Domi centering Ehlers and Laine would be pretty effective.

The pick is fine I just wanted to keep it all within the same trade so I used WPG's to go back to Dallas but it could be MTL's for all I care. I think based on previous trade history, how much 1st round picks have gotten from some teams, I don't see how you can argue Domi isn't worth at least a 1st and a good prospect. But lets say you are right for the sake of it, you say its a tad too much, what could MTL add to make it a clear cut fair trade?

I actually think he's more effective at center. The asterisk with that though is that he can't be the teams #1 center and he also needs to be surrounded with players who aren't defensive liabilities because he isn't strong enough defensively to make up for his wingers also being liabilities. When in the wing he becomes much more 1 dimensional IMO.

So the guys I've narrowed down that fit enough of the criteria that a trade could work are: Lindell, Leddy, Skjei, Matheson, R Murray, Gostisbehere, Brodin and Zadorov. (These guys all have varying levels of costs however so not all will cost the same in my mind)

I feel "overpaid" and more than he is "worth" can be misleading terminology. How much exactly? 500K or 3M because paying a guy 500K more than he is worth is no skin off my back. Sure he could very well be overpaid a little. 4.5M is probably more reasonable but how often are players paid exactly what they are worth and those players generally are not traded as a result so your kind of stuck choosing the rest of them. No one is trading a 25 year old John Tavares while he was making only 5.5M ...... That's why I ask for you to give me some better options because I've exhausted all options and based on what I know, mixed with what I would be willing to pay for a player, I don't think there are many better options available. By the way, even though I was technically right about it, I didn't mean analytics guy in a negative way but i feel the guys who are too far to that extreme in analytics are no different than the guys who are defending guys like Ceci....... I think the eye test and analytics match up pretty damn evenly on Ceci. He just plain sucks. I feel like Lindell's numbers may be tainting your opinion of him more than reality and maybe I think he is better than he actually is granted, both of us being a little more modest still leaves us with a pretty darn good player. One that will cost no more of an over pay than any of the other players the Habs could potentially get.

I feel like saying "Stay away from Lindell and that contract." without giving better options or showing a solution is empty advice. So I need to see what you are seeing. If Lindell is not worth the cost and cap hit, who is and are they realistic options I should be going after instead? Prove it to us by putting yourself out there and let the CF community see if they agree.

Now, IF I WAS GM, I would blow this team up. All pending UFA's gone for picks and prospects and rebuilding the right way. The reality is, this ownership does not want that. They want this team to make the playoffs while not completely going all in a la Columbus last post season because they know they aren't good enough to do so yet.. So I'm attacking this from the point of view of being hired as the GM of the Habs and that I have been given objectives to attain that are aligned with the reality of the team's current goals. Not that I have free roam to do whatever I want and build the team 100% the way I truly want to.

So if you are tasked with making this team better in the short term, what better options do they have?

I'll let those more well versed with the Habs & Jets comment on that trade, but I like the Dallas trade. It essentially boils down to:

- Lehkonen + 2021 1st Round Pick (I'm assuming lottery protected) + 2021 5th Round Pick for Lindell
- 2020 4th Round Pick for Honka
- Kulak for Comeau

All 3 sections of that trade are fair. The only thing that I would personally do different is the Kulak portion of the trade. Dallas really doesn't need another depth defenseman. I think they'd be better off just freeing up Comeau's cap space. I would ask for a pick/prospect similar in value to Kulak. You'd probably know the value better than I, but a mid/late round pick or a B- prospect would be a fine substitute for me. All in all, I don't mind the deal at all. It fills needs for both teams, and makes both better moving forward.

1st+prospect for Domi seems fine, but I just think Vesalainen's a tad too high in WPG's prospect pool to be given up. Maybe Stanley would work better?

If it had to be Vesalainen though, my guess is that WPG would need a 3rd line winger or bottom-4 D going their way. Sadly, MTL doesn't really have anyone that'd fit the bill. Byron would be close, but he's overpaid. If MTL was willing to retain part of his salary, I think they could be reaching a deal there...

Yeah I figured Dallas isn't actively wanting Kulak but the reality is many big trades like this need warm bodies going out and coming in. I'm only really adding him so that Dallas has immediate replacements for both guy they lost. If they choose to keep them or not is their choice. Frankly Dallas could easily trade both guys for picks if they just want cut as much cap as possible. But for realistic purposes I think adding Kulak for Comeau just makes realistic sense.

Well you have to remember that its not JUST Domi for Veselainen+1st in this trade. Its also taking on Perreault's 4.25M and Lowry's 2.9M while giving you Honka and Weal in return. There is cap savings there overall, a young RHD prospect that Jets fans have expressed interest in before and a cheap 4th line plug who scored identically to Perreault did in the same amount of games.

If it were up to me, I wouldn't pay Lindell a penny over 3.5M. The reason I really advise staying away from this contract is that overpaying mediocre players (especially by that margin and term) is what comes back to bite teams hard.

Sure, maybe saying that is empty advice, but I'm under no obligation to convince people to change their opinions or present them a better solution. They can dig deeper into Lindell and confirm their previous opinion or change their mind. It's up to them. Why should I feel the need to prove anything to you or anyone else on here?

Holy cow. I just answered the question of what I would do differently if I was the GM, now you want me to explain how I would build a team in a way that I don't even agree with? Maybe tomorrow lol

Honka isn't a NHL level D-man, and this is coming from a Stars fan. His performance in Finland also left something more to be desired...

I also don't see Weal being a major factor in this move either. He'd most likely had troubles fitting the lineup if they still had Lowry and Perreault. Granted moving them would create some space, but at the end of the day the only place I can see him is the 4th line wing. I actually think that Lowry and Perreault have more value than Weal and Honka does. At least both of them are clear cut NHL players.

They certainly aren't the main pieces in this deal. They are only complimentary in value but they do have value. That's why im saying add them to Domi and the cap space and you get to a more fair deal as a result. 32 year old Perreault at 4.25M as a 4th line player has zero value. Habs are actively taking him on here. Lowry is a better player but at the end of the day is still a 4th line center on a good team with 3rd line ability from time to time.. Thats 7.2M Habs are taking in essentially 4th line NHL'ers. Replacing them with Honka who would get a fresh start at a max 1M contract extension and Weal who comes in at only 1.4M and can replace what Perreault gave you. There is value there for the WPG that is not being taken into consideration I don't feel.

This is a forum. The whole point is to discuss hockey. You are under no obligation to prove anything obviously but other posters are under no obligation to converse with you either. This whole thing only works if we give eachother reason to want to listen to eachother. If the discussion is gonna be one way then you won't have much fun on here. You are just gonna tell people they are wrong in your opinion. Great, thanks for the feed back I guess?....

Except you didn't explain what you would do differently.......you just said what you wouldn't do.....and the names you gave previously as alternatives are nice and all but without an idea of the cost, there's nothing to talk about.

The whole point of seeing what you would do differently is to give others a chance to critique whether or not it does or doesn't make sense.

Also forgot to talk about your Lindell lol. I feel like 3.5M is absurdly low on your part. Analytically bias-ly low.. There is no such thing as getting 25 yo, 23 mins a night dmen for 3.5M. They either are super studs that other teams wouldn't entertain trading or they are dmen that haven't given evidence or have proven worthy of playing top line minutes. (Or the cost to get one would negate the benefit of getting that player in the first place)

Either way, unless you can convince me otherwise this > "Canadiens fans, I say this to you with good intentions: Stay away from Lindell and that contract. I know you need LD, but there are better options." might as well have been "Hey Habs fans, don't get Lindell he sucks, get Roman Josi and Victor Hedman, they're better options". Great, thanks for the feed back!

I never said other posters are obligated to converse with me? I also never said that anyone was wrong. I said IMO, Lindell is not an ideal target, and I also gave an explanation why (contract and trade cost). Do you want to explain why I don't like Lindell? Cause you already assumed it was because of his numbers, and I conceded to that. I don't figure you want me to list his numbers because it seems pretty clear you don't really believe in stats. I offered my opinion and an explanation; I'm not sure why that isn't enough for you.

I did explain what I would do differently. I said I would rebuild. Sell off UFA's (Try to let them negotiate contracts first), and gear up for years of playoff contention and cup runs a few years down the line. That, again, doesn't seem to be enough for you.

Based on Lindell's performance, 3.5M isn't that low. If he were to hit the open market tomorrow, that's the most I would offer. It's nice to say that he's a 23 mins a night Dman, but the fact is, the Stars get pretty well caved in for those 23mins.

Great, thanks for the feed back!

Honestly, I like the idea and the main pieces, I do think their might have to be a bit of tweaking to the deal but from a Winnipeg standpoint, if they could acquire Domi even if it is a touch of an over-pay, I would do it!

Yeah I'm pretty sure I've already commented on this thread or one very similar to it.. Lol
I think this is pretty fair for all teams involved.

I think this is great for the Jets, fills the 2C job with Domi who I think would be a great fit with Ehlers and Laine, gets rid of Lowry, moves Perreault out and get a a couple extra pieces for depth.

I wouldn't split hairs here on the value of the 1st, Vesalainen, Perreault or Lowry, it's a deal that works so take it and move on, that being said I'd only make a substantial trade for Domi if it was certain he could be signed to a 5 year or longer deal, if not it's definitely not worth wasting the assets on.

Yeah agreed on that last part. I usually assume the player is willing but just to nail it home, he was born in WPG, his dad played there, he loves Canadian markets, etc etc

If WPG is ok with I would assume 6*6 than its a done deal. He deserves what Ehlers got and frankly if he puts up a good 20-21 season (If there is one), he deserves more. Next to snipers like Laine and Ehlers, he gets 70 points easily.

It would leave the Jets with a line-up that would look something like:

Connor-Sheifele-Wheeler
Ehlers-Domi-Laine
Copp-Little-Roslovic
Harkins-Weal-Appleton

Assuming Domi can be signed for a reasonable amount, (ie $6M/yr or less) he would definitely help fill the 2C position. It has been a challenge finding a centre to work between Ehlers and Laine as they are unpredictable. Weal's $1.4M for the coming season is reasonable but he could be a one and done with UFA status at the end of the season. I have always wanted the Jets to land Honka. I don't think you are far off on value from the Winnipeg side. I don't think Domi will get to 70 points as he would be on PP2 with Ehlers, Little, Roslovic and Morrissey. Overall, seems like a good deal.