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Time is running out Stan

Created by: Jzoni10
Team: 2019-20 Chicago Blackhawks
Initial Creation Date: Feb. 24, 2020
Published: Feb. 24, 2020
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Gustafsson is gone so why aren't they announce it the trade? And is Carolina saving there picks for Lehner? Overall, if we stay put I hope Stan gets fired on the spot.
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    Lehner and Gustafsson?
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    ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
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    Feb. 24, 2020 at 10:53 a.m.
    #1
    Drumman44
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    Our man @Stan_Bowman got a 1st for Ryan freaking Hartman. Chill
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 10:54 a.m.
    #2
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    Jzoni10
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    Quoting: DrumMan44
    Our man @Stan_Bowman got a 1st for Ryan freaking Hartman. Chill


    He's done more negative than positive.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 10:56 a.m.
    #3
    Drumman44
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    Quoting: Jzoni10
    He's done more negative than positive.


    I am not going to re-litigate the Panarin for Saad trade yet again. That was a bad trade. If he was going to be canned for it it should have happened 2 years ago. Since Q was released, his moves have been largely good.
    exo2769 liked this.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 10:59 a.m.
    #4
    exo2769
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    Quoting: Jzoni10
    He's done more negative than positive.


    Wrong
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 11:01 a.m.
    #5
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    Jzoni10
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    Quoting: exo2769
    Wrong


    If I am please provide examples.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 11:04 a.m.
    #6
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    Quoting: DrumMan44
    I am not going to re-litigate the Panarin for Saad trade yet again. That was a bad trade. If he was going to be canned for it it should have happened 2 years ago. Since Q was released, his moves have been largely good.


    Yeah but before since then what has he done? Traded almost all of our 1st round selections, keep us under the cap, and firing Q was to save himself. The core that won us the cups was created by Tallon.
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    Feb. 24, 2020 at 11:06 a.m.
    #7
    exo2769
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    Quoting: Jzoni10
    If I am please provide examples.


    Keeping this to short term so that the post doesn't get too long...say 18 months...ish.

    Good Trades - Kubalik for a 5th. Regula for a 0 goal Perlini. DeHaan for Forsling/Forseberg. Drake for Manning. I like the Maatta trade. He's been huge for the Hawks. Kahun wasn't going to be a difference maker on this team.

    Good Moves - Sign Lehner to a 1 year deal. Sign Carpy to 3 years $1M. Sign Kampf. Sign Gus.

    Good Draft moves - Dach & Boqvist both look to be panning out. Not all top 10 picks do.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 11:07 a.m.
    #8
    Number 1 Kahun Fan
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    Quoting: Jzoni10
    He's done more negative than positive.


    Mostly mixed imo with a couple big stinkers.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 11:15 a.m.
    #9
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    Quoting: DrumMan44
    I am not going to re-litigate the Panarin for Saad trade yet again. That was a bad trade. If he was going to be canned for it it should have happened 2 years ago. Since Q was released, his moves have been largely good.


    The blind loyalty to this man is boarder line mental. Forget the freakin moves he’s made for one second. They have been bad, while some came off as good (although hindsight hurts them a great deal). This guy has tired and failed for 3 years to make this team better.

    So what’s the new solution Stan? Fire your fall guy Colliton? Everyone in this town knows you hated Q long before you fired him and were dying to find an excuse to do so. Fire a hall of famer to save your job and hire a nobody? Sound logic.

    So what’s the solution Stan? The draft?
    Nope. We see how much you hate first round picks. This last draft is gonna age horribly in a few years when the rest of the draft class come up to the nhl. Beaudin is included in trade basically every week. Boqvist, god willing, will hopefully learn defense one day. Other than Mitchell and kurashev, do we even have any close to A level prospects?

    So what’s the problem Stan? The players?
    What a novel concept. You rewarded loyalty and thought they would continue to perform all the way to 40. When has that ever worked Stan? Is it possible that the players you think work just never will? Maatta? Slow. De haan? Has one arm. Shaw? 3 PICKS STAN AND CONCUSSED!!!! Nylander? **** you Stan. Lehner? Congrats, now that we know the islanders have sorokin and signed varlamov as a means to bring to the island, I’m not impressed anymore.

    So what’s the problem Stan? Is it you?
    Where there’s smoke, there’s always fire Stan. You’ve had had your chances and NOTHING HAS CHANGED. Your supporters can continue to endorse this mediocrity, but I’m not. I expect better of this organization. So just leave with some ****ing dignity man. Take your Backstreet Boys Colliton with you.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 11:26 a.m.
    #10
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    Quoting: exo2769
    Keeping this to short term so that the post doesn't get too long...say 18 months...ish.

    Good Trades - Kubalik for a 5th. Regula for a 0 goal Perlini. DeHaan for Forsling/Forseberg. Drake for Manning. I like the Maatta trade. He's been huge for the Hawks. Kahun wasn't going to be a difference maker on this team.

    Good Moves - Sign Lehner to a 1 year deal. Sign Carpy to 3 years $1M. Sign Kampf. Sign Gus.

    Good Draft moves - Dach & Boqvist both look to be panning out. Not all top 10 picks do.


    I love how know of the moves mentioned in this description have made us a playoff team. Full stop, that simple. We are not a playoff team. Maatta makes a difference? Goals still go in. De haan? Had one arm when we got him, still does now. Kubalik? Awesome, ya think he’ll try to get TVR back for him, a la panarin/Saad? Carpy? Effort guy, not a difference maker. Kampf? Effort guy, not a difference maker. Gus? Why does everyone act like Gus was good when he signed this contract? Boqvist? Can’t play defense yet. Dach? Consistency sucks.

    These moves are all dandy on paper, but they didn’t make us better. Forget subjective, objectively we are not better. I don’t need statistics to tell me we are 8 points out. I swear to god people are gonna defend this guy if miss the playoffs for another 5 years.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 11:29 a.m.
    #11
    exo2769
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    Quoting: HatterTParty
    I love how know of the moves mentioned in this description have made us a playoff team. Full stop, that simple. We are not a playoff team. Maatta makes a difference? Goals still go in. De haan? Had one arm when we got him, still does now. Kubalik? Awesome, ya think he’ll try to get TVR back for him, a la panarin/Saad? Carpy? Effort guy, not a difference maker. Kampf? Effort guy, not a difference maker. Gus? Why does everyone act like Gus was good when he signed this contract? Boqvist? Can’t play defense yet. Dach? Consistency sucks.

    These moves are all dandy on paper, but they didn’t make us better. Forget subjective, objectively we are not better. I don’t need statistics to tell me we are 8 points out. I swear to god people are gonna defend this guy if miss the playoffs for another 5 years.


    There's zero doubt he's made bad moves. Joki Nylander for example. I just think it all needs to put into play. Not just focus on the bad and not just focus on the good.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 11:36 a.m.
    #12
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    Quoting: exo2769
    There's zero doubt he's made bad moves. Joki Nylander for example. I just think it all needs to put into play. Not just focus on the bad and not just focus on the good.


    Exo, it has been three years of bad. It started at panarin and has only gotten worse! He fired a hall of famer just to save himself! Every problem this team has was created by him. What good are you referring to? It’s always one step forward two steps back with this guy. Maatta will probably be bought out or traded. De haan and Shaw May never play again. Seabrook is gonna play again just to spite us.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 11:44 a.m.
    #13
    exo2769
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    Edited Feb. 24, 2020 at 12:06 p.m.
    Quoting: HatterTParty
    Exo, it has been three years of bad. It started at panarin and has only gotten worse! He fired a hall of famer just to save himself! Every problem this team has was created by him. What good are you referring to? It’s always one step forward two steps back with this guy. Maatta will probably be bought out or traded. De haan and Shaw May never play again. Seabrook is gonna play again just to spite us.


    I just don't buy for a second that Tallon...who has won zero cups is responsible for 3 cups. Did it take a genius to Draft Kane/Toews...NO, NO IT DIDN'T! How much of a genius is Chia for drafting McDavid?!?! This is the ONLY reason people Love Tallon. Remember Campbell's $7M+ contract. That was horrible, but he understood the situation and that Hawks could take it. I understand we're in a prisoner of the moment scenario...so blame everyone. I get it. He's responsible for this team as it is today. HE'S ALSO RESPONSIBLE FOR 3 CUPS. He brought in Zeus. Yes he's made mistakes, but you only focus on the negative. EVERY GM has negatives. Why hire any GM ever then?! Look at Rutherford. People call him a genius, but just look at his trades and signings. They're some of the worst moves out of any team.

    ***EDIT*** I'd Fire John McDonough 7 times before Bowman.

    ***EDIT EDIT*** I reserve the right to change my mind if he makes zero moves this TDL...I can't stand when people don't learn from their mistakes...Should moved Gus last TDL.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 12:08 p.m.
    #14
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    Quoting: exo2769
    I just don't buy for a second that Tallon...who has won zero cups is responsible for 3 cups. Did it take a genius to Draft Kane/Toews...NO, NO IT DIDN'T! How much of a genius is Chia for drafting McDavid?!?! This is the ONLY reason people Love Tallon. Remember Campbell's $7M+ contract. That was horrible, but he understood the situation and that Hawks could take it. I understand we're in a prisoner of the moment scenario...so blame everyone. I get it. He's responsible for this team as it is today. HE'S ALSO RESPONSIBLE FOR 3 CUPS. He brought in Zeus. Yes he's made mistakes, but you only focus on the negative. EVERY GM has negatives. Why hire any GM ever then?! Look at Rutherford. People call him a genius, but just look at his trades and signings. They're some of the worst moves out of any team.

    ***EDIT*** I'd Fire John McDonough 7 times before Bowman.


    Okay, first off, you can’t even compare Tallon to Bowman. Tallon has his name on the 2010 cup, albeit not as a GM which is a ****ing travesty. The Campbell contract? You bring it up like it’s comparable to seabrook or something. It’s not! Campbell was still a top dman and easily moveable!!! Tallon brought in ladd, versteeg, Campbell, sharp, havlat and hossa. He didn’t do a damn thing to disrupt the best core in hockey or sign **** contracts that couldn’t be moved. His worst mistake was the goofy face machine incident.

    Having said that, please don’t preach that bowman was responsible for 2010, cuz he wasn’t. Bowman maintained the team and put depth around the core. He didn’t add to it. However, you, exo, always like to argue what he’s done right in the last 18 months to 2 years. What he’s done hasn’t worked! No matter how it looks on paper, forget it, it didn’t work. His ideas don’t work anymore!

    Also, what does firing McD solve? Honestly, what does effect does that have on anything?
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    Feb. 24, 2020 at 12:11 p.m.
    #15
    exo2769
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    Quoting: HatterTParty
    Okay, first off, you can’t even compare Tallon to Bowman. Tallon has his name on the 2010 cup, albeit not as a GM which is a ****ing travesty. The Campbell contract? You bring it up like it’s comparable to seabrook or something. It’s not! Campbell was still a top dman and easily moveable!!! Tallon brought in ladd, versteeg, Campbell, sharp, havlat and hossa. He didn’t do a damn thing to disrupt the best core in hockey or sign **** contracts that couldn’t be moved. His worst mistake was the goofy face machine incident.

    Having said that, please don’t preach that bowman was responsible for 2010, cuz he wasn’t. Bowman maintained the team and put depth around the core. He didn’t add to it. However, you, exo, always like to argue what he’s done right in the last 18 months to 2 years. What he’s done hasn’t worked! No matter how it looks on paper, forget it, it didn’t work. His ideas don’t work anymore!

    Also, what does firing McD solve? Honestly, what does effect does that have on anything?


    I'm the only one pointing out things he's done right. Everyone else just bashes and says fire everyone! Tallon didn't even draft Keith/Seabs/Crow. Like...what did he do that everyone LOVES!? He's god to CHI fans because why???...he did the easiest thing in the world?!?! Draft the clear and obvious choices???
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 12:15 p.m.
    #16
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    Jzoni10
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    Quoting: exo2769
    I'm the only one pointing out things he's done right. Everyone else just bashes and says fire everyone! Tallon didn't even draft Keith/Seabs/Crow. Like...what did he do that everyone LOVES!? He's god to CHI fans because why???...he did the easiest thing in the world?!?! Draft the clear and obvious choices???


    Yeah Toews and Kane were easy, but it's about the surrounding pieces. Like Hossa, Sharp, and others previously mentioned. Toews and Kane are still here, but the surrounding pieces are not good.
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    Feb. 24, 2020 at 12:32 p.m.
    #17
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    Quoting: exo2769
    I'm the only one pointing out things he's done right. Everyone else just bashes and says fire everyone! Tallon didn't even draft Keith/Seabs/Crow. Like...what did he do that everyone LOVES!? He's god to CHI fans because why???...he did the easiest thing in the world?!?! Draft the clear and obvious choices???


    Quoting: Jzoni10
    Yeah Toews and Kane were easy, but it's about the surrounding pieces. Like Hossa, Sharp, and others previously mentioned. Toews and Kane are still here, but the surrounding pieces are not good.


    Quoting: Jzoni10
    Yeah Toews and Kane were easy, but it's about the surrounding pieces. Like Hossa, Sharp, and others previously mentioned. Toews and Kane are still here, but the surrounding pieces are not good.


    Quoting: exo2769
    I'm the only one pointing out things he's done right. Everyone else just bashes and says fire everyone! Tallon didn't even draft Keith/Seabs/Crow. Like...what did he do that everyone LOVES!? He's god to CHI fans because why???...he did the easiest thing in the world?!?! Draft the clear and obvious choices???


    I’ll take this one step further. Tallon added sharp and hossa to the core and they stayed effective till they left. Bowman has added only cat to the core. He has drafted no one of note in the first round that made a long term difference to us. Moreover, his trend of bad contracts have crippled the team for years. He’s made savvy moves for depth pieces, but never makes the moves that keep people around long term. Even Shaw and Saad were of consistent worth in only their first stints. Saad has only this season gotten his mojo back.

    Here’s another big thing too. Tallon was GM from 2005-2009. 4 years. In 4 years, the team improved every year. Tallon consistently made picks and signings that kept improving the team. That’s why everyone loved him. He actually helped BUILD A WINNER, NOT MAINTAIN IT. Sure he made the obvious choices in toews and Kane. But I’ll put it this way, Kessel was available when we picked toews. Was toews the obvious pick? Byram and turcotte were around when we picked third, yet bowman picked Dach. Obvious pick? Gimme a break.

    Everyone hates bowman cuz he constantly does things that come back to hurt us. If you focus on only the good, you’re gonna be content with mediocrity. I don’t want that from my team. If bowman just wants a paycheck and doesn’t care about rebuilding this team, fire him!
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 12:38 p.m.
    #18
    exo2769
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    Quoting: HatterTParty
    I’ll take this one step further. Tallon added sharp and hossa to the core and they stayed effective till they left. Bowman has added only cat to the core. He has drafted no one of note in the first round that made a long term difference to us. Moreover, his trend of bad contracts have crippled the team for years. He’s made savvy moves for depth pieces, but never makes the moves that keep people around long term. Even Shaw and Saad were of consistent worth in only their first stints. Saad has only this season gotten his mojo back.

    Here’s another big thing too. Tallon was GM from 2005-2009. 4 years. In 4 years, the team improved every year. Tallon consistently made picks and signings that kept improving the team. That’s why everyone loved him. Sure he made the obvious choices in toews and Kane. But I’ll put it this way, Kessel was available when we picked toews. Was toews the obvious pick? Byram and turcotte were around when we picked third, yet bowman picked Dach. Obvious pick? Gimme a break.

    Everyone hates bowman cuz he constantly does things that come back to hurt us. If you focus on only the good, you’re gonna be content with mediocrity. I don’t want that from my team. If bowman just wants a paycheck and doesn’t care about rebuilding this team, fire him!


    I didn't remember that Sharp was Dale Tallon's trade. I thought it was Bob's. Good trade there for sure. I want to acknowledge that 1st.

    Do you know how you get the #1OA pick??? It's because you stink. So, NO. I don't buy him being a savant GM. He literally just traded a quality piece with 3 years left and a sub $5M contract in Trocheck for scraps earlier today. I supported Bowman trading away the picks...essentially depleting the farm system and bringing us to today...….because that's what all teams do that have extremem success. PIT has a HORRIBLE farm system. And they just traded away arguably their best prospect AND a 1st....because they're in win now mode. It'll 100% hurt them in the future. But that's what you do. THAT IS THE REASON were at where were at today. Every team has a bad contract or two.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 1:01 p.m.
    #19
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    Quoting: exo2769
    I didn't remember that Sharp was Dale Tallon's trade. I thought it was Bob's. Good trade there for sure. I want to acknowledge that 1st.

    Do you know how you get the #1OA pick??? It's because you stink. So, NO. I don't buy him being a savant GM. He literally just traded a quality piece with 3 years left and a sub $5M contract in Trocheck for scraps earlier today. I supported Bowman trading away the picks...essentially depleting the farm system and bringing us to today...….because that's what all teams do that have extremem success. PIT has a HORRIBLE farm system. And they just traded away arguably their best prospect AND a 1st....because they're in win now mode. It'll 100% hurt them in the future. But that's what you do. THAT IS THE REASON were at where were at today. Every team has a bad contract or two.


    Once again, I’ll keep it to the last two and a half years then. We’ve been “this” for two and a half years. So what has Stan done to fix it? Since you brought up trocheck, Stan traded joker for a bust. I know trocheck and joker aren’t comparable by experience standards, but he was one of the best we had. Heck, he doesn’t even admit we need a full rebuild! He’s so out of touch. You look only at him being the GM of the cup teams. You don’t see that he doesn’t know how to rebuild a once proud team. Stan only knows how to maintain, he doesn’t know how to build! Since that’s what we need is a rebuild, I, along with most of Chicago, don’t trust him! Judging his last two and a half years, screw him, he hasn’t earned our trust.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 1:08 p.m.
    #20
    exo2769
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    Quoting: HatterTParty
    Once again, I’ll keep it to the last two and a half years then. We’ve been “this” for two and a half years. So what has Stan done to fix it? Since you brought up trocheck, Stan traded joker for a bust. I know trocheck and joker aren’t comparable by experience standards, but he was one of the best we had. Heck, he doesn’t even admit we need a full rebuild! He’s so out of touch. You look only at him being the GM of the cup teams. You don’t see that he doesn’t know how to rebuild a once proud team. Stan only knows how to maintain, he doesn’t know how to build! Since that’s what we need is a rebuild, I, along with most of Chicago, don’t trust him! Judging his last two and a half years, screw him, he hasn’t earned our trust.


    Well...all of my 10 different examples were within the last 18 months. So...clear outside of the cup years. But as far as earned trust. He might have lost peoples trust, but there's zero doubt that he had it at one points...so he 100% earned our trust. You're just ignoring the fact that dynasty's pay a price with the farm system. He's earned this bad team...he earned 3 cups. I'm not going to make moves based on immediate emotion. I'll use my head and not my heart when choosing a GM. I'd give him another year.

    ***EDIT*** BUT I will say one more time. I can't stand when anyone doesn't learn from their mistakes. If he makes ZERO moves at the TDL....man oh man I'm going to be pissed.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 1:22 p.m.
    #21
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    Quoting: exo2769
    Well...all of my 10 different examples were within the last 18 months. So...clear outside of the cup years. But as far as earned trust. He might have lost peoples trust, but there's zero doubt that he had it at one points...so he 100% earned our trust. You're just ignoring the fact that dynasty's pay a price with the farm system. He's earned this bad team...he earned 3 cups. I'm not going to make moves based on immediate emotion. I'll use my head and not my heart when choosing a GM. I'd give him another year.

    ***EDIT*** BUT I will say one more time. I can't stand when anyone doesn't learn from their mistakes. If he makes ZERO moves at the TDL....man oh man I'm going to be pissed.


    Yes, he had the trust at one when he won 2 cups and was given another. But as you said, he earned this bad team. He certainly did. I’m not gonna bring up any of the trades in 16 and 17 cuz it’s just gonna cause more defending. However, he ensured the demise was swift and would last longer with bad contracts and and having a plan to fix it.

    Essentially, bowman never actually accepted that the team would suck eventually. You talk like he earned the bad team. Earning it entails that he worked to do so and could plan for it happening. Bowman has never accepted this team should rebuild. NEVER! This is my issue with bowman doesn’t know how to fix or build a team! Tallon did! The trades he made last summer, every one of them were for the here and now, not the future. Sorry, but this team isn’t good enough for the trades of here and now!
    exo2769 liked this.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 1:36 p.m.
    #22
    exo2769
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    Quoting: HatterTParty
    Yes, he had the trust at one when he won 2 cups and was given another. But as you said, he earned this bad team. He certainly did. I’m not gonna bring up any of the trades in 16 and 17 cuz it’s just gonna cause more defending. However, he ensured the demise was swift and would last longer with bad contracts and and having a plan to fix it.

    Essentially, bowman never actually accepted that the team would suck eventually. You talk like he earned the bad team. Earning it entails that he worked to do so and could plan for it happening. Bowman has never accepted this team should rebuild. NEVER! This is my issue with bowman doesn’t know how to fix or build a team! Tallon did! The trades he made last summer, every one of them were for the here and now, not the future. Sorry, but this team isn’t good enough for the trades of here and now!


    Getting you and me to agree isn't easy! I do agree with a lot of what you're saying. He hasn't accepting this team needing to rebuild. That part sucks the most. MIN is AHEAD of the Hawks in the standings...they're selling like crazy. This is why I keep including those edits...if he doesn't make any moves...despite having many pending UFAs...that's crazy to me. Tallon inherited a terrible team. AND just about every GM that gets a new job kinda treats the team like a rebuild anyway...because they need to build the team how THEY vision it. Not the previous GM.
    Feb. 24, 2020 at 2:11 p.m.
    #23
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    So what's the TL;DR on this argument? From the brief parts i read it looks like HatterTParty is an angry fan who hates Bowman but is incapable of rational thought and conversation. Exo looks to be defending Stan, not sure why, and saying Tallon didn't win three cups, which i agree with.

    Stan has been trash the last 4 years. Most of his signings are too high. He is probably 50-50 on trades but the ones in which he has lost, HE HAS F****** LOST. Bad. Like bad bad.
    He doesn't know when the right time to make a move is. He is HORRIBLE at managing the cap despite how people thinks he's some cap genius. He fired Q (you can have your opinions on whether that was right or not. I certainly have mine) only to bring in a nobody with nearly zero experience at any level who is proving to be quite incompetent.
    Jzoni10 liked this.
     
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