You're expecting too much, but it doesn't matter because Steen won't waive for Detroit.

I would be curious to know your reasoning, the only real recent precedents we have, Marleau and Backes both required a late 1st to take on. The cap situation has only gotten tighter, and STL arguably need to get rid of the cap more to resign their superstar.
What would you consider reasonable?

Marleau's real dollar salary was higher than Steen's and the Marleau trade came with an arranged buyout, which the Blues will not pay for. The Backes trade does not match up as you suggest as other pieces went both ways (and Steen is a clearly better player than Backes at this point, for that matter). I'd say a 2nd is reasonable, but it doesn't matter because he's not waiving to play for Detroit.

Ok, interesting. Thank you for the response. I think enough wings fans would be dissapointed with a 2nd that this is probably a no go given the criteria I am trying to go with. It will be interesting to see how this is resolved in the offseason.

Dont be short sighted friend the pick desired is a 1st rounder in 2022 unprotected when the Blues likely will diwn swing to bubble team (due to cap issues) & better lottery chance at next franchise player5 Shane Wright. .. & ignore the putz's who say "player wont waive" they know nothing ..most players waive when they're on trade block cuz they want to ve wanted by a team not tossed out in trade rumors..& likely the team trading for them has negotiated a term favorable for the player to waive it..either playing time opportunity or contract favorable change or potential future move(trade buyout) etc. . .most ppl are just casuals who don't pay real attn to the FACTS. ...have fun

Right, those are the picks we want, but I don't think we get them this summer. The cap crunch will be an issue for at least the next 2 years so we trade for those picks in the next offseason. If we pick up contracts with 1 year we can grab a 1st in the 2021 offseason, and might be able to make some deadline moves at the 2022 deadline. I can't see any GM trading an unprotected 1st 2 years in advance, especially after what happened to Ottawa and San Jose in successive drafts.

True but teams in win now mode...get desperate & thats when u take advantage ..tdl ..the cap crunch for about 10 teams will be interesting if they get desperate now too..& u can get creative with top 5 protected or top 10...then u can move multi picks for that player needed or better pick

Our best shot at getting an unprotected 2022 1st this offseason is acquiring a 2021 1st with, say top 10 protection and having that slide to 2022.

Depends ..some teams prefer6 to "kick can down the road" so they keep current picks for farm stock pipeline on draft picks so we'll see..

Hilarious stuff, especially about the Blues slipping down to a bubble team (you wish).

But yeah you totally needed to fling personal insults and "promote argument" - which is apparently actually fine by the mods, who are too busy cracking down on specific individuals over specific harmless banter replies that critique ideas instead of people because whiny people whined.

Agreed. I'm curious about the whole"ignore the putz's who say "player wont waive" they know nothing ..most players waive when they're on trade block cuz they want to ve wanted by a team not tossed out in trade rumors". @mike, do you have ANY examples out there for us, the "putz's", the "casuals" who "know nothing", of a player waiving his complete NTC to go from a legitimate contender to the worst team in the league (by far), who also play in one of the worst cities in the league?

I would be incredibly surprised if the Blues dropped down that's for sure. There would have to be some incredibly bad luck involved and potentially a major goalie injury. If you're making a trade with the Blues with a pick it's safest to do so in the immediately following draft when the value is certain. A 2022 unprotected 1st is a more risky asset for them to give up, even though it's likely to be at a similar spot in the draft.
Reading that potentially the vision of the RedWings is to aim for a Blues 2.0, building out from a good back end, we've got a way to go, but it gives a respect for the organisation.

I would be very surprised if a player waived their NTC to go to Detroit in it's current state, unless there was reason to believe remaining at the team would be made less pleasant, e.g. scratched most nights, demoted to the minors. Steen won't be nearly bad enough for that.
As for the attention at the city, I personally wouldn't know about the state of Detroit as a place to live, but the area where the players live will certainly not be able to be lumped in with the impoverished areas. Players often speak very highly of it as a hockey city.

Hockey-wise, it's right up there for sure. A beautiful new arena and very passionate fans.

Other than that, not so much. Bad team, bad climate, bad area. If I'm Steen, and I'm asked to waive my full NTC, and I have any inclination to do that, I'm either going to a contender, or I'm going somewhere with good tax laws, and warm climate.

Yeah, I think on balance this trade is a bit of a non starter. What do you think STL are going to do with the cap this summer? Y'all are in a bit of a bind.

They certainly are. I don't see how they resign Pietrangelo, and while that would suck for them, they've got in-house replacements that won't sink them. I'm still super confused by the Faulk trade and the extension given to him. I'd imagine that he'll put up better numbers when Pietrangelo is gone, but this year wasn't great for him.

I could also see Jake Allen get moved. I don't think there'd be any real return on him, but IMO, they also wouldn't have to give up anything (or at least anything of significance) to move him.

Do you think that Steen could waive his NTC if Detroit agreed to buy him out? He could then sign for any team he wanted to. I think a 1st might be a little bit high but would St Louis do it if Detroit sent a 3rd or 4th back?

A couple factors from recent trades.

Backes was a 1st and Kase, Backes was also already paid his 3M signing bonus so it was 1M prorated and 4M cash the next year or 2M actual cash if bought out. Marleau (35+ contract) was roughly 4M actual cash and 6.25M cap hit.

Steen’s buyout would be a total of 4.6M cap hit but (3.4M the first year and 1.2M the second year) and actual cash is 2.33M.

Steen is a better player than Marleau and Backes were. Also we could just buy him out to save 2 mil this year and 4 the next.

I saw one earlier that had Steen+1st for a 2nd in the range of 45-60ish, which made sense to me. I don't know, he might agree to it, it might be hard for him to find a roster spot somewhere else though. Hard to say.

Axel Andersson was also involved in the Kase trade. IMO, the value was essentially Axel+something like a second for Kase, then a second to take Backes contract (2 seconds essentially equaling the first in this situation)