Forums/Armchair-GM

The only trades that actually make sense

Created by: ZiggyPalffy
Initial Creation Date: Jan 8, 2021
Published: Jan 8 at 2:10
Team: 2020-21 Columbus Blue Jackets
Team Explanation
CBJ is perhaps the most fit for contention as they've ever been. Maybe some D upgrades at the deadline, but not much else.

They are not a rebuilding team so any trades such as picks and prospects that we keep seeing are not realistic. The only way they trade Dubois is if they get a center of the same stature or an upgrade at the same position. Otherwise they are walking themselves out of contention and have to explain that to their fan base who's suffered enough over the years.

The only teams that make sense are LA and Montreal.

LA is a bit unrealistic simply due to Blake saying they aren't trading Kopitar, Doughty, Brown, or Quick. I think they would at least consider it if Dubois and Bemstrom were offered. Kopitar is a massive upgrade over Dubois, yes he's older, but has shown no signs of slowing down nor has he had a huge lack of production despite being on a bad rebuilding team. He also has the Cup experience CBJ doesn't have. He fits their CBJ mold as well.

Montreal, Dubois and Suzuki would solidify their top 6 center group which would make Danault and KK expendable. I think Danault extended and KK would make a fair return for Dubois and Grigorenko(3C replacement for KK) Not a lot of Montreal fans like this proposal because of what they are giving up, but it is a fair return and they get Dubois out of it. You have to remember, KK is struggling player that still hasn't proved much yet. That is why Danualt must be extended.


I personally think the Montreal trade makes most sense.
Trades
CBJ
  1. Danault, Phillip
  2. Kotkaniemi, Jesperi
Additional Details:
Danault Extended: 5.75M x 5 years.
MTL
    Dubois
    Grigorenko
    CBJ
    1. Kopitar, Anze ($2,000,000 retained)
    LAK
      Dubois
      Bemstrom
      Buyouts
      • Scott Hartnell: $1,250,000
      • Alexander Wennberg: $441,667
      DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
      2021
      CBJ
      CBJ
      CBJ
      CBJ
      NJD
      CBJ
      CBJ
      2022
      CBJ
      CBJ
      CBJ
      CBJ
      CBJ
      CBJ
      ANA
      2023
      CBJ
      CBJ
      CBJ
      CBJ
      CBJ
      CBJ
      CBJ
      ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES BONUSESCAP SPACE
      23$81,500,000$70,180,833$0$3,600,000$11,319,167
      Left WingCenterRight Wing
      CBJ
      Texier, Alexandre
      $897,500
      LW, C
      RFA - 1
      MTL
      Danault, Phillip
      $3,083,333
      C
      UFA - 1
      CBJ
      Bjorkstrand, Oliver
      $2,500,000
      RW
      UFA - 1
      CBJ
      Foligno, Nick
      $5,500,000
      LW, C, RW
      NMC NTC
      UFA - 1
      CBJ
      Domi, Max
      $5,300,000
      C, LW
      UFA - 2
      CBJ
      Atkinson, Cam
      $5,875,000
      RW, LW
      NTC
      UFA - 5
      CBJ
      Nyquist, Gustav
      $5,500,000
      RW, LW
      UFA - 3
      MTL
      Kotkaniemi, Jesperi
      $925,000
      C, LW
      RFA - 1
      CBJ
      Bemström, Emil
      $925,000
      C, RW
      RFA - 2
      CBJ
      Jenner, Boone
      $3,750,000
      C, LW
      UFA - 2
      CBJ
      Koivu, Mikko
      $1,500,000
      C
      NMC
      UFA - 1
      CBJ
      Nash, Riley
      $2,750,000
      C, RW
      UFA - 1
      Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
      CBJ
      Werenski, Zachary
      $5,000,000
      LD
      RFA - 2
      CBJ
      Jones, Seth
      $5,400,000
      RD
      NTC
      UFA - 2
      CBJ
      Korpisalo, Joonas
      $2,800,000
      G
      UFA - 2
      CBJ
      Gavrikov, Vladislav
      $2,800,000
      LD
      UFA - 3
      CBJ
      Savard, David
      $4,250,000
      RD
      UFA - 1
      CBJ
      Merzlikins, Elvis
      $4,000,000
      G
      UFA - 2
      CBJ
      Harrington, Scott
      $1,633,333
      LD
      UFA - 2
      CBJ
      Kukan, Dean
      $1,650,000
      RD
      UFA - 2
      ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
      CBJ
      Gerbe, Nathan
      $750,000
      LW, RW
      UFA - 2
      LAK
      Kopitar, Anze
      $8,000,000
      C
      NTC
      UFA - 4
      CBJ
      Robinson, Eric
      $975,000
      LW
      UFA - 2
      CBJ
      Dubois, Pierre-Luc
      $5,000,000
      C
      RFA - 2
      CBJ
      Carlsson, Gabriel
      $725,000
      LD
      RFA - 2
      CBJ
      Grigorenko, Mikhail
      $1,200,000
      C, LW
      UFA - 1
      CBJ
      Dubinsky, Brandon
      $5,850,000
      C, LW
      NMC NTC
      UFA - 1

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      Jan 8 at 2:13
      #1
      Joined: Jun 2017
      Posts: 8,730
      Likes: 4,979
      Stop trying to take our players just so you can offload PLD. There is clearly a terrible fit trade-wise between the Jackets and Habs, and we aren’t making a trade just because someone is French-Canadian. KK is untouchable, so stop making ridiculous offers.
      HabsRealGM liked this.
      Jan 8 at 2:19
      #2
      Habs 2010
      Joined: May 2020
      Posts: 392
      Likes: 165
      The habs trade is a no, the Kopitar one very interesting though. Those types of trades make the most sense for a Dubois deal I think.

      Of course, nothing would be better than if CBJ could just lock Dubois up long term. CBJ needs to get that part figured out.
      ZiggyPalffy and HabsRealGM liked this.
      Jan 8 at 2:25
      #3
      Moderators Are Soft
      Joined: Feb 2019
      Posts: 2,338
      Likes: 1,009
      Quoting: Kotkaniemi15
      Stop trying to take our players just so you can offload PLD. There is clearly a terrible fit trade-wise between the Jackets and Habs, and we aren’t making a trade just because someone is French-Canadian. KK is untouchable, so stop making ridiculous offers.


      I've probably seen 10 trades on here for PLD with KK. Easy bud. most made by hab fans
      Kotkaniemi15 liked this.
      Jan 8 at 2:26
      #4
      Joined: Jun 2017
      Posts: 8,730
      Likes: 4,979
      Quoting: dzad96
      I've probably seen 10 trades on here for PLD with KK. Easy bud. most made by hab fans


      I know. And I’m sick of it, but at least it’s usually easier to reason with fans of other teams than it is to reason with the many insane habs fans of the website.
      dzad96 and Shanesaw9 liked this.
      Jan 8 at 2:33
      #5
      Letsgoleafsjaysraps
      Joined: Apr 2020
      Posts: 5,352
      Likes: 2,182
      Quoting: Kotkaniemi15
      Stop trying to take our players just so you can offload PLD. There is clearly a terrible fit trade-wise between the Jackets and Habs, and we aren’t making a trade just because someone is French-Canadian. KK is untouchable, so stop making ridiculous offers.


      Dude everyone know PLD is better than KK. Makes a lot of sense for the habs.
      ZiggyPalffy liked this.
      Jan 8 at 2:51
      #6
      Subbanator
      Joined: Jul 2017
      Posts: 4,197
      Likes: 1,593
      I think that this is what it would take for the Habs to get him.

      This site is funny in a way though, Habs always need more value in a trade to get a star player then other teams posts for people on this site to think its a good deal. I have seen far less for PLD on this site that people think are good trades and here we are with a good offer and people think its not enough.
      ZiggyPalffy and Shanesaw9 liked this.
      Jan 8 at 3:18
      #7
      Thread Starter
      Banned
      Joined: May 2018
      Posts: 9,721
      Likes: 2,800
      Quoting: Kotkaniemi15
      I know. And I’m sick of it, but at least it’s usually easier to reason with fans of other teams than it is to reason with the many insane habs fans of the website.


      You're the only Habs fan that comes off insane. No other Habs fan values KK like you. In a trade for Dubois, KK is involved in reality not fantasy. Get used to it
      Jan 8 at 3:25
      #8
      Habs 2010
      Joined: May 2020
      Posts: 392
      Likes: 165
      Edited Jan 8 at 3:32
      Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
      You're the only Habs fan that comes off insane. No other Habs fan values KK like you. In a trade for Dubois, KK is involved in reality not fantasy. Get used to it


      He didn't say KK would not be involved (from a CBJ perspective), he said Dubois to the Habs is not realistic, which I agree with.

      I personally would not trade our Selke candidate center who also outplayed and outproduced Dubois at 5 on 5 last season while also adding Kotkaniemi who all habs fans expect to be a #1 or #2C in the near future. Yes KK is not Dubois, but he is also two years younger and was drafted with the expectation that long term he would become a #1C.
      Kotkaniemi15 and HabsRealGM liked this.
      Jan 8 at 3:49
      #9
      Joined: Nov 2018
      Posts: 3,897
      Likes: 1,369
      I have made a few Dubois trades myself and included KK in a couple. OK is not the player I would give up for Dubois if I had my choice. And I definitely am not giving up both KK and Danault. Montreal is not trading 2 Centers for 1 especially not one they view to be a Barkov type player in the future and Danault who is one of the best 2 way centers in the league. I only ever in Clyde one of alDanault or KK in any proposal and prefer the Danault proposals as Danault fits with Columbus' win now mentality. A package of Danault + Tatar + Norlinder with both Tuna and Danault extended has more than enough value for Dubois. However even if we don't trade for Dubois I would be just as happy with the team we have now. So yes having Dubois would be great but IMO it doesn't improve the team enough to go out of our way and overpay significantly for him.
      Jan 9 at 2:07
      #10
      Joined: Sep 2019
      Posts: 86
      Likes: 19
      Quoting: Saskleaf
      Dude everyone know PLD is better than KK. Makes a lot of sense for the habs.


      Disagree. Maybe at the moment. Not in a year or two. Habs keep KK. He's gonna be a beast.
      Jan 9 at 2:17
      #11
      Joined: Sep 2019
      Posts: 86
      Likes: 19
      Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
      You're the only Habs fan that comes off insane. No other Habs fan values KK like you. In a trade for Dubois, KK is involved in reality not fantasy. Get used to it


      Disagree. We don't need to trade KK for Dubois. Why make a move for the sake of making a move. Kk + Danault is better than Dubois everyday of the year. Losing both makes our team worse. Kk will be just as good as Dubois.

      If you're trading with MB. Danault + a high level prospect (Poehling, Caufield) or a first round pick. Might get it done. Even then I'm not sure you even make the trade. If we can re-sign Danault long term and keep KK and Suzuki we've got a Trio down the middle that not many teams can match.

      We only trade for Dubois if IT IMPROVES our team. The above trade and comments here don't improve us. Everyone is salivating over Dubois. We have a solid group of three I'll take all day. Why trade for someone that may or not make us better as a group.
      Campabee liked this.
      Jan 9 at 5:27
      #12
      Letsgoleafsjaysraps
      Joined: Apr 2020
      Posts: 5,352
      Likes: 2,182
      Quoting: HabsRealGM
      Disagree. Maybe at the moment. Not in a year or two. Habs keep KK. He's gonna be a beast.


      It's hard to tell. I think KK will be about as good as PLD in like 3 years. But he's still too young to know just how good he'll be. At the moment, I'd say PLD is worth more than him.
      Jan 9 at 5:44
      #13
      Joined: Jan 2019
      Posts: 6,103
      Likes: 2,203
      Quoting: Saskleaf
      It's hard to tell. I think KK will be about as good as PLD in like 3 years. But he's still too young to know just how good he'll be. At the moment, I'd say PLD is worth more than him.


      If it's straight up I'm taking PLD all day every day. Maybe KK is better than him at one point, but I'm going with the surefire guy.
      Saskleaf liked this.
      Jan 9 at 6:27
      #14
      Letsgoleafsjaysraps
      Joined: Apr 2020
      Posts: 5,352
      Likes: 2,182
      Quoting: HabsForEver
      If it's straight up I'm taking PLD all day every day. Maybe KK is better than him at one point, but I'm going with the surefire guy.


      I agree.
      Jan 9 at 6:59
      #15
      Joined: Sep 2019
      Posts: 86
      Likes: 19
      Quoting: Saskleaf
      It's hard to tell. I think KK will be about as good as PLD in like 3 years. But he's still too young to know just how good he'll be. At the moment, I'd say PLD is worth more than him.


      Agree. At the moment. But you have to consider long term when you' re making trades of this caliber. A trade like this is a 5-10 year bet. Talk to me at the end of the year and see if KK is as good a PLD. I'm willing to bet they will be closer than you think. I'd also be willing to wait and find out. #notrade
      Saskleaf liked this.
      Jan 9 at 7:03
      #16
      Joined: Sep 2019
      Posts: 86
      Likes: 19
      Quoting: HabsForEver
      If it's straight up I'm taking PLD all day every day. Maybe KK is better than him at one point, but I'm going with the surefire guy.


      Of course you are. Because you are looking at right now. No GM makes trades like this without considering the long term. No question at this moment in time PLD is better. No debate. The question is who is the more complete player in 3-5 years? It's like when MB trade Subban for Weber. At the time Subban looked like the better player. Who would you rather have today? Who is better for your team?
      Jan 9 at 7:20
      #17
      Letsgoleafsjaysraps
      Joined: Apr 2020
      Posts: 5,352
      Likes: 2,182
      Quoting: HabsRealGM
      Agree. At the moment. But you have to consider long term when you' re making trades of this caliber. A trade like this is a 5-10 year bet. Talk to me at the end of the year and see if KK is as good a PLD. I'm willing to bet they will be closer than you think. I'd also be willing to wait and find out. #notrade


      Oh course. But I'm just not sure if in 3-5 years that KK will be better than PLD.
      Jan 9 at 7:24
      #18
      Joined: Jan 2019
      Posts: 6,103
      Likes: 2,203
      Quoting: HabsRealGM
      Of course you are. Because you are looking at right now. No GM makes trades like this without considering the long term. No question at this moment in time PLD is better. No debate. The question is who is the more complete player in 3-5 years? It's like when MB trade Subban for Weber. At the time Subban looked like the better player. Who would you rather have today? Who is better for your team?


      I'm thinking 100% long term. It's not like Dubois is 28 or 29 and already out of his Prime, we are comparing two players here who are 2 years apart and we both know Montreal's development problems. In the perfect world, Kotkaniemi maxes out at PLD's level, and that's best case. Like I said, I'd rather go with Dubois because he guarantees we are getting a good 1C.

      Who is the more complete player? I'm going with PLD because there's no surefire shot that KK becomes anything better than a 3C. This doesn't compare to the PK vs Weber trade whatsoever, I said MB won the trade when he made the deal and I say he won it now. Subban wasn't the better player then and he sure as hell isn't now.
      Jan 9 at 8:31
      #19
      Joined: Sep 2019
      Posts: 86
      Likes: 19
      Quoting: HabsForEver
      I'm thinking 100% long term. It's not like Dubois is 28 or 29 and already out of his Prime, we are comparing two players here who are 2 years apart and we both know Montreal's development problems. In the perfect world, Kotkaniemi maxes out at PLD's level, and that's best case. Like I said, I'd rather go with Dubois because he guarantees we are getting a good 1C.

      Who is the more complete player? I'm going with PLD because there's no surefire shot that KK becomes anything better than a 3C. This doesn't compare to the PK vs Weber trade whatsoever, I said MB won the trade when he made the deal and I say he won it now. Subban wasn't the better player then and he sure as hell isn't now.


      Agree to disagree I guess. I think KK is definitely better than a 3C. I think we've only seen a small sample size and from what I've seen he has all skills to be a 1C or 2C, he just hasn't put it together yet. Up till now he's been a kid. He got drafted 3rd overall for a reason. Everyone develops slightly different. 2 years is a big difference when you're talking about 22 vs. 19.I haven't seen enough PLD to know all his intangibles but I'm pretty high on KK as a pretty complete player. Don't see the need at this point to make a trade if CBJ want KK +... Too much to lose when you could hold onto the chips you have. Agree, Weber much better then and now. It is similar situation though.
      Jan 9 at 8:47
      #20
      Joined: Jan 2019
      Posts: 6,103
      Likes: 2,203
      Quoting: HabsRealGM
      Agree to disagree I guess. I think KK is definitely better than a 3C. I think we've only seen a small sample size and from what I've seen he has all skills to be a 1C or 2C, he just hasn't put it together yet. Up till now he's been a kid. He got drafted 3rd overall for a reason. Everyone develops slightly different. 2 years is a big difference when you're talking about 22 vs. 19.I haven't seen enough PLD to know all his intangibles but I'm pretty high on KK as a pretty complete player. Don't see the need at this point to make a trade if CBJ want KK +... Too much to lose when you could hold onto the chips you have. Agree, Weber much better then and now. It is similar situation though.


      For KK being better than a 3C, I'm talking about right now. There are no guarantees he develops into anything more. There's a real good shot he does, but nothing is guaranteed. I'm not saying KK is a bust or anything (Way too early to even consider that), I'm just talking about who will be the better player. Dubouis is 22 so everything you are saying about KK is the same for PLD. Neither players are even in their primes yet.
      HabsRealGM liked this.
       
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