Forums/Armchair-GM

Dont panic yet Pens fans the book is still open

Created by: Pens3lieve
Initial Creation Date: Oct 17, 2020
Published: Oct 18 at 5:47
Team: 2020-21 Pittsburgh Penguins
Team Explanation
Life as a Pens fan is hard, crazy, and a never ending series of emotional ups and downs.
in short form...
2008-2009--ups
2010-2015--heartbreaking downs
2016-2017--huge ups
2018-2020--huge downs

GMJR is the most streaky GM ever.
from the start of GMJR's tenure in PIT...
June 2014--Hornqvist for Neal trade----WIN (10/10) Hornqvist was a huge part of the team since then.

Then GMJR had a few duds (Perron, Goc, Winnick)

Then GMJR went on a historic streak!!!
march 2015--Lovejoy (7/10) can't hate it. he helped us win in 2016 but wasn't a huge piece.
March 2015--Cole (8/10) love the guy. IDK why sully didn't like him. he does everything JJ/Gudbranson/Ceci did times 1,000...
July 2015--Kessel (10/10) although his shelf life expired as it had in TOR/BOS, Phil was a huge part of the cups and was a great penguin.
July 2015-Bonino (9/10) should be 10/10 for the Bonino, Bonino, Bonino, Bonino........
December 2015-Daley (8/10) for Scuderi....wow....
January 2016-hagelin (8/10) huge part of the speed game
February 2016-Schultz (7/10) one good year when the pens needed it the most.
Penguins win cup.
some minor moves...then.....
February 2017-hainsey (7/10) old but effective then. remember the end-to-end rush?
march 2017-Streit (6/10) fine veteran presence.
Pens win cup again.

this is (minus minor moves) 9 Trades almost in a row the Pens won in hindsight. incredible trading run from GMJR. but here's a thought...with the exception of the Kessel deal, were any of these trades at the time they were made thought of instantly as a big win for the pens?? I don't think so. alot of these players weren't doing good at all in their respective situations. alot of players over performed and exceeded expectations for the pens to win in 16/17. if all the players acquired played at their previous norms I doubt the pens win those cups. my point is I think because hockey is such a random game that no matter how good or bad on paper a team is, you have to get huge over performances and unexpected contributors to win a cup.
since then alot of GMJR's moves haven't worked out. but how many have been bashed at the time they were made? the Reaves trade? the Gudbranson trade? signing JJ and Ceci? but players many times have simply UNDERPERFORMED or not rebounded and "fixed" their careers as we became accustomed to in 16/17...
exhibit A---the brassard trade.....looking back what the pens gave up doesn't look at huge at it did then....but....brassard should have given us the best 3rd line in hockey and we should have 3-peated-----on paper...but he was a massive failure.

lately it kinda looked like GMJR had regained some of his magic---(which is more like luck or circumstance or players overperforming....)

examples:
marino-random college dude. like I literally said when the trade was made. who's this guy...ok whatever minor league help.. when can we get a good player? turns out he is a legit top-4 D with #1 potential. but the key is no one expected it...except maybe 1 pens scout...
Pettersson- the book is still open but for now it looks like a huge (but lucky) win....it was just a standard "2 young underperforming players get a change of scenery" trade...but Pettersson turned out...sprong did not....it could have easily gone the other way and we'd be bellowing at GMJR like a wounded hippo...(do they bellow IDK)

In the last little while GMJR hasn't been on a good or bad streak...just kinda in the middle. you win some, you lose some.
HITS-Pettersson, marino, zucker (only like 15 GP but rn it's a win),
MISSES (or in some cases more of a wash)-Galchenyuk, Bjugstad, Pearson, Gudbranson, Marleau, Sheary 2.0,
BOOK STILL OPEN--Joseph, McCann, Erod, Kapanen, Sceviour, Matheson, Ceci (FA)

this doesn't even account for OVER-PERFORMERS coming up from within.....that happened in 16 and 17. it needs to happen again. or players we have need to step up and perform at a higher level. last year it was marino, rust, jarry, buzzsaw, McCann (to an extent). a huge portion of this edition of the pens is an unknown. so many names have ???'s surrounding them--not always a good thing...but I think we need to see this team play before making a judgment call. as I said, the book is still open on alot of pens players. I hope their story has a good ending in Pittsburgh.
Buyouts
  • Jack Johnson: $1,166,667
Retained Salary Transactions
  • Nick Bjugstad: $2,050,000 (50%)
DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
2021
PIT
PIT
PIT
WSH
ANA
2022
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
2023
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES BONUSESCAP SPACE
23$81,500,000$79,181,842$0$850,000$2,318,158
Left WingCenterRight Wing
PIT
Zucker, Jason
$5,500,000
LW, RW
NTC
UFA - 3
PIT
Crosby, Sidney
$8,700,000
C
NMC
UFA - 5
PIT
Kapanen, Kasperi
$3,200,000
RW
RFA - 2
PIT
Guentzel, Jake
$6,000,000
LW, RW
UFA - 4
PIT
Malkin, Evgeni
$9,500,000
C
NMC
UFA - 2
PIT
Rust, Bryan
$3,500,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
PIT
McCann, Jared
$2,940,000
LW, C
RFA - 2
PIT
Jankowski, Mark
$700,000
LW, C
RFA - 1
PIT
Rodrigues, Evan
$700,000
C, LW
UFA - 1
PIT
Tanev, Brandon
$3,500,000
RW, LW
NTC
UFA - 5
PIT
Blueger, Teddy
$750,000
C, LW
RFA - 1
PIT
Sceviour, Colton
$1,200,000
RW
UFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
PIT
Dumoulin, Brian
$4,100,000
LD
UFA - 3
PIT
Letang, Kris
$7,250,000
RD
NMC NTC
UFA - 2
PIT
Jarry, Tristan
$3,500,000
G
UFA - 3
PIT
Pettersson, Marcus
$4,025,175
LD
UFA - 5
PIT
Marino, John
$925,000
RD
RFA - 1
PIT
DeSmith, Casey
$1,250,000
G
UFA - 2
PIT
Matheson, Michael
$4,875,000
LD
UFA - 6
PIT
Ceci, Cody
$1,250,000
RD
UFA - 1
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
PIT
Ruhwedel, Chad
$700,000
RD
UFA - 1
PIT
Aston-Reese, Zach
$1,000,000
LW, RW
RFA - 1
PIT
Riikola, Juuso
$1,150,000
LD
UFA - 2
PIT
Lafferty, Sam
$750,000
C, LW
UFA - 2

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Oct 18 at 5:49
#1
RangerWall92
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 2,058
Likes: 619
That 3rd pairing is gonna be a ride
Oct 18 at 5:51
#2
Thread Starter
Hockey IQ
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 1,528
Likes: 774
BradTolliverGoalie liked this.
Oct 18 at 5:52
#3
Thread Starter
Hockey IQ
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 1,528
Likes: 774
Quoting: RangerWall92
That 3rd pairing is gonna be a ride

as I said, the book is still open. on paper it looks below average at best. I reserve judgment till after I see them play. having forwards that are strong defensively can help some with that.
I hope the pairing doesn't blow up. we saw a awful Schultz-JJ pairing so. we can't get much worse right now.
Oct 18 at 6:02
#4
Joined: Sep 2020
Posts: 1,325
Likes: 499
JR doesn't get the credit he deserves
Pens3lieve liked this.
Oct 18 at 6:04
#5
BaRzAl OfFeRsHeEt
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 6,586
Likes: 4,145
Jankowski is gonna look good mark my words
Pens3lieve liked this.
Oct 18 at 6:05
#6
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 11,420
Likes: 4,889
Is there a TL;DR for this?
Oct 18 at 6:51
#7
NoWah49
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,256
Likes: 329
lots of question marks, but I'll be pumped if Jankowski, Matheson, and Ceci aren't horrible
Pens3lieve liked this.
Oct 18 at 7:05
#8
Thread Starter
Hockey IQ
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 1,528
Likes: 774
Quoting: AndrewLadd
Jankowski is gonna look good mark my words


Quoting: NoWah49
lots of question marks, but I'll be pumped if Jankowski, Matheson, and Ceci aren't horrible


I'm really hoping so for sure. there is surely a chance for rebounding for alot of these guys as I mentioned but there's just so many ???s it's hard to predict what will happen. this is kind of a make or break year for the team.
NoWah49 and AndrewLadd liked this.
Oct 18 at 7:09
#9
Marner Stan Account
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 4,818
Likes: 1,528
Quoting: Pens3lieve
I'm really hoping so for sure. there is surely a chance for rebounding for alot of these guys as I mentioned but there's just so many ???s it's hard to predict what will happen. this is kind of a make or break year for the team.


Good analysis. Like you said, the book is still open. For me, the biggest question mark is the third line. McCann is good & I like Erod. Will Jankowski be good enough is my main concern cuz he doesn’t provide any offence & is soft like Bjugstad. Everything else seems set.
Pens3lieve liked this.
Oct 18 at 7:53
#10
Thread Starter
Hockey IQ
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 1,528
Likes: 774
Quoting: MitchMarnerElite
Good analysis. Like you said, the book is still open. For me, the biggest question mark is the third line. McCann is good & I like Erod. Will Jankowski be good enough is my main concern cuz he doesn’t provide any offence & is soft like Bjugstad. Everything else seems set.


McCann is fine I just wonder if he's too streaky. time will tell. it's only 1 year. I think there's a better chance Jankowski rebounds then Erod turns out to be something special but we have a tiny sample size of Erod. I liked the little I saw of him but I'd like him alot better if he was forward #13/14
Oct 18 at 8:12
#11
Marner Stan Account
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 4,818
Likes: 1,528
Quoting: Pens3lieve
McCann is fine I just wonder if he's too streaky. time will tell. it's only 1 year. I think there's a better chance Jankowski rebounds then Erod turns out to be something special but we have a tiny sample size of Erod. I liked the little I saw of him but I'd like him alot better if he was forward #13/14


Agree Erod is a depth forward at best but I like his speed and forecheck. Felt he should’ve been in the lineup over Marleau or Sheary.
Pens3lieve and pharrow liked this.
Oct 18 at 10:41
#12
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 69
Likes: 14
Swap Tanev & Erod and you may be on the nose.
Oct 19 at 2:32
#13
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 13,061
Likes: 3,113
if Maniscalco, can't beat out Ceci for that 3rd pairing role, he should hang up his skates now.

That's my only hope for that 3rd pairing.
Oct 19 at 2:34
#14
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 13,061
Likes: 3,113
Quoting: MitchMarnerElite
Agree Erod is a depth forward at best but I like his speed and forecheck. Felt he should’ve been in the lineup over Marleau or Sheary.


sullivan's decision making is as suspect as JRs.

And if he wasn't good enough to play over them then, why do people think he'll be any better now?
I just don't get it.
Oct 19 at 8:46
#15
Thread Starter
Hockey IQ
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 1,528
Likes: 774
Quoting: HulkVader
Swap Tanev & Erod and you may be on the nose.


They may do something like that to start if ZAR is still hurt.
Oct 19 at 8:47
#16
Thread Starter
Hockey IQ
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 1,528
Likes: 774
Quoting: pharrow
if Maniscalco, can't beat out Ceci for that 3rd pairing role, he should hang up his skates now.

That's my only hope for that 3rd pairing.


yeah I'd love to see someone "under the radar" step up. Maniscalco has a higher college pedigree and more relative college success than marino. no guarantee but there is definitely talent there.
Oct 19 at 9:07
#17
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 69
Likes: 14
Quoting: pharrow
if Maniscalco, can't beat out Ceci for that 3rd pairing role, he should hang up his skates now.

That's my only hope for that 3rd pairing.


Unreasonable. Maniscalco’s never played a pro game. He’ll start in the minors, if there are any, as he should.
Oct 19 at 9:11
#18
Hockey Super Genius
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 2,888
Likes: 716
You have Guentzel & Zucker on wrong lines.

This teams bottom 6 is so bad, it's kind of scary.
Having 1- 3rd line player, 4-4th liners, & 4- #13 type Forwards

Also, if our back-up is a 29yr old AHL Goalie (in the only year having a 1B is an absolute must) the season is over already. DeSmith getting 30-35 Starts due to back-to-backs &
compressed schedule is just laughable.

REMEMBER :
This team is 1- 87 or 71 Injury away from having Mark Jankowski as a 2nd Line Center = Now that is some funny stuff
OR
A Jarry injury away from having DeSmith & Lagace as ur NHL Goalies, I mean IDK if I'd trust them both as our WBS Goalies, Lmbo

If we go into the season w/ this bottom 6 & this Goalie situation, MIN should be very Excited bc we are gifting them a Lottery pick.
** This team looks like the SJS of last year
Pens3lieve liked this.
Oct 19 at 9:29
#19
Thread Starter
Hockey IQ
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 1,528
Likes: 774
Quoting: Sidstick87
You have Guentzel & Zucker on wrong lines.

This teams bottom 6 is so bad, it's kind of scary.
Having 1- 3rd line player, 4-4th liners, & 4- #13 type Forwards

Also, if our back-up is a 29yr old AHL Goalie (in the only year having a 1B is an absolute must) the season is over already. DeSmith getting 30-35 Starts due to back-to-backs &
compressed schedule is just laughable.

REMEMBER :
This team is 1- 87 or 71 Injury away from having Mark Jankowski as a 2nd Line Center = Now that is some funny stuff
OR
A Jarry injury away from having DeSmith & Lagace as ur NHL Goalies, I mean IDK if I'd trust them both as our WBS Goalies, Lmbo

If we go into the season w/ this bottom 6 & this Goalie situation, MIN should be very Excited bc we are gifting them a Lottery pick.
** This team looks like the SJS of last year


I don't want zucker + rust on the same line. I feel they are too similar but I think sully will start with it anyway.

I agree on everything else. I don't like the skill level of the depth we have. we have alot of guys but not alot of (on the surface) good options. injuries will hit and then IDK what will happen. I agree this team needs another couple changes that doesn't involve getting 4th liners but I fear the pens think they have enough...
Oct 19 at 12:32
#20
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 13,061
Likes: 3,113
Quoting: HulkVader
Unreasonable. Maniscalco’s never played a pro game. He’ll start in the minors, if there are any, as he should.


are you kidding me. How high do you think the hurdle is?
Oct 19 at 12:33
#21
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 13,061
Likes: 3,113
Quoting: Pens3lieve
yeah I'd love to see someone "under the radar" step up. Maniscalco has a higher college pedigree and more relative college success than marino. no guarantee but there is definitely talent there.


I mean he doesn't really have to jump the empire state building to get there. That's all I'm saying.
Pens3lieve liked this.
Oct 19 at 6:27
#22
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 69
Likes: 14
Quoting: pharrow
are you kidding me. How high do you think the hurdle is?


Whatever it is, it’s higher than he can leap at present. Marino made the jump because his defensive game was advanced. That’s not a particular strength of Maniscalco’s atm. He’s a puck rusher and those guys generally get roasted by pros early on. He’s got tools but he’ll take more time.
 
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