Quoting: drewjenkins
LMAO.
It's very bad for the Leafs TBH.
Johnsson scored 20 goals as a 23-24 year old rookie (on pace for similar numbers this year). Are there 190 other top-6 forwards doing better?
Dermott's ceiling is unknown at this point (since his NHL career has spanned from age 20-22). And he's already better than most #4 defensemen.
Lindgren basically the same level prospect as Dube (except he hasn't failed at the NHL level yet). Dube is Calgary's Bracco (but he's their only option).
Also, I like how you limited Dermott's potential but not Dube's.
Even though Dermott has had a much better career thus far.
Andreas Johnsson already scored 20 goals in 73 games last season.
When he was 23-24 ... So isn't he already a top-6 forward by your logic?
Man this is great I've never actually read something so hilariously and obnoxiously wrong before. Like you actually came in here with the intent to tell me "how much better" your leafs are by using stats and miserably failed because you have zero understanding of stats.
Lets start with Johnsson since apparently you think he's a super star.
- Johnsson spent 90% of his season this year on the ice with Auston Matthews, last year about 60% of his time with Matthews and 15% with Tavares = 85%
- He had 8 goals and 21 points this year and was pacing for 15 goals 40 points (not sure how 15 = 20 in your mind)
- This year Johnsson had a total Offensive Point Share of 1.1, and Defensive Point Share of 0.6, last year he had 3.6 OPS, and 1.4 DPS (big drop off this year)
- Last year Johnsson's Goals Above Replacement (GAR) was 7.8 and his Wins Above Replacement (WAR) was 1.5. Meaning he had a good offensive season and some positive impact on the team winning
- This year his GAR was 2.4 and his WAR was 0.4, basically a shell of what it was last year and a barely positive impact player
Now Lets compare the same stats to Mangiapane
- Last year he played 55% of the season with Ryan and 24% with Jankowski, this year he spent 70% of his ice time with Tkachuk (like Matthews is elite but not to the same level)
- He had 8 goals and 13 points in 44 games last year and this year had 17g and 32p, which paces for 20 goals 39 points in a full season. (Sounds familiar)
- Mangiapane's OPS and DPS in 18/19 were 0.8 and 0.8 respectively, this year they were 2.4 and 1.3
- His 18/19 GAR was 6.2 and WAR was 1.2. That's just a little below AJ's from last year
- Mangiapane's GAR this year was 11.7 and his WAR was 2.1. Meaning his offensive contribution this year was significantly higher than Johnsson's was last year
As I said above, Mangiapane is already playing the same role as Johnsson at a similar level of production or better. Making that swap at best a wash and at worst a downgrade.
Now lets talk about Dermott
Sure, his ceiling is not set in stone but do you honestly think he has the potential to be a top pair talent? Could you see him pushing Rielly out of the 1st pair role? No, Dermott is a decent shut down defenseman that is capable of playing on both sides but is stronger on the left. Most team's #4's are roughly around the caliber of Travis Hamonic (who wasn't even Calgary's #4 by season's end). Other examples from playoff caliber teams #4 include; Justin Braun, Brandon Carlo, Kevin Shattenkirk, Brady Skjei/Jake Gardiner, Adam Pelech/Scott Mayfield, John Marino, Radko Gudas, Stephan Johns, Dante Fabbro, Vince Dunn, Dylan Demelo, Adam Larsson, Chris Tanev/Tyler Myers.
I would take a majority of these players before Dermott instantly.
You seem to think a #4 is a failure of a ceiling or something, that's 2nd pair caliber and 17-20 minutes a night of ice time with likely PK time too. A good comparison to Dermott is Montreal's Victor Mete, decent ceiling but not top line caliber.
Now this is the part that cracked me up the most, first you compared Lindgren to Dube then you compared Bracco to Dube, and called him an NHL failure. Like what? in what way is Dube an NHL failure
Calgary's version of Bracco has a name and it's Matthew Phillips. Neither have very high chances of making the NHL but tear up the AHL, players who are strong offensively in the A but don't have the defensive game to compete in the big leagues. That is Bracco, that is Phillips, that is not Dube. Like honestly where do you even get the idea that Dube is comparable?
As for Lindgren, he's 23 and didn't even get a call up when the Leafs had both Rielly and Muzzin out. This means he is not NHL caliber, Dube played nearly the entire season in Calgary. Lindgren had 9 points this year for the Marlies, who btw were 4th in scoring in the AHL. Dube was over a PPG last year for the Heat and was a PPG this year in his 13 games. He was paired with Lucic and Ryan on the 3rd/4th line and was the entire reason that line was relevant this year. I would expect him to play a much bigger role in his sophomore year and potentially get 2nd line ice time. This image you have of him as an "NHL failure" is so incredibly inaccurate and shows how little research you actually did.
Thanks for making yourself look like an idiot and continuing to make the Leafs fan base look bad.