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Hindsight 2017-18 Team

Created by: AnalyticsGeek
Team: 2019-20 Pittsburgh Penguins
Initial Creation Date: Apr. 9, 2020
Published: Apr. 9, 2020
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Description
Regardless how good the back to back cup achievement felt as a Pens fan, it was still disappointing that they didn’t 3peat. They could’ve cemented their legacy as the best team of the salary cap era. It’s true that the Penguins likely ran out of gas that playoffs plus several key players were dealing with major injury, however, I still feel some moves could’ve been done differently throughout the season.

The Ryan Reaves trade was a mistake from the beginning. You never trade for a player who you know is not gonna fit into your team, regardless how good he is. They should’ve traded Oskar Sundqvist & their 2017 1st to Florida for Jared McCann instead. That would’ve given them a solution at 3C following the departure of Bonino & they wouldn’t have had to go after Brassard. Kevin Hayes was another option. JG Pageau as well.

I understand why the team signed Matt Hunwick as they lost both Trevor Daley and Ron Hainsey, plus, he played respectably in a top 4 role alongside Morgan Rielly the season before, but they should've traded for a younger right-handed defenseman. Trading Conor Sheary for Dylan DeMelo would've been perfect at the time.

Instead of trading for Brassard, I would’ve traded with Toronto for one of Marner or Kapanen instead.

The rest of the moves were fine, and while it's true this team would've probably had to have gotten blown up the season after, to win 3 straight cups would've been more than worth it.
Free Agent Signings
CREATEDYEARSCAP HIT
McCann, Jared
1$894,167
DeMelo, Dylan
1$700,000
Guentzel, Jake
2$870,000
Rust, Bryan
1$700,000
Hagelin, Carl
2$4,000,000
Kessel, Phil
4$6,800,000
Sheahan, Riley
1$2,075,000
Aston-Reese, Zach
2$925,000
Kuhnhackl, Tom
1$700,000
Maatta, Olli
5$4,083,333
Oleksiak, Jamie
1$2,137,000
Desmith, Casey
2$700,000
Rowney, Carter
1$700,000
Jooris, Josh
1$700,000
Kapanen, Kasperi
2$894,167
Hornqvist, Patric
1$4,250,000
Trades
1.
PIT
    Jared McCann

    *Done At 2017 Draft
    FLA
      Oskar Sundqvist
      2.
      PIT
        1st Round Pick (Henri Jokiharju)
        CHI
          2017 1st Round Pick
          2017 4th Round Pick

          *Done At 2017 Draft
          3.
          PIT
            Dylan DeMelo
            SJS
              Conor Sheary

              *Trade Done During 2017 Offseason
              4.
              PIT
                Kasperi Kapanen
                TOR
                  2018 1st Round Pick

                  *Done At Trade Deadline
                  Buried
                  DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
                  2020
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  2021
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the ANA
                  2022
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  Logo of the PIT
                  ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
                  25$75,000,000$72,361,167$132,500$0$2,638,833

                  Roster

                  Left WingCentreRight Wing
                  Guentzel, Jake
                  $870,000$870,000
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $8,700,000$8,700,000
                  C
                  NMC
                  UFA - 6
                  Hornqvist, Patric
                  $4,250,000$4,250,000
                  Hagelin, Carl
                  $4,000,000$4,000,000
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $9,500,000$9,500,000
                  C
                  NMC
                  UFA - 3
                  Rust, Bryan
                  $700,000$700,000
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $750,000$750,000
                  RW, LW
                  UFA - 1
                  Kessel, Phil
                  $6,800,000$6,800,000
                  Kapanen, Kasperi
                  $894,167$894,167
                  Aston-Reese, Zach
                  $925,000$925,000
                  McCann, Jared
                  $894,167$894,167
                  Sheahan, Riley
                  $2,075,000$2,075,000
                  Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $4,100,000$4,100,000
                  LD
                  M-NTC
                  UFA - 4
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $7,250,000$7,250,000
                  RD
                  M-NTC, NMC
                  UFA - 3
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $3,750,000$3,750,000
                  G
                  UFA - 1
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $5,500,000$5,500,000
                  RD
                  M-NTC
                  UFA - 1
                  DeMelo, Dylan
                  $700,000$700,000
                  Desmith, Casey
                  $700,000$700,000
                  Maatta, Olli
                  $4,083,333$4,083,333
                  Oleksiak, Jamie
                  $2,137,000$2,137,000
                  ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
                  Kuhnhackl, Tom
                  $700,000$700,000
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $4,500,000$4,500,000
                  LW, RW
                  UFA - 5
                  Jooris, Josh
                  $700,000$700,000
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $3,500,000$3,500,000
                  RW, LW
                  UFA - 3
                  Rowney, Carter
                  $700,000$700,000
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $3,500,000$3,500,000
                  LW, RW
                  M-NTC
                  UFA - 6
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $675,000$675,000
                  G
                  UFA - 1
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $5,500,000$5,500,000
                  LW, RW
                  M-NTC
                  UFA - 4
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $700,000$700,000
                  RD
                  UFA - 2
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $3,000,000$3,000,000
                  LW, RW
                  UFA - 1
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $1,250,000$1,250,000
                  C, LW
                  UFA - 1
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $1,000,000$1,000,000
                  LW, RW
                  UFA - 2
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $700,000$700,000
                  LW, C
                  UFA - 1
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $2,050,000$2,050,000
                  C, RW
                  UFA - 2
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $2,000,000$2,000,000
                  LW, C
                  UFA - 1
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $5,300,000$5,300,000
                  RW
                  NTC
                  UFA - 4
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $850,000$850,000
                  LD
                  UFA - 1
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $874,125$874,125
                  LD
                  UFA - 1
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$850,000$850K)
                  RD
                  UFA - 2
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $3,250,000$3,250,000
                  LD
                  UFA - 4
                  Logo of the Pittsburgh Penguins
                  $750,000$750,000
                  C, LW
                  UFA - 2

                  Special Teams

                  Power Play 1
                  Kessel, P.
                   
                  Power Play 2
                  McCann, J.
                  Guentzel, J.
                  Maatta, O.
                  Penalty Kill 1
                  Sheahan, R.
                  Kuhnhackl, T.
                  Penalty Kill 2
                  McCann, J.
                  Aston-Reese, Z.
                  Oleksiak, J.
                  DeMelo, D.

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                  Apr. 9, 2020 at 6:50 p.m.
                  #1
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                  Edited Apr. 10, 2020 at 11:25 a.m.
                  @Grusofsky96 @Chigurrhh @CHUG @mhockey91 @Sidstick87 @MajesticWalrus @ChampEddy @Eugene_Meltsner @acj @Sebybbq @MTF @NoWah49 @Marcsnack @csick @ryandrisc @TabooPenguo @Jr_pens @claysbar @Missouri

                  Do you guys think this team would've had a better chance at 3peating?
                  Apr. 9, 2020 at 6:51 p.m.
                  #2
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                  McCann at the time wouldn't have costed a first. Sheary for DeMelo could've worked. I think that trade happens in 2018 though after Sheary's "meh" season. He was worth more than DeMelo in 2017 after coming off back to back cups and leading the NHL in Even Strength Primary PPG. Marner trade NEVER would've happened
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                  Apr. 9, 2020 at 6:58 p.m.
                  #3
                  GoCanada
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                  Marner for Guentzel+Rust+Schutlz if they took him on an ELC
                  Apr. 9, 2020 at 7:19 p.m.
                  #4
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                  Quoting: mhockey91
                  McCann at the time wouldn't have costed a first. Sheary for DeMelo could've worked. I think that trade happens in 2018 though after Sheary's "meh" season. He was worth more than DeMelo in 2017 after coming off back to back cups and leading the NHL in Even Strength Primary PPG. Marner trade NEVER would've happened


                  Thanks for the feedback. You are right about the McCann trade & probably right about Sheary as well. Perhaps the Toronto trade is not realistic, but I feel the value would at least be fair for the Leafs.
                  Apr. 9, 2020 at 7:20 p.m.
                  #5
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                  Quoting: jassan28
                  Marner for Guentzel+Rust+Schutlz if they took him on an ELC


                  That’s too much. While Marner was only on an ELC, he wasn’t the 90 point player he is today. Pens weren’t gonna give up Guentzel who set a playoff record for goals by a rookie.
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                  Apr. 9, 2020 at 9:07 p.m.
                  #6
                  GoCanada
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                  Quoting: MitchMarnerElite
                  That’s too much. While Marner was only on an ELC, he wasn’t the 90 point player he is today. Pens weren’t gonna give up Guentzel who set a playoff record for goals by a rookie.


                  Marner was going to be a Patrick Kane with the London Knights rink, he was young, small and light but in the conversation for the Calder. Marner will be a perennial 100 point player but not much defensive game
                  Apr. 9, 2020 at 9:11 p.m.
                  #7
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                  Quoting: jassan28
                  Marner was going to be a Patrick Kane with the London Knights rink, he was young, small and light but in the conversation for the Calder. Marner will be a perennial 100 point player but not much defensive game


                  Marner’s defensive game was alright this season, he finished 13% above the league percentile in defensive contribution per Micah Blake McCurdy. I do expect him to hit 100 points multiple times.
                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 12:33 a.m.
                  #8
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                  I don't know.
                  I would like to think that bringing marner in might change the attitude a bit. But then again his father has rotted his head. He needed someone to cage Paul before it was too late.
                  I look at that TOR team, and what has happened there, especially with their cap, and I can't help but think Paul played a huge role in that and the attitude of those guys.

                  Does anyone really want Jake hanging around with Marner at that point. What does Jake ask for a contract with Paul's poison.
                  I don't think Marner would have ever fit in here, I think it would have had a detrimental effect.
                  Sometimes count your blessings for the things that didn't happen to you.
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                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 9:15 a.m.
                  #9
                  Hockey IQ
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                  Quoting: mhockey91
                  McCann at the time wouldn't have costed a first. Sheary for DeMelo could've worked. I think that trade happens in 2018 though after Sheary's "meh" season. He was worth more than DeMelo in 2017 after coming off back to back cups and leading the NHL in Even Strength Primary PPG. Marner trade NEVER would've happened


                  Quoting: MitchMarnerElite
                  Thanks for the feedback. You are right about the McCann trade & probably right about Sheary as well. Perhaps the Toronto trade is not realistic, but I feel the value would at least be fair for the Leafs.


                  Shearys value was at its peak then, and as a result the pens wouldn’t have wanted to move him. He was a great winger for Sid that season. McCann wasn’t all that much then so he wouldn’t cost that much. Sheary trade would probably work. About the “weekly Toronto MM deal”, I ultimately think Toronto wouldn’t give up on a young player that soon. Even if he had a slump, he was still very young and Toronto was rebuilding so why trade a piece of that?
                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 9:17 a.m.
                  #10
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                  Quoting: pharrow
                  I don't know.
                  I would like to think that bringing marner in might change the attitude a bit. But then again his father has rotted his head. He needed someone to cage Paul before it was too late.
                  I look at that TOR team, and what has happened there, especially with their cap, and I can't help but think Paul played a huge role in that and the attitude of those guys.

                  Does anyone really want Jake hanging around with Marner at that point. What does Jake ask for a contract with Paul's poison.
                  I don't think Marner would have ever fit in here, I think it would have had a detrimental effect.
                  Sometimes count your blessings for the things that didn't happen to you.


                  Very possible. Who knows if we had traded for Marner we might have traded him away last year because we couldn’t afford him. Even if he took less than 10.9, it would of had to be a bridge for 6-7M. Jake might have asked for a big deal too with that voice in his ear.
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                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 11:12 a.m.
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                  Quoting: Pens3lieve
                  Shearys value was at its peak then, and as a result the pens wouldn’t have wanted to move him. He was a great winger for Sid that season. McCann wasn’t all that much then so he wouldn’t cost that much. Sheary trade would probably work. About the “weekly Toronto MM deal”, I ultimately think Toronto wouldn’t give up on a young player that soon. Even if he had a slump, he was still very young and Toronto was rebuilding so why trade a piece of that?


                  Thanks for the feedback. All fair points.
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                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 11:14 a.m.
                  #12
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                  Quoting: pharrow
                  I don't know.
                  I would like to think that bringing marner in might change the attitude a bit. But then again his father has rotted his head. He needed someone to cage Paul before it was too late.
                  I look at that TOR team, and what has happened there, especially with their cap, and I can't help but think Paul played a huge role in that and the attitude of those guys.

                  Does anyone really want Jake hanging around with Marner at that point. What does Jake ask for a contract with Paul's poison.
                  I don't think Marner would have ever fit in here, I think it would have had a detrimental effect.
                  Sometimes count your blessings for the things that didn't happen to you.


                  Quoting: Pens3lieve
                  Very possible. Who knows if we had traded for Marner we might have traded him away last year because we couldn’t afford him. Even if he took less than 10.9, it would of had to be a bridge for 6-7M. Jake might have asked for a big deal too with that voice in his ear.


                  Yeah no doubt Mitch Marner’s dad is a cancer & his behaviour negatively impacted both his son & the team. Most likely they would’ve had to trade him after 2018-19 because they could only afford one of him & Jake.
                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 11:29 a.m.
                  #13
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                  Edited Apr. 10, 2020 at 11:59 a.m.
                  @PakNation7 @Jesus @datools @nixon1331 @AFOX10900 @leafs101 @justaboss @OldNYIfan @SlickWilly @exo2769 @buffalofan @rangersandislesfan What’d you guys think of this hindsight Pens team I made for 2017-18? Do you think they would’ve 3peated?
                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 11:41 a.m.
                  #14
                  What in tarnation
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                  Marner was just picked 4th overall two years before and had been playing a near 70 point season - a rare feat for a 20 year old player. That offer would've been a laughable joke even then.
                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 12:03 p.m.
                  #15
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                  Quoting: justaBoss
                  Marner was just picked 4th overall two years before and had been playing a near 70 point season - a rare feat for a 20 year old player. That offer would've been a laughable joke even then.


                  Yeah but you have to keep in mind Hornqvist was a 30 goal scorer back then & Cole was a good top 4 defender. That gives everything Toronto needs, add the top goalie prospect & 1st round pick, it’s a significant package.
                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 12:27 p.m.
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                  I think they wouldve 3peated if they had gotten past the Caps, so in that regard I think I would keep Hornqvist and add a James Neal gritty but scoring guy, because Wilson ran right through them that serious and just tilted the heck out of the Pens. I dont think a grinder would've helped, but someone to agitate back while putting pucks in the zone would have definitely set them apart. It was a really close series though and Idk how much different it wouldve needed to be
                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 1:14 p.m.
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                  Quoting: SlickWilly
                  I think they wouldve 3peated if they had gotten past the Caps, so in that regard I think I would keep Hornqvist and add a James Neal gritty but scoring guy, because Wilson ran right through them that serious and just tilted the heck out of the Pens. I dont think a grinder would've helped, but someone to agitate back while putting pucks in the zone would have definitely set them apart. It was a really close series though and Idk how much different it wouldve needed to be


                  Thanks for the feedback. Indeed the Caps beat the Pens real bad on the physical side of the game. I definitely could’ve kept Hornqvist & I love Neal, but I’m not sure if that was the reason why the Caps won. It seemed the Penguins had a lack of contribution from depth players & had a number of defensive breakdowns that costed them the series. They seemed to have the upper hand in controlling play. Perhaps I could’ve traded that Marner package for someone like Tkachuk instead.
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                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 2:15 p.m.
                  #18
                  What in tarnation
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                  Quoting: MitchMarnerElite
                  Yeah but you have to keep in mind Hornqvist was a 30 goal scorer back then & Cole was a good top 4 defender. That gives everything Toronto needs, add the top goalie prospect & 1st round pick, it’s a significant package.


                  Back then TOR was no good, still retooling. Hörnqvist and Cole would've been completely unnecessary for them.
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                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 4:25 p.m.
                  #19
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                  Quoting: justaBoss
                  Back then TOR was no good, still retooling. Hörnqvist and Cole would've been completely unnecessary for them.


                  The Leafs were a playoff team that season & took Boston to 7 games. Hornqvist would’ve given some grit, checking & clutch scoring ability whereas Cole would’ve added stability & physicality to their defense. Their team could’ve been:

                  Hyman-Matthews-Nylander
                  Marleau-Kadri-Hornqvist
                  JVR-Bozak-Brown
                  Komarov-Plekanec-Martin

                  Cole-Gardiner
                  Rielly-Hainsey
                  Dermott-Zaitsev

                  Definitely a playoff team that could at least win a series.
                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 4:30 p.m.
                  #20
                  Hockey IQ
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                  Quoting: MitchMarnerElite
                  The Leafs were a playoff team that season & took Boston to 7 games. Hornqvist would’ve given some grit, checking & clutch scoring ability whereas Cole would’ve added stability & physicality to their defense. Their team could’ve been:

                  Hyman-Matthews-Nylander
                  Marleau-Kadri-Hornqvist
                  JVR-Bozak-Brown
                  Komarov-Plekanec-Martin

                  Cole-Gardiner
                  Rielly-Hainsey
                  Dermott-Zaitsev

                  Definitely a playoff team that could at least win a series.


                  Could win a playoff series in theory against anyone but boston...lol. boston has their number.
                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 4:35 p.m.
                  #21
                  What in tarnation
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                  Quoting: MitchMarnerElite
                  The Leafs were a playoff team that season & took Boston to 7 games. Hornqvist would’ve given some grit, checking & clutch scoring ability whereas Cole would’ve added stability & physicality to their defense. Their team could’ve been:

                  Hyman-Matthews-Nylander
                  Marleau-Kadri-Hornqvist
                  JVR-Bozak-Brown
                  Komarov-Plekanec-Martin

                  Cole-Gardiner
                  Rielly-Hainsey
                  Dermott-Zaitsev

                  Definitely a playoff team that could at least win a series.


                  While they may have had some impact for the team, it's inconceivable that what Marner brought them was much more of use...he was statistically their best player. 39th overall in points, Hörnqvist 119th. Not to mention he was just 20 years old on his ELC, while Hörnqvist and Cole were both pending UFAs...

                  Once again, absolutely zero reason for Leafs to even consider it.

                  Leafs' team could've win a playoff series with the team they had. They just f*cked it up in the last game.
                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 5:02 p.m.
                  #22
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                  Quoting: justaBoss
                  While they may have had some impact for the team, it's inconceivable that what Marner brought them was much more of use...he was statistically their best player. 39th overall in points, Hörnqvist 119th. Not to mention he was just 20 years old on his ELC, while Hörnqvist and Cole were both pending UFAs...

                  Once again, absolutely zero reason for Leafs to even consider it.

                  Leafs' team could've win a playoff series with the team they had. They just f*cked it up in the last game.


                  I understand what you’re trying to say but personally, I still believe the offer is substantial enough for Toronto. Hornqvist & Cole would’ve both been great fits with the team plus had playoff experience. If TOR wanted to extend them, it was very possible.
                  Apr. 10, 2020 at 5:03 p.m.
                  #23
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                  Quoting: Pens3lieve
                  Could win a playoff series in theory against anyone but boston...lol. boston has their number.


                  Agree they will never win against Boston.
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                  Apr. 14, 2020 at 11:16 a.m.
                  #24
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                  Yeah I think so! I really like what you've done here! I'm always a "think big" kinda guy and I really like the addition of Marner.
                  Apr. 14, 2020 at 11:21 a.m.
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                  Quoting: Missouri
                  Yeah I think so! I really like what you've done here! I'm always a "think big" kinda guy and I really like the addition of Marner.


                  Thanks for the feedback. I think Marner would’ve added more dynamic to the Pens offence for sure.
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