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Trading Lindholm Rakell and Manson

Created by: Ducks
Team: 2020-21 Anaheim Ducks
Initial Creation Date: Jun. 22, 2020
Published: Jun. 22, 2020
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
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2$1,500,000
2$1,500,000
2$1,000,000
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1$1,000,000
1$1,000,000
Trades
1.
ANA
  1. Timmins, Conor
  2. 2020 1st round pick (COL)
2.
ANA
  1. Liljegren, Timothy
  2. 2021 2nd round pick (TOR)
TOR
  1. Manson, Josh ($2,050,000 retained)
3.
ANA
  1. Howden, Brett
  2. Lindbom, Olof [Reserve List]
  3. Lundkvist, Nils [Reserve List]
  4. 2020 1st round pick (CAR)
NYR
  1. Guhle, Brendan
  2. Lindholm, Hampus
  3. 2022 6th round pick (NSH)
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2020
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Jun. 22, 2020 at 11:46 p.m.
#1
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Rangers don’t touch that deal. And if it was proposed by a Ranger fan, I’d advise you disregard them going forward.
Jun. 23, 2020 at 12:05 a.m.
#2
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I know the Rakell for Timmins + 1st was talked about a lot on here months ago but now with COVID and the flat cap I think the market changed. Lots of teams will be needing to sell players to fit under the cap and I would rather go after someone like Killorn/Palat who could be had for much less in a trade. Not really interested in Rakell at that price
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Jun. 23, 2020 at 12:35 a.m.
#3
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TAVARES IS A LEAF
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Quoting: moli92
I know the Rakell for Timmins + 1st was talked about a lot on here months ago but now with COVID and the flat cap I think the market changed. Lots of teams will be needing to sell players to fit under the cap and I would rather go after someone like Killorn/Palat who could be had for much less in a trade. Not really interested in Rakell at that price


I see.
Jun. 23, 2020 at 12:35 a.m.
#4
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Quoting: Sagecoll
Rangers don’t touch that deal. And if it was proposed by a Ranger fan, I’d advise you disregard them going forward.


Lol I’ve seen it from a few of you guys?
Jun. 23, 2020 at 7:30 a.m.
#5
John 3 16
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Quoting: moli92
I know the Rakell for Timmins + 1st was talked about a lot on here months ago but now with COVID and the flat cap I think the market changed. Lots of teams will be needing to sell players to fit under the cap and I would rather go after someone like Killorn/Palat who could be had for much less in a trade. Not really interested in Rakell at that price


Yeah I came down to the comment section to say the same thing.

The only way I'd be open to trading Timmins would be if we acquire a top RHD like Pietrangelo that makes Timmins expendable, but that's really unlikely to happen.

Other teams with less capspace will likely value Rakell's low cap hit much more than Avs do, so are likely to price us out of a Rakell trade.

And as moli92 said, there will be much better deals available on the trade market and free agency that won't mortgage our future. Timmins and that 1st (eg. Reichel/Peterka/Brisson/etc) are going to be really important in phase 2 of our cup window beyond 2023. Would rather go for Killorn/Palat on the cheap than losing Timmins.

To put it another way...

Timmins + 1st = Rakell
2nd + 3rd = Killorn/Palat

... I'd rather have Killorn/Palat + Timmins + 1st, than Rakell + 2nd + 3rd.
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Jun. 23, 2020 at 8:10 a.m.
#6
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Quoting: Foreskin_Gump
Lol I’ve seen it from a few of you guys?


Rangers are still in a rebuild. So anyone with less than 4 years of team control isn’t really on the radar at all. That means guys like Rakell and Lindholm.

Usually it’s just an indication of which people are too impatient to do a proper rebuild.
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Jun. 23, 2020 at 8:21 a.m.
#7
XXX
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Its gonna be Liljegren for Manson straight up.. Liljegren is very valuable prospect and I dont see Leafs trading him off with another valuable asset for Manson even tho I see Leafs loving Manson, but it would be for combination of forward, D prospect not named Liljegren or Sandin and 2nd rounder.
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Jun. 23, 2020 at 1:02 p.m.
#8
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Quoting: SammyT_51
Its gonna be Liljegren for Manson straight up.. Liljegren is very valuable prospect and I dont see Leafs trading him off with another valuable asset for Manson even tho I see Leafs loving Manson, but it would be for combination of forward, D prospect not named Liljegren or Sandin and 2nd rounder.


I see where your coming from but considering how long he’s taking to develop don’t you think that’s a little to Risky for us to do straight up?
Jun. 23, 2020 at 1:08 p.m.
#9
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Quoting: Foreskin_Gump
I see where your coming from but considering how long he’s taking to develop don’t you think that’s a little to Risky for us to do straight up?


I wouldnt think so. Liljegren is still only barely 21 years old and is amazing prospect and surely a top-4 D in a year or two. Liljegren is ready. But he needs to wait a year to go straight into top-4 since we have bunch of bottom-4 Dmen currently. I see him playing 30 minutes a night on Marlies in 20/21 and then Muzzin pairing in 21/22 right at the age of 22/23 where those young top-4 Ds hit their stride on NHL level.
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Jun. 23, 2020 at 1:29 p.m.
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Quoting: moli92
I know the Rakell for Timmins + 1st was talked about a lot on here months ago but now with COVID and the flat cap I think the market changed. Lots of teams will be needing to sell players to fit under the cap and I would rather go after someone like Killorn/Palat who could be had for much less in a trade. Not really interested in Rakell at that price


Quoting: Richard88
Yeah I came down to the comment section to say the same thing.

The only way I'd be open to trading Timmins would be if we acquire a top RHD like Pietrangelo that makes Timmins expendable, but that's really unlikely to happen.

Other teams with less capspace will likely value Rakell's low cap hit much more than Avs do, so are likely to price us out of a Rakell trade.

And as moli92 said, there will be much better deals available on the trade market and free agency that won't mortgage our future. Timmins and that 1st (eg. Reichel/Peterka/Brisson/etc) are going to be really important in phase 2 of our cup window beyond 2023. Would rather go for Killorn/Palat on the cheap than losing Timmins.

To put it another way...

Timmins + 1st = Rakell
2nd + 3rd = Killorn/Palat

... I'd rather have Killorn/Palat + Timmins + 1st, than Rakell + 2nd + 3rd.


I sympathize with your position. Tampa Bay is in such cap trouble that they might effectively give Palat away.

I love Richard88's draft insight. Don't overlook Tyson Foerster.
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Jun. 23, 2020 at 1:40 p.m.
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Quoting: OldNYIfan
I sympathize with your position. Tampa Bay is in such cap trouble that they might effectively give Palat away.

I love Richard88's draft insight. Don't overlook Tyson Foerster.


I watched Foerster once this season and he looked great. Im hoping for either him or Peterka with our 1st.

Its gonna be a buyers market this offseason, TBL especially will need to have a garage-sale-esque offseason and not that many teams will be listening to take on guys with a 4.5-5.5M cap hit. Although the flat cap lowers value players like Rakell, you can also look at it from the perspective of a team who may be looking to add this offseason but are close to the cap (PHI, EDM, VGK, etc). Many teams may be wanting to add a Killorn/Palat but wont be able to, and thats where a team like ANA can come in and offer Rakell at a lower cap hit and maybe still get good value for him despite the flat cap
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Jun. 23, 2020 at 1:40 p.m.
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Quoting: moli92
I know the Rakell for Timmins + 1st was talked about a lot on here months ago but now with COVID and the flat cap I think the market changed. Lots of teams will be needing to sell players to fit under the cap and I would rather go after someone like Killorn/Palat who could be had for much less in a trade. Not really interested in Rakell at that price


Quoting: Richard88
Yeah I came down to the comment section to say the same thing.

The only way I'd be open to trading Timmins would be if we acquire a top RHD like Pietrangelo that makes Timmins expendable, but that's really unlikely to happen.

Other teams with less capspace will likely value Rakell's low cap hit much more than Avs do, so are likely to price us out of a Rakell trade.

And as moli92 said, there will be much better deals available on the trade market and free agency that won't mortgage our future. Timmins and that 1st (eg. Reichel/Peterka/Brisson/etc) are going to be really important in phase 2 of our cup window beyond 2023. Would rather go for Killorn/Palat on the cheap than losing Timmins.

To put it another way...

Timmins + 1st = Rakell
2nd + 3rd = Killorn/Palat

... I'd rather have Killorn/Palat + Timmins + 1st, than Rakell + 2nd + 3rd.


If you'd prefer Killorn/Palat at a lower price, that is fine, but Rakell is absolutely worth Timmins + 1st. I don't think we'd trade him for anything less. In fact, from what you're saying about team's being desperate to get under cap, I think it is safe to assume that Rakell (and his sweetheart deal) is worth a lot more now. Nice!!!!

Quoting: SammyT_51
I wouldnt think so. Liljegren is still only barely 21 years old and is amazing prospect and surely a top-4 D in a year or two. Liljegren is ready. But he needs to wait a year to go straight into top-4 since we have bunch of bottom-4 Dmen currently. I see him playing 30 minutes a night on Marlies in 20/21 and then Muzzin pairing in 21/22 right at the age of 22/23 where those young top-4 Ds hit their stride on NHL level.


Means nothing because progression isn't linear. Liljegren could dominate the AHL next year and then implode at the NHL level. He wouldn't be the first and won't be the last D-man to struggle to make the jump. I mean just look at Fleury, Honka, Zboril, all of whom were drafted higher than Liljegren, had solid AHL numbers, and can't stick it at the NHL level. Not saying it happens. The point is that there is a risk with Liljegren that needs to be compensated for.
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Jun. 23, 2020 at 1:42 p.m.
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Quoting: mytduxfan
If you'd prefer Killorn/Palat at a lower price, that is fine, but Rakell is absolutely worth Timmins + 1st. I don't think we'd trade him for anything less. In fact, from what you're saying about team's being desperate to get under cap, I think it is safe to assume that Rakell (and his sweetheart deal) is worth a lot more now. Nice!!!!


Yep, just commented something similar here:

Quoting: moli92

Its gonna be a buyers market this offseason, TBL especially will need to have a garage-sale-esque offseason and not that many teams will be listening to take on guys with a 4.5-5.5M cap hit. Although the flat cap lowers value players like Rakell, you can also look at it from the perspective of a team who may be looking to add this offseason but are close to the cap (PHI, EDM, VGK, etc). Many teams may be wanting to add a Killorn/Palat but wont be able to, and thats where a team like ANA can come in and offer Rakell at a lower cap hit and maybe still get good value for him despite the flat cap
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Jun. 23, 2020 at 1:46 p.m.
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TAVARES IS A LEAF
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Quoting: SammyT_51
I wouldnt think so. Liljegren is still only barely 21 years old and is amazing prospect and surely a top-4 D in a year or two. Liljegren is ready. But he needs to wait a year to go straight into top-4 since we have bunch of bottom-4 Dmen currently. I see him playing 30 minutes a night on Marlies in 20/21 and then Muzzin pairing in 21/22 right at the age of 22/23 where those young top-4 Ds hit their stride on NHL level.


Why would the 2nd be a deal breaker tho?
Jun. 23, 2020 at 2:13 p.m.
#15
John 3 16
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Quoting: moli92
I watched Foerster once this season and he looked great. Im hoping for either him or Peterka with our 1st.

Its gonna be a buyers market this offseason, TBL especially will need to have a garage-sale-esque offseason and not that many teams will be listening to take on guys with a 4.5-5.5M cap hit. Although the flat cap lowers value players like Rakell, you can also look at it from the perspective of a team who may be looking to add this offseason but are close to the cap (PHI, EDM, VGK, etc). Many teams may be wanting to add a Killorn/Palat but wont be able to, and thats where a team like ANA can come in and offer Rakell at a lower cap hit and maybe still get good value for him despite the flat cap

I disagree on Foerster. I think he'd be a bit underwhelming at #27 (but better value in the early 2nd). He seems to be quite one-dimensional to me, and I'm not sure how his game beyond his slap-shot will translate to the NHL. He'd be a nice get for a team needing a RHS on the PP, but we already have Mackinnon for that so we wouldn't really be making full use of his skillset. The YT channel Draft Dynasty did a video on him recently which you might find interesting to watch.

Peterka I can get behind though. I imagine that Peterka and Newhook on the same line would burn a lot of teams with their speed. I'd love it if Reichel would fall to us as well, I think he has top line potential even if he's maybe an extra year away due to needing to grow into his frame. Either way I think both Germans will be taken roughly where Bob Mackenzie has them on his list (i.e. 20th and 23rd) so we're probably going to miss out on them unfortunately. Should still be able to grab a good player though.

Regarding Rakell, I'd say that the flat cap will only increase Rakell's value. Teams will still be looking for quality additions to their team, and with his caphit he's definitely a possibility for teams. If I'm Anaheim I would be offering him at 50% retention for as many futures as I can squeeze out of a team. Rakell @ $1.8m for 2 years would be insane value, and I'm sure there would be many teams willing to spend quite a bit for that, such as PIT, WSH, BOS, DAL, STL, CGY, EDM, VGK, etc.
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Jun. 23, 2020 at 2:18 p.m.
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Quoting: mytduxfan
If you'd prefer Killorn/Palat at a lower price, that is fine, but Rakell is absolutely worth Timmins + 1st. I don't think we'd trade him for anything less. In fact, from what you're saying about team's being desperate to get under cap, I think it is safe to assume that Rakell (and his sweetheart deal) is worth a lot more now. Nice!!!!


I don't disagree that Rakell is worth Timmins + 1st. I just don't think Sakic would make that trade.

As I said below Anaheim should be able to get something very good in return for Rakell. Especially if they retain (which would be the smart move given that they should have plenty of capspace the next 2 years).

Quoting: Richard88

Regarding Rakell, I'd say that the flat cap will only increase Rakell's value. Teams will still be looking for quality additions to their team, and with his caphit he's definitely a possibility for teams. If I'm Anaheim I would be offering him at 50% retention for as many futures as I can squeeze out of a team. Rakell @ $1.8m for 2 years would be insane value, and I'm sure there would be many teams willing to spend quite a bit for that, such as PIT, WSH, BOS, DAL, STL, CGY, EDM, VGK, etc.
Jun. 23, 2020 at 2:21 p.m.
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Quoting: Richard88
I disagree on Foerster. I think he'd be a bit underwhelming at #27 (but better value in the early 2nd). He seems to be quite one-dimensional to me, and I'm not sure how his game beyond his slap-shot will translate to the NHL. He'd be a nice get for a team needing a RHS on the PP, but we already have Mackinnon for that so we wouldn't really be making full use of his skillset. The YT channel Draft Dynasty did a video on him recently which you might find interesting to watch.

Peterka I can get behind though. I imagine that Peterka and Newhook on the same line would burn a lot of teams with their speed. I'd love it if Reichel would fall to us as well, I think he has top line potential even if he's maybe an extra year away due to needing to grow into his frame. Either way I think both Germans will be taken roughly where Bob Mackenzie has them on his list (i.e. 20th and 23rd) so we're probably going to miss out on them unfortunately. Should still be able to grab a good player though.

Regarding Rakell, I'd say that the flat cap will only increase Rakell's value. Teams will still be looking for quality additions to their team, and with his caphit he's definitely a possibility for teams. If I'm Anaheim I would be offering him at 50% retention for as many futures as I can squeeze out of a team. Rakell @ $1.8m for 2 years would be insane value, and I'm sure there would be many teams willing to spend quite a bit for that, such as PIT, WSH, BOS, DAL, STL, CGY, EDM, VGK, etc.


Ill check that out. Foerster is one of the few prospects in that range that ive actually seen in person so I admit I may be a bit biased towards him. Ive read reports on Peterka and he seemed like a good fit - but after watching Scouching's video on him now he seems like a great fit - Im even more excited about him now than I was before. Id definitely go Peterka if hes available
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Jun. 23, 2020 at 2:38 p.m.
#18
John 3 16
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Quoting: moli92
Ill check that out. Foerster is one of the few prospects in that range that ive actually seen in person so I admit I may be a bit biased towards him. Ive read reports on Peterka and he seemed like a good fit - but after watching Scouching's video on him now he seems like a great fit - Im even more excited about him now than I was before. Id definitely go Peterka if hes available


Nice. I like Scouching as well, but I usually get tired of watching his videos after a while because he shows his face too much instead of just rolling the on-ice clips. It gets a bit jumpy and loses flow when he jumps back and forth so much. Pretty good assessments of players though.

In that range I like Brisson and Mysak as well, albeit less than zee Germans. Think they could both be useful middle 6ers and having role players like that on ELC's would be useful. Another one I'm looking at some more is Tristan Robins. HockeyProspects has him ranked #13, but other lists have him in the late 2nd or 3rd, and Bob has him as an HM outside the 3rd. He might be a bit of a reach based on most rankings but could pay off handsomely. He has a nice combination of tenacity and high-end skill. Kind reminds me of Wiesblatt but with better hands around the net.
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