb. 3, 2020 at 2:02 p.m.
#10
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Quoting: Nights_King93
He isn't... Go look at the Pens roster. You will see a trend. Tatar is an NHL talent and can skate perfectly fine... He doesn't zip around the ice. He is not in the same league as McCann, Rust, and Tanev.. For starters.

There is a difference between being a competent NHL skater and being a skater that is better than your current competition. Tatar is more of a sniper.


Don't compare McCann and Tanev to Tatar. Tatar is on pace for 30 goals and 70+ pts while playing with Danault and Gallagher. Montreal plays a game based on speed and Tatar has excelled in that system. He plays a fast game. Imagine what he could do with Crosby.

Habs do not trade tatar unless it is an overpayment, he is under contract next year and his 30 goals would be hard to replace in the lineup.
Feb. 3, 2020 at 8:15 p.m.
#11
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I'm not comparing them, I'm just saying that he isn't quite the skater and qualified him as more of a sniper. I've seen him on lines with Kovalchuk that looked pretty slow when Montreal was playing with their combos.

He is scoring with Montreal but someone has to. He was dreadful in Vegas. You may be right, but i never said anything about Montreal. I said if you want to get that in return the Pens say no and walk away. If you get a first, you might get a second tier prospect. You won't be walking away with their first and Poulin.

If someone else overpays for him. Good for you guys. If not, you better hope you are contending next year.
Feb. 4, 2020 at 8:41 a.m.
#12
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Quoting: Nights_King93
I'm not comparing them, I'm just saying that he isn't quite the skater and qualified him as more of a sniper. I've seen him on lines with Kovalchuk that looked pretty slow when Montreal was playing with their combos.

He is scoring with Montreal but someone has to. He was dreadful in Vegas. You may be right, but i never said anything about Montreal. I said if you want to get that in return the Pens say no and walk away. If you get a first, you might get a second tier prospect. You won't be walking away with their first and Poulin.

If someone else overpays for him. Good for you guys. If not, you better hope you are contending next year.


You seem to like bringing up Vegas to diminish Tatar's trade value (a good number of people seem to), but ignore the fact that Vegas traded for a top 6 winger (Tatar) then refused to use him in the top 6 because 'chemistry', and less than a year later, literally by the next deadline, either traded or demoted to bottom 6 roles half of their top 6 to bring in 3 new guys (Statsny, Pacioretty, and Stone). If you want to view that as a players failure that's fair, it might be, but it certainly looks like Vegas screwed up by trying to hard to ride the whole outcasts identity they had further than it could carry them.

As for his value, figure out what a team would trade for a rental having the season Tatar is having and then add what a team who thinks the will be contending will trade for that during the off season, and then you have a 'fair' price for Tatar. The Pacioretty trade, were MTL had almost no leverage, is a good base for the 2nd part, and this coming TDL will have some comparables, but Tatar's pts/gm (in what is admittedly a career year) are currenly better this season than any rental available.
Feb. 4, 2020 at 11:49 a.m.
#13
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Quoting: J2W
You seem to like bringing up Vegas to diminish Tatar's trade value (a good number of people seem to), but ignore the fact that Vegas traded for a top 6 winger (Tatar) then refused to use him in the top 6 because 'chemistry', and less than a year later, literally by the next deadline, either traded or demoted to bottom 6 roles half of their top 6 to bring in 3 new guys (Statsny, Pacioretty, and Stone). If you want to view that as a players failure that's fair, it might be, but it certainly looks like Vegas screwed up by trying to hard to ride the whole outcasts identity they had further than it could carry them.

As for his value, figure out what a team would trade for a rental having the season Tatar is having and then add what a team who thinks the will be contending will trade for that during the off season, and then you have a 'fair' price for Tatar. The Pacioretty trade, were MTL had almost no leverage, is a good base for the 2nd part, and this coming TDL will have some comparables, but Tatar's pts/gm (in what is admittedly a career year) are currenly better this season than any rental available.


I'm sorry.. But if you are comparing Tatar to Pacioretty I have to stop there. No one will compare the two players. Patches has so many tools that make him an elite player from time to time. Tatar is having a great year, but no one will ever say he is an elite player. I think all of Montreal would agree with that.

If I'm the Pens, I would give up Poulin, a first, and a good deal more to get Pacioretty, even though i think his contract will eventually turn sour. Tatar is just not the same player.

I use the Vegas example because this year doesn't show his true value. The Pens have to think about worst case scenario... The Vegas issue is worst case scenario. They didn't try to play him on the fourth line. For the entirety of his Pens career, Kessel played most of his minutes on the third line and PP. This is similar to what Vegas was doing with Tatar until he went ice cold.

Tatar is a system fit kind of guy. His production WILL be affected by the system he is in. That is the main point about the Vegas production. Montreal is using this season to prepare their young talent moving forward. There is nothing wrong with that at all. But Tatar is benefitting from that greatly.
Feb. 4, 2020 at 1:06 p.m.
#14
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Edited Feb. 4, 2020 at 1:20 p.m.
Quoting: Nights_King93
I'm sorry.. But if you are comparing Tatar to Pacioretty I have to stop there. No one will compare the two players. Patches has so many tools that make him an elite player from time to time. Tatar is having a great year, but no one will ever say he is an elite player. I think all of Montreal would agree with that.

If I'm the Pens, I would give up Poulin, a first, and a good deal more to get Pacioretty, even though i think his contract will eventually turn sour. Tatar is just not the same player.

I use the Vegas example because this year doesn't show his true value. The Pens have to think about worst case scenario... The Vegas issue is worst case scenario. They didn't try to play him on the fourth line. For the entirety of his Pens career, Kessel played most of his minutes on the third line and PP. This is similar to what Vegas was doing with Tatar until he went ice cold.

Tatar is a system fit kind of guy. His production WILL be affected by the system he is in. That is the main point about the Vegas production. Montreal is using this season to prepare their young talent moving forward. There is nothing wrong with that at all. But Tatar is benefitting from that greatly.


I'm comparing the trade value Pacioretty had at the time of his trade, with one season remaining, looking for a pay raise while also coming off a 37 point in 64 game season while being known as on the outside going forward in MTL, to the trade value of Tatar at this upcoming deadline, having this playoff run in addition to another season remaining before needing a raise or to be let go, while already having 49 points in 54 games. Pacioretty is decent defensively, but Tatar hasn't exactly been a liability since joining the Habs. Tatar is also almost 2 full years younger than Pacioretty, meaning he is about the same age as Pacioretty when the trade happened.
The simple fact is that Vegas didn't use Tatar as a top 6 forward, and within the year had changed 50% of their top 6. That doesn't exactly scream proper player usage. I doubt the Pens have that kind of uncertainty in their forward group.
Getting rentals of Tatar's calibre, one this season and one next instead of trading for Tatar this season, would cost more than what is being asked for to get Tatar at this TDL, that's the point I am making.
Feb. 4, 2020 at 3:49 p.m.
#15
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Judging a player by points alone at any point is a dangerous game. Some Pens fans wanted to trade Rust when they signed Tanev. I said the only way you trade Rust is if he is packaged for a superstar. Look at the year he is having. He plays the game the right way, has speed, and plays defense. He blocks shots in critical moments, etc.

Tatar is a very good NHL player, but arguing his value just on points this year versus Patches points the year they moved him is not an accurate depiction of the players or the values. I rememeber Montreal fans doing this with Domi last year and last summer. Everyone in the league said one great year wasn't enough to call him a superstar. He has fallen back down to earth this year, as he might reach 20 goals and 50 points.

Montreal fans acted like he was going to net 30 goals and 75 points every year moving forward.

Simple answer is no team pays the absolute highest value of a player. They may buy high, but they will consider the entire story and not one season.
Feb. 10, 2020 at 8:41 p.m.
#16
Habs
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@GMs @Nights_King93 @Pensfan89

Thoughts on the trade? Would think Tatar has better value than Zucker. Not sure how big the gap is between Poulun and Addison, I consider both to be good prospects. I don't think the idea of Tatar for Poulin, a 1st and Galchenyuk was far off.
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Feb. 10, 2020 at 8:53 p.m.
#17
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Quoting: CaptainFlynnt
@GMs @Nights_King93 @Pensfan89

Thoughts on the trade? Would think Tatar has better value than Zucker. Not sure how big the gap is between Poulun and Addison, I consider both to be good prospects. I don't think the idea of Tatar for Poulin, a 1st and Galchenyuk was far off.


Tatar is better than Zucker but Zucker got more terms but I think Zucker’s value is a little bit higher since he got terms
Feb. 10, 2020 at 9:27 p.m.
#18
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Quoting: CaptainFlynnt
@GMs @Nights_King93 @Pensfan89

Thoughts on the trade? Would think Tatar has better value than Zucker. Not sure how big the gap is between Poulun and Addison, I consider both to be good prospects. I don't think the idea of Tatar for Poulin, a 1st and Galchenyuk was far off.


I’m hoping Schultz is taking a discount on his next contract to stay with the pens cause Addison was who I was hoping would jump into the sheltered 3rd pair next season. I’d have traded Hallander or one of Legare or Poulin instead of Addison. As Zucker would have blocked them from making the jump.
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Feb. 11, 2020 at 9:10 a.m.
#19
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Quoting: CaptainFlynnt
@GMs @Nights_King93 @Pensfan89

Thoughts on the trade? Would think Tatar has better value than Zucker. Not sure how big the gap is between Poulun and Addison, I consider both to be good prospects. I don't think the idea of Tatar for Poulin, a 1st and Galchenyuk was far off.


Yeah. Kind of like the others said.. I would have preferred to keep Addison. I think extending Marcus and the eventual re-signing of Marino made JR think this was the deal to make.

4 years of Zucker at a fairly affordable price. What if the cap goes up to 90 mill by 2021-22 season? That 5.5 million would be a steal in that market.

The Pens are a better team now and they will be a better team next year for sure. The window is now. Looking at Sid and Geno's age, they have to strike. Zucker and Horny should be able to dominate a low game with Sid in the playoffs. If Geno can get Rust and Jake, that top six will frustrate people.
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