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Is this fair

Created by: csick
Team: 2020-21 Columbus Blue Jackets
Initial Creation Date: Jan. 8, 2021
Published: Jan. 8, 2021
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Description
Dubois > Kopitar considering age and contract
Turcotte > Bemstrom to make up for the above difference
Trades
Buyouts
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2021
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2022
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2023
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ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
23$81,500,000$63,428,292$0$625,000$18,071,708
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$897,500$897,500
LW, C, RW
RFA - 1
Logo of the Los Angeles Kings
$10,000,000$10,000,000
C
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$2,500,000$2,500,000
RW, LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$2,750,000$2,750,000
LW, RW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$1,325,000$1,325,000
C, RW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$5,875,000$5,875,000
RW, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 5
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$1,375,000$1,375,000
LW, C, RW
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$3,750,000$3,750,000
C, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$894,167$894,167 (Performance Bonus$375,000$375K)
LW, C
RFA - 2
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$975,000$975,000
LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$1,500,000$1,500,000 (Performance Bonus$250,000$250K)
C
NMC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$874,125$874,125
C, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$1,200,000$1,200,000
C, LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$2,750,000$2,750,000
C, RW
UFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$5,000,000$5,000,000
LD
UFA - 2
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$5,400,000$5,400,000
RD
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$4,000,000$4,000,000
G
UFA - 2
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$2,800,000$2,800,000
LD
UFA - 3
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$1,062,500$1,062,500
RD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$2,800,000$2,800,000
G
UFA - 2
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$1,633,333$1,633,333
LD
UFA - 2
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$1,650,000$1,650,000
LD/RD
UFA - 2
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$725,000$725,000
LD
UFA - 2

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Jan. 8, 2021 at 4:44 p.m.
#1
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No lol
Jan. 8, 2021 at 4:46 p.m.
#2
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The most I'd do is:
Kopitar 2M retained
Akil Thomas

For
Dubois
Bemstrom
Dubinsky

You're undervaluing Kopitar because of his age yet he's shown no signs of slowing down despite being on a bad team. Kopitar put up 90 points playing with Iaffalo and Brown not that long ago and Dubois had how many points playing with Panarin and Atkinson?
Jan. 8, 2021 at 4:54 p.m.
#3
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This trade just doesn't make sense.
Jan. 8, 2021 at 4:56 p.m.
#4
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Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
The most I'd do is:
Kopitar 2M retained
Akil Thomas

For
Dubois
Bemstrom
Dubinsky

You're undervaluing Kopitar because of his age yet he's shown no signs of slowing down despite being on a bad team. Kopitar put up 90 points playing with Iaffalo and Brown not that long ago and Dubois had how many points playing with Panarin and Atkinson?


Dubois is worth more than Kopitar at this stage simply for contract and years of control left. He's a hall of famer in my opinion but he's signed for 4 years for 33-37 year old seasons. Most likely he gets consistently worse.

The flipside is Dubois is like 23 and signed for 2 years then team control as RFA.

While Kopitar was certainly the better player the last two years aging curves tell us that the most likely scenario is Dubois is the better over the next 4 and he'll be cheaper
csick liked this.
Jan. 8, 2021 at 5:02 p.m.
#5
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Quoting: BCAPP
Dubois is worth more than Kopitar at this stage simply for contract and years of control left. He's a hall of famer in my opinion but he's signed for 4 years for 33-37 year old seasons. Most likely he gets consistently worse.

The flipside is Dubois is like 23 and signed for 2 years then team control as RFA.

While Kopitar was certainly the better player the last two years aging curves tell us that the most likely scenario is Dubois is the better over the next 4 and he'll be cheaper


Dubois cheaper than 8M in 2 years, i doubt it. Yes he's cheaper right now, but within the next 2 years Kopitar is and will be better than Dubois. They're not just upgrading at center, they're getting a proven champion. A 2 time cup winner, 2 time selke winner, and Tortorella's dream center. It might seem like Kings would be adding, but don't be surprised, it very well could be the other way around especially if Kopitar is retained 2M+
Jan. 8, 2021 at 5:04 p.m.
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Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
Dubois cheaper than 8M in 2 years, i doubt it. Yes he's cheaper right now, but within the next 2 years Kopitar is and will be better than Dubois. They're not just upgrading at center, they're getting a proven champion. A 2 time cup winner, 2 time selke winner, and Tortorella's dream center. It might seem like Kings would be adding, but don't be surprised, it very well could be the other way around especially if Kopitar is retained 2M+


I'll go with father time winning, I'd rather have Dubois at 5 mil in 2020-2021 and 2021-2022 than Kopitar at 8 million.

I'd certainly rather have Dubois the two years after.

Not arguing any of those things you said about him. I think he's a hall of famer as I said. I think he got unfairly overshadowed by doughty and Jones and even Brown at times. Dudes awesome. But nobody beats father time. The only question is how long you can fight him
Jan. 8, 2021 at 5:06 p.m.
#7
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Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
The most I'd do is:
Kopitar 2M retained
Akil Thomas

For
Dubois
Bemstrom
Dubinsky

You're undervaluing Kopitar because of his age yet he's shown no signs of slowing down despite being on a bad team. Kopitar put up 90 points playing with Iaffalo and Brown not that long ago and Dubois had how many points playing with Panarin and Atkinson?


Dubois is worth more than Kopitar. You were gonna slot Kopitar as your 3C in 1-2 years. Don’t lie, I’ve seen your future lineups.

Bemstrom has more potential than Thomas. This deal doesn’t even make sense.
Jan. 8, 2021 at 5:07 p.m.
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Quoting: BCAPP
I'll go with father time winning, I'd rather have Dubois at 5 mil in 2020-2021 and 2021-2022 than Kopitar at 8 million.

I'd certainly rather have Dubois the two years after.

Not arguing any of those things you said about him. I think he's a hall of famer as I said. I think he got unfairly overshadowed by doughty and Jones and even Brown at times. Dudes awesome. But nobody beats father time. The only question is how long you can fight him


He's rarely injured and built to withstand father time longer than most players. He's only 33 lol he has another 3 great years in him. He'll slow down to 50-60 points in the 4th year possibly.
Jan. 8, 2021 at 5:13 p.m.
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Quoting: csick
Dubois is worth more than Kopitar. You were gonna slot Kopitar as your 3C in 1-2 years. Don’t lie, I’ve seen your future lineups.

Bemstrom has more potential than Thomas. This deal doesn’t even make sense.


I slotted him their because of Byfield and Vilardi, where was i supposed to put him? On the wing? Lol.

I have a lot of respect for you and you're one of my favorite users on here, but you're not looking into this enough.

Research Kopitar, he hasn't slowed down despite not having the greatest linemates and playing on a rebuilding team. He's never injured. He'll be just as good for another 3-4 years.

Dubois is good, but despite having Panarin and Atkinson as linemates he's never put up an impressive amount of points and is overrated in many ways.

Kopitar is better in every aspect and brings cup experience and an elite 2 way game to the team. Things Dubois can't bring.

You're undervaluing Kopitar and overvaluing Dubois. You make your excuse for Kings adding because of Kopitars age, yet there are no signs of him aging in his game. Just watch him and you'll find out.
Jan. 8, 2021 at 5:18 p.m.
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Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
I slotted him their because of Byfield and Vilardi, where was i supposed to put him? On the wing? Lol.

I have a lot of respect for you and you're one of my favorite users on here, but you're not looking into this enough.

Research Kopitar, he hasn't slowed down despite not having the greatest linemates and playing on a rebuilding team. He's never injured. He'll be just as good for another 3-4 years.

Dubois is good, but despite having Panarin and Atkinson as linemates he's never put up an impressive amount of points and is overrated in many ways.

Kopitar is better in every aspect and brings cup experience and an elite 2 way game to the team. Things Dubois can't bring.

You're undervaluing Kopitar and overvaluing Dubois. You make your excuse for Kings adding because of Kopitars age, yet there are no signs of him aging in his game. Just watch him and you'll find out.


He might still be solid right now. But in 4 years Dubois will be entering his prime and Kopitar would have declined. You have to make up for that imo.
Jan. 8, 2021 at 5:25 p.m.
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Quoting: csick
He might still be solid right now. But in 4 years Dubois will be entering his prime and Kopitar would have declined. You have to make up for that imo.


Kopitar isn't just solid he's a top 15 Center and a top 10 center in CBj. He's still an elite playmaker and an elite two way center. I added Akil Thomas in my counter offer who has top 6 potential.

Realistically Kopitar 2M retained = Dubois, even though I think Kopitar retained is worth more.

People think Dubois is worth more because he's younger and he's all the sudden going to be a 70-80 point player which is not evenly a likely scenario. Technically at 23 he is in his prime as we speak. Coming off a 49 point season I don't see how Kings add in this scenario, at all.
Jan. 8, 2021 at 6:22 p.m.
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Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
He's rarely injured and built to withstand father time longer than most players. He's only 33 lol he has another 3 great years in him. He'll slow down to 50-60 points in the 4th year possibly.


Stats don't agree with you. The majority of players age pretty hard right where he is. Sure there are exceptions but most do.

For a perfect example look at the excellent 2003 draft class.

At a quick glance the following were #1Cs at some point in their career
At peak:

Franchise C's
Getzlaf
E Staal
P Bergeron

#1 C but not franchise
Carter
Kesler

Maybe 1C for a bit but didn't maintain
M Richards
Backes

Check out that list. All of Getzlaf, E Staal and Bergeron deserve to be discussed with him.

How has that list done over the last two years? The only one still an all star is Bergeron.

Father time is a bi***
Jan. 8, 2021 at 6:27 p.m.
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Quoting: BCAPP
Stats don't agree with you. The majority of players age pretty hard right where he is. Sure there are exceptions but most do.

For a perfect example look at the excellent 2003 draft class.

At a quick glance the following were #1Cs at some point in their career
At peak:

Franchise C's
Getzlaf
E Staal
P Bergeron

#1 C but not franchise
Carter
Kesler

Maybe 1C for a bit but didn't maintain
M Richards
Backes

Check out that list. All of Getzlaf, E Staal and Bergeron deserve to be discussed with him.

How has that list done over the last two years? The only one still an all star is Bergeron.

Father time is a bi***


Kopitar is better offensively than Bergeron bud. He's been better despite not having as good of linemates. If Kopitar was in Boston and Bergeron was in LA i bet they'd have Kopitar over Bergeron, but that's a separate argument.

I don't get your point. Kopitar and Bergeron are still playing extremely well. Every draft class seems to have their ageless wonders. I'm not saying Father time won't catch up to Kopitar, I'm saying it hasn't yet and it likely won't for another 3+ years.
Jan. 8, 2021 at 6:50 p.m.
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Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
Kopitar is better offensively than Bergeron bud. He's been better despite not having as good of linemates. If Kopitar was in Boston and Bergeron was in LA i bet they'd have Kopitar over Bergeron, but that's a separate argument.

I don't get your point. Kopitar and Bergeron are still playing extremely well. Every draft class seems to have their ageless wonders. I'm not saying Father time won't catch up to Kopitar, I'm saying it hasn't yet and it likely won't for another 3+ years.


I'm not sure where I said Bergeron is better.

But regardless I pointed out to you 7 high end C's. 1 was still an all star by age 35. All but one declined fairly significantly around the season Kopitar is entering.

I'll take the odds (6/7 in this small sample size) that he shows his age in the very near future. You can hope he's the 1/7
 
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