OV also didn't come into the league as an 18 year old.
He came it at 20 I believe.

Not that it matters. He's clearly a generational player putting up the numbers he is.
It's not about points.

He was drafted in '04 and played the 05-06 season due to the lockout. Interestingly, he scored 163 goals and 310 points in his first 3 seasons. Matthews, who didn't have to endure a lockout, scored 158 goals and 285 points in his first 4 seasons. So even comparing them at the same age Matthews can't match the career totals that Ovi put up, despite Ovi playing 3 seasons vs Matthews' 4.

The best players dominate and change the way the game is played. Matthews has done neither. Points doesn't mean everything but you can't claim dominance without actually putting up a lot of points.

Look at it this way: since entering the league McDavid is the #1 scorer. Since entering the league Matthews is the 20th best scorer. He's an elite player but his results fall well short of generational.

Except for deluded Leafs fans, of course!

BUM mitch marner. replace wit Nylander. then add a 3rd and a 4th.

You really haven't been paying attention, have you?

McDavid cannot win a cup alone, it takes 23 players to win not 1 and all it take is one hit and McDavid is out, with 2x80+ point players, even if they are overpaid, is better than 1x110 point player, both Mathews and Marner are overpaid about 2 mill than they should be. In a cap era, cap hit in extremely important, MCDavid at 12.5m vs Mathews and Marner at 22.5m, thats 10m diff for what 40-50 points more for marner and mathews, Oilers can easy get 2x50+ point player for that 10m or a 80+ points player then it becomes, 200-220 points vs 160 points for the same amount of cap hit.

Oilers lose this trade by only because of cap hit of marner and mathews in term of point producing players

That is utter nonsense, the only way your reasoning could make any sense is if Matthews wasn't capable of being a top 5 player which he totally is. So you are moving a top 5 player for the best player and it also costs you a top 5 RW and you have to take on a bunch of dead cap as well? That is nonsense, even just Matthews + Marner and what they are capable of are better than what McDavid is by himself. Anyone who thinks otherwise is just being silly. Pick any two similar players and its the same answer, Eichel and Stone, MacKinnon and Rantanen, whatever similar pair of elite players vs just McDavid, McDavid is the best player in the world sure, no one is saying otherwise but to trade 2 elite players for just him is just dumb. It doesn't make sense, its a negative move.

A. I'm not a leafs fan.
B. your first years in the league do not make or break a player.
C. Matthews was drafted as a generational player, and has lived up to that.
You keep wanting to look at points.
I told you, points does not make someone a generational player.

The word generational player doesn't mean "passes the puck for a bunch more assists"
I'm sorry you don't get that.
There are a ton of players who compiled points that aren't even remotely considered generational.
Marner would be a really good example of this.
It's a different beast to be able to net the puck like Matthews does.
For a 22 year old increasing goals consistently and getting to a 50 goal level, is what generational players do.
At this point there is no reason to not say he's not a generational player.
He's had a 40 goal average for 4 straight years. He would have hit it if it wasn't for injury.
You are just dumb if you don't get that.

Even if you want to say that, Matthews is without a doubt an elite talent and one of the best goals scorers in the game, Marner is one of the best playmakers in the game those two combined is more valuable than 1 player. The NHL isn't the NBA where 1 player can make all the difference, you need a team. There is a reason why TO has been all around way better than Edmonton over the past 4 seasons, Edmonton has had pretty much no depth since McDavid has arrived, TO has an abundance of depth. Deep teams win, one star doesn't. This debate is just silly.

That's why I added Neil who ties up an additional 5.75M

McDavid + Neal = 18.25M

McDavid + Neal + Russell = 22.25M

Marner + Matthews = 22.5M

I think Edmonton definitely wins this trade until Russell and Neal come off the books. After that Toronto wins.

So Draisaitl is generational? Pastrnak? MacKinnon? Kucherov? They're all as good or better than Matthews. You aren't convincing anyone.

Brett Hull scored a lot of goals, more than Mario Lemieux some years. It didn't make him generational though, just an elite goal scorer.

Its unlikely that Matthews and Marner reach 100 points each? Marner has hit 90 already and was on pace for a similar number this past season where he missed a month due to injury. Matthews was on pace for nearly 60 goals and 90 points. Its a stretch to think that these two guys aren't going to have better years ahead considering they are 22 and 23 years old? Is it also ridiculous to think that Eichel will have a 100 point season in the years ahead?

You are such a clown

A 90 point winger isn't an easy spot to fill, this is just ****ing stupid.

You don't seem to have read my post as I stated this was a bad trade with the dead cap space coming with McDavid. The problem you are having is you are measuring two players up against one. It doesn't matter if Matthews and Marner are better combined than McDavid, they have to be better combined than McDavid + the opportunity cost of having an open top line winger spot. If the Leafs can fill that spot easily and exceed the Matthews + Marner combionation, they will have won. You arn't just paying for McDavid, you are paying for McDavid + and open line up spot.

Sure you would and you'd spend that extra 10 million on AA and Tofoli and not have 2 game breakers instead of 1

This is such a bad reply.
When in Pasta's first 4 years did he crack a 40 goal pace? Let alone all 4 years with the 4th being 50 goals?
How about MacKinnon...oh oppps that didn't happen either.
Point, what was that 1 year at a 40 goal pace?
Dria first 4....nope.
Although one could argue he's developing into one at his current pace. Could he do it on his own though?

Do you start to realize how awful your point of view is.
How many guys come into the league scoring goals at 40 goal+ paces and maintain it for their first 4 years?
How many? Especially in this modern hockey era.
Go ahead, start naming them.
I'll wait.

Furthermore, A lot of people would tell you Hall is a generational player.
Believe me, if your definition of a generational player is Mario, you haven't seen one since. As there have been like 2 players EVER in hockey to play to that level.
You let me know when McDavid averages 1.883 points per game since that's the standard and then we'll qualify him to your level of a generational player.
FFS you are a clown

I exist to bring joy to your life!

I would say all are possible, but it's not simple math, and even using your projections marner and matthews fall like 25 points short

The fact of the matter is the McDavid plays a reckless style of play and holds on to the puck too long and is a bit of a one man team. Those kind of players are 1 hit away from a serious injury that will curtail his career and production and even more of a reason to not trade Matthews and Marner.

You personally being against it makes me think Toronto should do it

That is entirely the point, you can't replicate Marner with a non elite winger. Two elites for one just doesn't work. TO would have a better #1 C but at the cost of a 90+ point winger. Who's going to replicate that production and game breaking capabilities? Kapanen? He isn't capable of what Marner does. Very, very few players are. No one can do what McDavid does but at the same time almost no one can do what Matthews does from a goal scoring point of view. This is just stupid.

Then you shouldn't exist cause you are just an extremist, fragile baby.

The point is that with McDavid at center, you dont need an elite winger to replicate Marner. You can replace him with a very good winger and be ahead points wise as well as cap wise.

If you are talking about by themselves sure. McDavid is the best player in the league, no question. But is he worth 2 players who combine for at the very least 170 points? And really it's not a stretch to think Matthews and Marner will score 100 points in the same season at some point. So is McDavid worth 200 points from two elite players? No, no one is.