Yeah I know folks have reservations about his injuries and age, but I'll be damned if this doesn't look exciting as hell. Can't horde cap space forever, right?

They would dethrone Boston's top line for the title of best line in hockey

Mom pick me up I’m scared

Need to remember that we're probably looking at a flat cap this year and next, So you don't want the Hall signing to interfere with your ability to resign Landeskog and Makar next summer. And why would Florida want a bottom pairing LD like Nikita Zadorov? They need top pairing LD not bottom pairing like Zadorov.

Like I said in the description, the worst is that they move Johnson. Or they can move Kadri or Burakovsky. It's not ideal, but they can definitely work it out on the cap side.

Zadorov seems like someone Tallon would be interested in, and this is a pretty easy price for Florida to pay (IMO).

They are letting go of Cole, Bellemare, and Calvert's big contracts, that's giving them an extra 9M to work with. Give Makar a bridge at 4M, Landeskog 7M, and Grubauer 6M which would leave you with about 1.5M. It's not much but its enough until Johnson's contract ends.

You can probably sign Hall for 8.5. I would also try holding onto Donskoi. Letting him go could be a mistake.

whoever signs hall to that much and that long is going to regret it

In my opinion Hall will probably get close to that salary. But I dont think hes worth it, the guys a big name and had 1 amazing season and should have come second to MacKinnon for the hart.. his career body of work just doesnt scream 9.5x7 to me.

If hall wants to win so bad he'd try a 1 year deal with a top team this year while the cap is flat and then try to cash in next year or whenever it goes up with seattle and tv deal

Obviously I'd love to get him for like $8.5x5, but I'm not sure that does it. Certainly you start there, but I think this is ultimately what it might take.

I will say this in terms of his production, the dude hasn't played on a team with the type of talent he'd be with in this scenario. He had McDavid for just over half a season in Connor's rookie year, but otherwise Hall has been on poor teams. Some of his underlying stats indicate he could explode on a line like this and make the contract look like a bargain for a while. The last two years may not be the best, but I think it's probably worth it if he provides five good seasons (maybe three great ones and two good ones).

In the end, I understand the hesitations. I'd rather have Eichel. But that's a pipe dream and would cost a fortune. Hall only costs a contract.

I honestly thought that is what would happen, but he came out and said he's not interested and wants term.

When it comes time to pay MacKinnen he’s getting like max amount per year right? Not that Mikko isn’t a stud, but it’s obvious Mac is the best player on the team and he’s getting 3M less a year. Man what a steal of a contract that is.

Huge steal, for sure. He'll definitely get a nice raise, but he did also say he'd take less in order to win. Hopefully he follows through on that. I tend to believe he will, but we'll see.

I honestly think you're overthinking this to much.. hall has played with all the young studs of the last 9 years.. eberle, mcdavid, draisaitl, hicsher, hughes, RNH... 5 1st overall picks, the talents been there, but a player that you pay that much is should make players around him better.

Also if the avs acquired hall i wouldnt play him with MacKinnon and rants,

Mack's the possession guy who skates the puck in and dishes it off to the shooters
Rants is the shooter
Landy is the defensive down low possession guy who stands in front of the net

That line is so good because these guys are so good at bringing all of those elements together.. Hall isnt going to take landys spot down low

Those guys were all either young in their careers and not the players they are now or good but not all that great (Eberle, RNH for example) though. Colorado has guys who are in their prime and plays a style that should fit with Hall's game. I think it's reasonable to expect a point per game pace and perhaps more, at least for 4 years or so.

Hall has definitely shown himself to make players around him better, so I disagree on that point. I would be very open to putting him on the second line though. Having him drive possession and dish to Naz and Burakovsky looks like a good recipe for success. Plus it gives him more favorable match ups to exploit. Either way is fine for me.

In the end I just don't think $9M or so is an overpay. He's a UFA, and those guys generally get more. If it weren't for revenue losses and a flat cap he'd likely be looking at well over $10M. If the league recovers and the tv deal goes well, then this could be a good contract.

Agree to disagree I guess.. second line would be where I'd put him, just dont know if I'd wanna pay a 2nd line winger 9+mill

Maybe if colorado had an issue scoring it would be a different situation

Sure I get that. But if the AVs give Hall 9.5 and Mikko is at 9.3 or whatever, you can’t expect the actual superstar to take like 10. Bet it’ll still be up in the 12.5 area if McDavid if we see a rise in cap. Worth every penny and a good problem to have

The team has a lot of ELCs and or cheap contracts on the way (Newhook, Byram, Kaut, Bowers, Timmins) and a great Mack contract they should take advantage of. In the end you want to ice the best team possible. I think there is a good argument that this does that.

I have moved away from the 1st vs 2nd vs 3rd line distinction a bit. I get your point, but if you essentially create 1a and 1b and can afford to do so, then why not?

I would argue that you cant afford it..
If Hall signs for 9.5

Landy 8 mill
Grubauer 5-6.5
Makar 7-9
Timmins ??
Jost ??
Graves ??

I think many agree with you, but I think it can be done. Obviously there is a lot of uncertainty on the cap, but I try to project 4-5 years out and think it works. Landy will get a raise, but not a huge one, and I think the same can be said for Jost, Timmins, and Grubauer. Eventually Annunen (hopefully) replaces one of the goalies, which also helps. Makar will be the big one, as he's worth every bit of $10M.

At that point someone will need to be moved or let go. Johnson, Kadri, and Burakovsky are the most obvious candidates. Losing any of them is not ideal, but the team has options coming up. And if you do move a guy like Burakovsky, you get something back (picks or prospects) to help keep things rolling in the future. Even Girard could be a candidate to move if it turns out Byram makes him expendable.

I also gain a lot of comfort by looking at other teams. If the Avs can't afford the above, then many other teams won't be able to afford their rosters. Eventually the cap needs to go up, even if it means escrow. All this is to say that I do hear the concerns loud and clear, but I think the benefits outweigh the concerns. Just my opinion.

Johnson and kadri have no trade clauses.. not perfect ones but can ruin possible trades and burakovsky is a piece you just added and was basically on pace to keep up with taylor hall and will basically cost half as much for the same production (going of last year) with a 9.5 mill x 7 contract you are basically counting on hall having his MVP season repeated.. when it's more likely you end up with 50ish games 40-60 pts on average

Maybe it works out that way with Hall, but I think the underlying numbers and style this team plays point more to Hall thriving with the Avs.

On the cap, can we agree that 2021/2022 is most likely going to be the tightest year? If so, here is what I see.

1 MacKinnon 6,300,000
2 Hall 9,250,000
3 Rantanen 9,250,000
4 Kadri 4,500,000
5 Landeskog 7,250,000
6 Burakovsky 5,000,000
7 Newhook 925,000
8 Jost 1,250,000
9 Nichushkin 3,000,000
10 Bowers 925,000
11 O'Connor 700,000
12 Kaut 894,167
13 Kamenev 800,000

1 Girard 5,000,000
2 Johnson 6,000,000
3 Graves 2,850,000
4 Makar 9,000,000
5 Byram 925,000
6 Timmins 925,000
7 Lindholm 742,500

1 Grubauer 4,250,000
2 Francouz 2,000,000
81,736,667


The team is ever so slightly above the cap. They can finagle their way into compliance via LTIR or active roster management (only having a 13th forward and/or 7th defenseman on the road and one or none at home). Or they can go with Francouz and a free agent. Or they can move one of the guys previously mentioned. I don't think Kadri would be difficult to move (only 10 team list). Johnson would be tougher due to his salary, and I don't think they would want to anyway, but it's an option. Burakovsky might bring back more than they paid for him, making it a success. Or maybe the cap rises slightly, in which case it's all good. Or they sign a guy for the league minimum instead of Lindholm or Kamenev. In short, there seem to be options.

In the end I think it can work. My projections may be optimistic in certain areas, but I don't see anything that would stop me from going for it, especially if Hall would do something in the $8Ms for 5-6 years which is what I'd target. There won't be a lot of contenders that can fit him in without gutting their roster. If he truly wants term and a chance to win, Sakic should have some leverage.

I understand the attraction of Hall and it would be great to have him but if we've learned anything over the past two seasons its that we need depth. You've went on to mention practically trading away the whole team outside of like 5 players to make this hall contract work. If we were to run into the injuries we had this year with what you have we would be playing 9 rookies. Sakic has built up a monster of a team there's no point in blowing it all up to fit a massive contract on the team for someone who has had major injuries over his whole career.

The only guys traded are Donskoi and Z (the latter happens regardless). Compher goes to Seattle, and other contracts roll off. So basically I'm just saying trade Donskoi for Hall, as the other stuff probably happens either way.