The value on the Hamilton trade is way off. Hamilton might be a top 5 defenseman in the league and you are trading spare parts for him. To give you an idea, i wouldnt say Marner is enough to get Hamilton not to mention Hamilton retained +.

Delete this before Canes fans see

Marner would certainly get it done if Canes weren't re-signing him and he was planning to hit free agency. IF it was a 1 year rental itd cost a 1st and Kapanen probably

You do not get any cap relief if u place a player on LTIR before the teams roster goes into the league day before the season. A team only gets cap relief if kesler is on your roster when it is submitted to the league and the team is cap compliant then placed on LTIR. Example = player 1 makes 1mill and the team has 200 000 $ in cap space when the roster is submitted to the league then player 1 is placed on LTIR so the cap relief is then calculated 1mill player salary - 200 000$ of available cap space = 800 000$ of cap relief the team now has.
Not sure if u are just buying a 3rd rounder and u dont care about LTIR relief

This actually isnt accurate as we've seen from last summer and a few other times. You can have a roster player on LTIR during the summer if he had a long term injury from the season before. You could not place him there if he suffered the injury during the summer.

Who did St Louis have last year for LHD? Anything remotely close to Rielly or Muzzin? Nope but they had two top end RHD. The Leafs don't need to trade Marner for a defenceman. Lehtonen could very well be a terrific partner for Rielly next season. The Leafs should move one or two of Kap, Johnsson and Kerfoot for cheaper assets and call it a day.

Thats not even what I was saying, just responded to Buddy saying Marner couldnt get Dougie if Canes weren't even retaining him which is completely incorrect

OK, but the jist of it is still accurate. Getting Kesler does not provide the Leafs with extra capspace (who cares about a summer loophole).

True but we are talking about the same thing. U still need to be cap compliant in order to hit the upper limit relief.

Does that trade work for Pesce? Hamilton with one year left isn't worth Marner. But if Kap and a 1st get it done, I would have to believe that the Leafs would entertain.

Player placed on LTIR previous season or seasons or during the summer = 0 $ in cap relief
Its all about being cap compliant and placing a player on LTIR after roster is submitted to the league in order to get any cap relief. If this wasnt the case the leafs would just trade for every LTIR player and gain that cap space circumventing the salary cap

Sometimes its fun seeing new members shoot themselves in the foot as soon as they get here.
Sorry dude, not only does your offer not even remotely resemble the Flames - Cane trade, its also painfully lopsided. You should really delete this for your own health.
Im to tired to get mad at this

No the value of Pesce is at least Nylander, hes the best defensive D in the league. and still only the 3rd best defense on the team

When people say the Canes defense is insane they arent kidding

I have to agree with move Johnsson's salary and call it a day. But that is also the boring answer. Not sure Martinook & Anderson are an upgrade on Kerfoot & Kapanen but this was done in the mindset of appeasing anti-Leafs Nation that says they are too soft and they need more defense... Also agree with the potential of Lehtonen with Rielly - I am interested but have never seen him play but like the idea more than Dermott as his partner.

It's clear to me at this point that non leaf fans on here will say any good right handed defenceman is worth Matthews. It's ridiculous bottom 4 right handed guys are worth Nylander on this site. "BUT HE SHOOTS RIGHT HANDED" 🙃

I also find it hilarious that St Louis had pretty much nothing for lefties but had two good righties on their blue line and won. What hand a player shoots is hardly as big a deal as people think it is. Give Lehtonen a try with Rielly, if it works out the defence is really good. Or at least beyond good enough to win.

Exactly - and Pesce is locked up. Premise of this idea is that Hamilton is on an expiring deal and Canes played well while he was hurt. Kapanen & Dermott will fetch a Top 4 somewhere, but interested in the feedback on Hamilton.

Lol Pesce is so overrated. Take him out of that system or make him the number one without Slavin and Hamilton doing all the heavy lifting I bet he loses a lot of this luster. He's a good player for sure and would be a good partner for Rielly but he's a secondary piece. You don't get players of Nylander's calibre for secondary pieces.

Who knows what happens next year at training camp, I am not against sending Sandin and Liljegren down but if they force their way into the top 6 awesome. If Dermott is the best option sending one of those guys down for some extra seasoning isn't a bad idea. I sort of hope Liljegren clicks next year and gets the 3RD spot. Maybe you trade Dermott at that point if he's sought after. Otherwise your #7 is really good, which is also pretty awesome.

dewd - fishing for value, not are argument. The funny part about the "old" members of this site is that everyone overvalues their own players and they just get triggered at ideas like they are real. Lol. Some guy is trading Matthews to Buffalo. And Mackenzie Weegar is worth $5m in "spare parts" but only signs for $3m on a team that has publically stated that they need to cut $10m in salary. Instead of getting mad, how about contributing with an idea of who has what value?

Can;t agree more - defense when healthy is better than people give credit. Fun to tinker in the what if, but really expect it to be what is there minus Mango. And to be honest, would hate to see him moved out simply because of the cap isn;t going up, but thems the breaks.

The idea was taking on the contract to move up a round, which round I don;t know. But Horton & Clarkson are examples just this year of where LTIR was used on existing long term injuries to create cap flexibility. If anyone has it figured out, it's Brandon Pridham. So take the contract if it adds value, or don;t. The fact is that Mango likely has to move for less than value pick to manage the $81.5m cap.

It will happen many more times in the next 8 years or so. We'll see lots of secondary guys come up through the ranks, impress and then get traded. The core will remain but the rest will change in an out often.

Ok lets go over the value of the Flames/Canes Dougie trade real quick.
Canes also received expiring contract Ferland and top end prospect Fox along with Hamilton

Flames recieved former top 5 pick Lindholm and former top 5 pick Hanifin. Both of which played top 6/top 4 in Carolina at the time of the trade.
Flames were also looking to move both Hamilton and Fox due to in house issues.

What you are offering is former top 30 pick and established middle 6 player Kapanen, as well as former mid 2nd round pick Dermott. Even if you remove Fox and Ferland from the original trade value this is still pretty far off.

Now lets go over Hamiltons value since the trade happened. Canes fans, teammates, and staff love him. So there is no desire to move him. Hes also coming off a Norris caliber season that ended early due to injury. So basically regardless of his term his value has skyrocket. Hes also in the midst of his prime. The cost to entertain Carolinas GM would have to be 1 of your big 4. If you dont want to do that think about the cost for San Jose to acquire Karlsson and work from there. 2 firsts, 2 2nds, a top end young D and a top end young forward.

So lets try this:
Canes recieve:
Sandin + Robertson/Kapanen + 2021 1st, + 2022 1st + 2020 2nd + 2021 2nd. Then add the conditions like the 21 1st becomes 2020 if the Marleau condition isnt met. As well as resign conditions, etc

Leafs receive:
Hamilton

I doubt Columbus or Anderson consider that. Columbus isn’t moving picks and Anderson won’t be singing anything longer then 2 year. I’d guess he signs for 1 year plays well and capitalizes as a UFA.

Not sure arbitration helps him based on injured season, and agree this is likely what a 1yr or 2 yr deal would start. He's just the prototype for the player that would be needed if moving on from Kapanen in the 3RW slot.