Forums/Armchair-GM

RNH and Ristolainen

Created by: truculence67
Initial Creation Date: May 24, 2020
Published: May 24 at 4:02 pm
Team: 2020-21 Winnipeg Jets
Free Agent Signings
RESERVE LISTYEARSCAP HIT
Puljujärvi, Jesse3$925,000
Virtanen, Santeri3$825,000
Chisholm, Declan3$800,000
Neaton, Logan3$800,000
RFAYEARSCAP HIT
Roslovic, Jack3$2,750,000
Niku, Sami2$1,500,000
Appleton, Mason2$800,000
Harkins, Jansen2$800,000
Spacek, Michael1$700,000
UFAYEARSCAP HIT
Edmundson, Joel3$3,400,000
Elliott, Brian1$1,500,000
Bitetto, Anthony1$900,000
Griffith, Seth1$700,000
Letestu, Mark1$700,000
Lipon, JC1$700,000
McKenzie, Curtis1$700,000
Trades
WPG
  1. Nugent-Hopkins, Ryan
  2. Puljujärvi, Jesse [Reserve List]
Additional Details:
7.5x8mil extension for RNH
EDM
  1. Ehlers, Nikolaj
  2. Gustafsson, David
WPG
  1. Ristolainen, Rasmus
BUF
  1. Gawanke, Leon
  2. 2021 2nd round pick (WPG)
  3. 2022 3rd round pick (WPG)
DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
2020
WPG
WPG
WPG
WPG
2021
WPG
WPG
WPG
WPG
2022
WPG
WPG
WPG
WPG
WPG
WPG
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES BONUSESCAP SPACE
23$82,500,000$79,500,356$0$850,000$2,999,644
Left WingCenterRight Wing
WPG
Connor, Kyle
$7,142,857
LW
UFA - 6
WPG
Scheifele, Mark
$6,125,000
C
NTC
UFA - 4
WPG
Wheeler, Blake
$8,250,000
RW, C
NMC
UFA - 4
WPG
Laine, Patrik
$6,750,000
LW, RW
RFA - 1
EDM
Nugent-Hopkins, Ryan
$6,000,000
C, LW
UFA - 1
WPG
Roslovic, Jack
$2,750,000
RW, C
RFA
WPG
Vesalainen, Kristian
$894,167
LW, RW
RFA - 2
WPG
Copp, Andrew
$2,280,000
C, LW
RFA - 1
Puljujärvi, Jesse
$925,000
RW
RFA
WPG
Perreault, Mathieu
$4,125,000
LW, C
NTC
UFA - 1
WPG
Lowry, Adam
$2,916,666
C
UFA - 1
WPG
Appleton, Mason
$800,000
RW, C
RFA
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
WPG
Morrissey, Joshua
$6,250,000
LD
UFA - 8
WPG
Pionk, Neal
$3,000,000
RD
RFA - 1
WPG
Hellebuyck, Connor
$6,166,666
G
UFA - 4
WPG
Niku, Sami
$1,500,000
RD
RFA
BUF
Ristolainen, Rasmus
$5,400,000
RD
UFA - 2
Elliott, Brian
$1,500,000
G
UFA
Edmundson, Joel
$3,400,000
LD
UFA
WPG
Poolman, Tucker
$775,000
RD
UFA - 1
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
WPG
Bitetto, Anthony
$900,000
LD
UFA
WPG
Little, Bryan
$5,291,666
C, RW
NTC
UFA - 4
WPG
Dahlström, Carl
$850,000
LD
RFA - 1
WPG
Harkins, Jansen
$800,000
C
RFA

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May 24 at 4:08
#1
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,654
Likes: 661
no thanks
May 24 at 4:13
#2
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 2,068
Likes: 717
Quoting: sabres1108
no thanks


So what’s risto worth?
May 24 at 4:19
#3
Hardcore Sabres fan
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 7,852
Likes: 1,185
Quoting: Cheddamonkey37
So what’s risto worth?


Roslovic + a 2nd or Ehlers for Ristolainen +
sabres1108 liked this.
May 24 at 4:21
#4
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 2,068
Likes: 717
Quoting: Zach
Roslovic + a 2nd or Ehlers for Ristolainen +


LOL pretty heavy price for someone who can’t play d.. yikes try lowering ur expectations guy is a pp specialist that’s about it
CD282 and masterjuddi liked this.
May 24 at 4:21
#5
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,654
Likes: 661
Quoting: Cheddamonkey37
So what’s risto worth?


Copp + 3rd round pick
May 24 at 4:24
#6
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 561
Likes: 64
Quoting: sabres1108
no thanks


Buffalo won’t get a better deal than this one from any team. Plenty of puck moving UFA RD’s out there and teams are well aware that the Sabres want to offload one of miller/montour/ristolainen
MisstheWhalers liked this.
May 24 at 4:27
#7
Subbanator
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 3,249
Likes: 1,055
If you're looking to get a 2C for Ehlers I think there are better ones you can get then RNH, especially since he is going to want a raise on his next contract.
May 24 at 4:39
#8
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,654
Likes: 661
Quoting: Subbanator7667
If you're looking to get a 2C for Ehlers I think there are better ones you can get then RNH, especially since he is going to want a raise on his next contract.


RNH is a top 30 center in the NHL so hes basically a 1C considering theres 31 teams....cant get a much better 2C than that unless you look at like McDavid-Draisaitl, Crosby-Malkin, Matthews-Tavares etc
truculence67 and CD282 liked this.
May 24 at 5:09
#9
Subbanator
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 3,249
Likes: 1,055
Quoting: sabres1108
RNH is a top 30 center in the NHL so hes basically a 1C considering theres 31 teams....cant get a much better 2C than that unless you look at like McDavid-Draisaitl, Crosby-Malkin, Matthews-Tavares etc


Top 30 center? Come on man. His point totals have always been supported with a superstar playing with him. He is a good two way center that if playing away from a star player is still a 50 point guy, would make a good 2C but he is going to be a 7.5 million dollar guy for what's likely the the years he is leaving his prime.

If you're trading Ehlers you could look for someone younger and has his best years in front of him, not behind.
May 24 at 5:16
#10
MisstheWhalers
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 8,761
Likes: 3,148
This isn't a terrible offer for Ristolainen actually but it should probably be a 2nd in this draft, Gawanke had a good first year in the AHL, is a RHD with a big shot from the point and I think trading Ristolainen for a futures package to free up cap space to use elsewhere in the lineup might be the best thing the Sabres could do at this point.
May 24 at 5:42
#11
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,654
Likes: 661
Quoting: Subbanator7667
Top 30 center? Come on man. His point totals have always been supported with a superstar playing with him. He is a good two way center that if playing away from a star player is still a 50 point guy, would make a good 2C but he is going to be a 7.5 million dollar guy for what's likely the the years he is leaving his prime.

If you're trading Ehlers you could look for someone younger and has his best years in front of him, not behind.



How I would rank the top 50 Centers....RNH i have at C#27....you cant possibly have him any worse than maybe 34!

McDavid 97
Crosby 95
Mackinnon 94
Draisaitl 93
Matthews 92
Eichel 92
Malkin 91
Bergeron 90
Barkov 90
Stamkos 89
Pettersson 89
Tavares 89
Aho 89
Point 89
O’Reilly 89
Couturier 89
Scheifele 89
Zibanejad 89
Kopitar 89
Barzal 88
Seguin 88
Backstrom 87
Kuznetsov 87
Toews 87
Couture 87
Larkin 86
Nugent-Hopkins 86
Cirelli 85
Hertl 85
Horvat 85
Duchene 85
Monahan 85
W Karlsson 85
Danault 84
Schenn 84
Dubois 84
Hischier 84
E Staal 84
Krejci 84
Kadri 84
Domi 84
Hayes 83
R Johansen 83
Henrique 82
Getzlaf 82
Stastny 82
Trocheck 82
Backlund 82
R Strome 82
D Strome 82
truculence67 liked this.
May 24 at 5:44
#12
G O S I M E K
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 930
Likes: 368
Quoting: Cheddamonkey37
LOL pretty heavy price for someone who can’t play d.. yikes try lowering ur expectations guy is a pp specialist that’s about it


Risto is better than users here give him credit to be.
May 24 at 5:46
#13
G O S I M E K
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 930
Likes: 368
Quoting: sabres1108
How I would rank the top 50 Centers....RNH i have at C#27....you cant possibly have him any worse than maybe 34!

McDavid 97
Crosby 95
Mackinnon 94
Draisaitl 93
Matthews 92
Eichel 92
Malkin 91
Bergeron 90
Barkov 90
Stamkos 89
Pettersson 89
Tavares 89
Aho 89
Point 89
O’Reilly 89
Couturier 89
Scheifele 89
Zibanejad 89
Kopitar 89
Barzal 88
Seguin 88
Backstrom 87
Kuznetsov 87
Toews 87
Couture 87
Larkin 86
Nugent-Hopkins 86
Cirelli 85
Hertl 85
Horvat 85
Duchene 85
Monahan 85
W Karlsson 85
Danault 84
Schenn 84
Dubois 84
Hischier 84
E Staal 84
Krejci 84
Kadri 84
Domi 84
Hayes 83
R Johansen 83
Henrique 82
Getzlaf 82
Stastny 82
Trocheck 82
Backlund 82
R Strome 82
D Strome 82

Your rankings are really solid. I want to find something to argue about but I can’t. It’s very well done.
sabres1108 liked this.
May 24 at 5:48
#14
G O S I M E K
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 930
Likes: 368
Quoting: Subbanator7667
If you're looking to get a 2C for Ehlers I think there are better ones you can get then RNH, especially since he is going to want a raise on his next contract.

Just because a player is going to get paid in his next contract does not lower his value. They usually earn a raise for a reason.
May 24 at 5:50
#15
Subbanator
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 3,249
Likes: 1,055
Quoting: sabres1108
How I would rank the top 50 Centers....RNH i have at C#27....you cant possibly have him any worse than maybe 34!

McDavid 97
Crosby 95
Mackinnon 94
Draisaitl 93
Matthews 92
Eichel 92
Malkin 91
Bergeron 90
Barkov 90
Stamkos 89
Pettersson 89
Tavares 89
Aho 89
Point 89
O’Reilly 89
Couturier 89
Scheifele 89
Zibanejad 89
Kopitar 89
Barzal 88
Seguin 88
Backstrom 87
Kuznetsov 87
Toews 87
Couture 87
Larkin 86
Nugent-Hopkins 86
Cirelli 85
Hertl 85
Horvat 85
Duchene 85
Monahan 85
W Karlsson 85
Danault 84
Schenn 84
Dubois 84
Hischier 84
E Staal 84
Krejci 84
Kadri 84
Domi 84
Hayes 83
R Johansen 83
Henrique 82
Getzlaf 82
Stastny 82
Trocheck 82
Backlund 82
R Strome 82
D Strome 82


This is difficult though because he hasnt been playing center consistently for a few years now, where as there are guys you have after him that have been playing top line minutes against the best players while playing with players far worst then McDavid and Draistle.

To me, RNHs value is what he would be to the team he is going to, not what he is playing with McDavid , Draistle and before that Hall. To any other team I think he is just a 50-60 point 2 way center and that's the high end projection, if he ends up being more of a product then a driver you're looking at a 30-40 point center and that's the low side.

As to your list, I would put Danault, Duchene, Cirelli, Hertle, Schenn and Dubious above him. Hischier, and Domi will likely be better then him by the time they reach his age.

Like I said though, he is a player that you dont know what he is away from playing with a star beside him.
May 24 at 5:57
#16
Subbanator
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 3,249
Likes: 1,055
Quoting: Lord_Simek
Just because a player is going to get paid in his next contract does not lower his value. They usually earn a raise for a reason.


He will be looking for a long term contract 6-7 years, he will be 28 when its signed, do you want a 33 and 34 year old RNH making 7.5 million on your cap?

Ehler is 3 years younger, if you're trading him go get a younger center that will be cheaper for longer then RNH will be. One that's entering his prime like Ehlers is, not signing his next contract to close out his prime.
May 24 at 6:03
#17
MisstheWhalers
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 8,761
Likes: 3,148
Quoting: truculence67
Buffalo won’t get a better deal than this one from any team. Plenty of puck moving UFA RD’s out there and teams are well aware that the Sabres want to offload one of miller/montour/ristolainen


You're exactly right, there's a lot of dmen available in free agency both left and right shot so if teams want to improve their backend without parting with assets they're gonna have quite a few options plus with a likely flat cap and few teams with cap space a lot of these UFA dmen probably aren't looking at big paydays.

I think Ristolainen gets a bad rap but there's a lot working against the Sabres getting a big return for him and really this is a fair or close to fair offer imo.
CD282 liked this.
May 24 at 6:08
#18
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 2,068
Likes: 717
Quoting: Lord_Simek
Risto is better than users here give him credit to be.


I mean not really he’s just not a good dman pal
May 24 at 6:16
#19
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,654
Likes: 661
Quoting: Subbanator7667
This is difficult though because he hasnt been playing center consistently for a few years now, where as there are guys you have after him that have been playing top line minutes against the best players while playing with players far worst then McDavid and Draistle.

To me, RNHs value is what he would be to the team he is going to, not what he is playing with McDavid , Draistle and before that Hall. To any other team I think he is just a 50-60 point 2 way center and that's the high end projection, if he ends up being more of a product then a driver you're looking at a 30-40 point center and that's the low side.

As to your list, I would put Danault, Duchene, Cirelli, Hertle, Schenn and Dubious above him. Hischier, and Domi will likely be better then him by the time they reach his age.

Like I said though, he is a player that you dont know what he is away from playing with a star beside him.



ya but youre looking at him riding backseat with McDavid and Draisaitl doing the heavy lifting, you think that on a different team away from those guys his point totals automatically drop?

what if when given a bigger role on the team he would improve his numbers even further to prove why he was a #1 overall pick hes still relatively young not like hes 31 years old
May 24 at 6:31
#20
Subbanator
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 3,249
Likes: 1,055
Quoting: sabres1108
ya but youre looking at him riding backseat with McDavid and Draisaitl doing the heavy lifting, you think that on a different team away from those guys his point totals automatically drop?

what if when given a bigger role on the team he would improve his numbers even further to prove why he was a #1 overall pick hes still relatively young not like hes 31 years old


He has been playing top line minutes though, as a winger. He hasnt played out of the top 6 since he was like 18 in Edmonton, they threw him to the wolves right away. I definitely think his numbers drop, not ridiculously, but likely down to the 50 point range and that's year one, you would still have him signed for 6 more.

Not saying he is horrible or anything, trading Ehlers means getting a 22-25 year old good second line center that could be more of a 1A in the future though, not a past prime two way center that is making a big cap hit
May 24 at 6:48
#21
G O S I M E K
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 930
Likes: 368
Quoting: Cheddamonkey37
I mean not really he’s just not a good dman pal


That substantive quote just convinced me to change my mind. Thanks.
sabres1108 liked this.
May 24 at 7:05
#22
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 2,068
Likes: 717
Quoting: Lord_Simek
That substantive quote just convinced me to change my mind. Thanks.


I mean you just saw my past comment why do I need to re peat myself..? You also did a really good job showing me how he’s a good dman! Plz tell me what he does that’s anything special?
May 24 at 7:30
#23
G O S I M E K
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 930
Likes: 368
Quoting: Cheddamonkey37
I mean you just saw my past comment why do I need to re peat myself..? You also did a really good job showing me how he’s a good dman! Plz tell me what he does that’s anything special?


Thank you,
May 24 at 8:28
#24
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 284
Likes: 116
Quoting: Zach
Roslovic + a 2nd or Ehlers for Ristolainen +


Lol. This is not even close.
Jets shoudn't trade for Risto. Re-sign DeMelo and keep the assets.
CD282 liked this.
May 24 at 8:42
#25
Kafle
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 2,007
Likes: 352
Quoting: Subbanator7667
Top 30 center? Come on man. His point totals have always been supported with a superstar playing with him. He is a good two way center that if playing away from a star player is still a 50 point guy, would make a good 2C but he is going to be a 7.5 million dollar guy for what's likely the the years he is leaving his prime.

If you're trading Ehlers you could look for someone younger and has his best years in front of him, not behind.


You could say that for any player. You could say marner make johnny T look good or marchand makes bergeron look good
CD282 liked this.
 
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