Risto is not getting you Henrique and a second. Henrique is on pace for 30 goals.

good for him.

Hes also on pace to already be 30 years old making 5.85 million a year on a rebuilding team.

The 2nd is because he has over 12 million more left on his contract than ristolainen, who is 5 years younger.

They need Rh d but Risto isn't good. Henrique isn't bad. They just extended his contract and they aren't trading him right away unless they get a good deal.
If anything Buffalo should have to add to this trade

Well, I stated my reasoning, you've stated yours, we disagree, lets move on.

I will only add that he signed his contract in July of 2018. So they didn't just sign him. When they signed him they were coming off a 101 point season in 2017-18. they followed that up with an 80 point season and currently have 67 points.

can i ask a serious question in hopes of getting a serious or at least well thought out answer?

what is the trade value of Risto, realistically?
take the emotion out of it, the fact that he has term on his deal and his age - forget that he was a former 1st rounder...

look at the actual facts, his past performance.
isn't it a fair statement to say that he is worth way more to Buffalo and the return, if it ever happens will be completely underwhelming to most fans?

I don't know what his value is, but I would certainly guarantee he is thought of better in league circles than he is on here (I do not like Ristolainen). He is still young enough and has the skill set that a team will think they can get more out of him than buffalo did.

I dont think trading for a 5.85 million 30 year old with 4 years left on a rebuilding team and a pick 2 drafts from now is asking a lot.

ok, so you mention his skill set...what is his skill set?
if you ask me, right now his skill set is his age, size, contract and the understanding that he was a former first rounder. that is it.

size and skating. he is physical and he has offensive skill.

Risto's value is hard to pin down, best comparison in the league is probably Ghost (i think Ristos is a little higher though) however neither has actually been moved so I would say Athanasiou might be the next best. He went for a retained cap dump and 2 2nds. IMO Henrique is overachieving this year a bit so its safe to say there should be some regression next season. TBH i think thd calue here is pretty accurate.

does he really have offensive skill though? he isn't a PP QB, more than 50% of his total points come on the powerplay as assists and if that was broken down they are more than likely secondary assists.
he has trouble moving the puck out of his own end, makes bad decisions and has virtually zero hockey IQ.
i agree that his size and physicality are his 2 biggest assets, but as the game gets faster and faster it will pass him by.

so i ask again, what does a big and physical dman with zero hockey IG get on the trade market?
my opinion is that Buffalo should be happy with a conditional 3rd that becomes a 2nd if Risto hits some sort of milestone or a bottom end middle 6 winger that puts up 40-50 points.

he isn't getting Buffalo a 1st or a 2C...

I mean, he is a power play QB. Your first two sentences contradict each other.

Yes, he has flaws. If he was his size and speed and with his skill, if he didn't have flaws no one would trade him.

I've made my points about Henrique already, so have others.

a PP QB isn't defined by secondary assists...
at most he is a 5/6 dman - what do those cost these days?

You are entitled to your opinion.

I've stated mine multiple times, others have weighed in. Maybe its time to move on.

ok bub. good chat.

The truth here is probably in the middle somewhere. A 25 year old RHD on a reasonable contract that has the ability (not saying he should) to play 23-25 minutes a night that has size, aggression, and offensive ability will definitely attract some teams. He had 4 straight seasons over 40 points and was well on his way this season for a fifth straight under the age of 25... he has offensive skill. In the new analytics driven world, his value is probably hurt for sure but I don’t think he is a guy nobody will touch. The old gentleman’s club of GMs I’m sure has a few people who would be licking their chops at him. Henrique and a 2nd rounder may be sort of high for his value, but a bottom-6 winger is definitely a ridiculous low ball

I said a bottom end MIDDLE 6 winger, even a 3C - not a 4th line winger...

So by your own standards Risto for Henrique straight up is fair right? Henrique falls into that very bottom 2C/ 3C. With how the cap world works, the addition of the pick balances out the difference in age and the fact that Henrique’s contract runs til he’s 35. Guess I just don’t see how is that unreasonable.

my original post never mentions value of the trade here. i just wanted to understand what Risto's value truly was in the eyes of a Buffalo fan.
to answer your question, i think the framework of Risto for AH is not an unreasonable trade, but I do believe that the 2nd going back to Buffalo is.

Risto and a 4th, with a condition on it for AH would be reasonable in my opinion.

I'd rather have Pilut.

If that’s the case the Sabres would pass. AH isn’t going to get any better on the wrong side of 30 (Risto prolly isn’t either). In a vacuum Risto (40 point dman, even if they come from the PP) with his size even with the deficiencies, isn’t worth less then a 45 point and declining 2C/3C that’s got a higher Cap hit and runs through age 35. Better off just keeping him and letting his contract run out then adding what will be dead weight by the end of it.

exactly the point i'm trying to make here. his value lies with Buffalo, he has very little value to anyone else in the NHL - I would argue though that 5 years of AH would probably be more productive than 5 years of Risto, regardless of age.

His value is a prolly a little higher in NHL circles (you know, where it actually matters then on here. It’s not like he’s a 6/7 dman. He’s a prolly a number low3/high 4, when used correctly. AH is that low 2C/high 3C. Give me the younger player of those two every day.