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Wishful thinking

Created by: TJTwolf
Team: 2020-21 Colorado Avalanche
Initial Creation Date: Jan. 24, 2021
Published: Jan. 28, 2021
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Description
So the MTL trade was about 50/50 on uptake. Big edit after more input from Sens fans, and from the little feedback on Sissons it should be close. I left out the CAR trade as Slavin instead of Girard was basically irrelevant to cap and the rest of the roster even if a slight improvement on the D corps. There's enough cap to sign Danault to an extension at 5.5m and the following year is basically manageable one way or another.
Free Agent Signings
UFAYEARSCAP HIT
1$925,000
Trades
1.
COL
  1. Danault, Phillip
  2. 2021 4th round pick (VGK)
MTL
  1. Kadri, Nazem
  2. 2023 2nd round pick (COL)
2.
COL
  1. 2021 3rd round pick (VGK)
Additional Details:
Any team with the cap space who will give up a 3rd/4th. Picked Detroit purely because they have the space and VGK pick stands to be a low third.
3.
COL
  1. Sissons, Colton
Additional Details:
Pateryn is purely for cap balancing. Zero value hence the additional fourth rounder.
NSH
  1. Beaucage, Alex [Reserve List]
  2. Pateryn, Greg
  3. 2021 3rd round pick (VGK)
  4. 2021 4th round pick (VGK)
4.
Retained Salary Transactions
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2021
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
2022
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
2023
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
20$81,500,000$77,569,363$0$5,000,000$3,930,637

Roster

Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$5,571,429$5,571,429
LW, C
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$6,300,000$6,300,000
C
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$9,250,000$9,250,000
RW, C
UFA - 5
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$4,900,000$4,900,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,083,333$3,083,333
C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$5,000,000$5,000,000
LW, RW
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$2,500,000$2,500,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$3,500,000$3,500,000
C
UFA - 2
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$3,500,000$3,500,000
C, RW
UFA - 3
$925,000$925,000
RW, LW
UFA
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$874,125$874,125
C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Nashville Predators
$2,857,143$2,857,143
C, RW
UFA - 6
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$4,100,000$4,100,000
LD
UFA - 4
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$880,833$880,833 (Performance Bonus$2,500,000$2M)
RD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$3,333,333$3,333,333
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$5,000,000$5,000,000
LD/RD
UFA - 7
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$6,000,000$6,000,000
RD
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$725,000$725,000
G
UFA - 2
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$894,167$894,167 (Performance Bonus$2,500,000$2M)
LD/RD
RFA - 3
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$925,000$925,000
RD
RFA - 1
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$1,800,000$1,800,000
C, LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$2,850,000$2,850,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$2,000,000$2,000,000
G
UFA - 2
Taxi Squad
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$863,333$863,333 ($0$0$0$0) (Performance Bonus$425,000$425K)
RW
RFA - 3
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$925,000$925,000 ($0$0$0$0)
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$750,000$750,000 ($0$0$0$0)
LW, RW
UFA - 1

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Jan. 28, 2021 at 6:28 p.m.
#1
WentWughes
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Well this is how you ensure that Colorado wins the cup and Montreal misses the playoffs.
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 6:28 p.m.
#2
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kadri adds grit that danault doest have
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 6:31 p.m.
#3
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I know people are thinking that Kadri sucks and he must be traded.
And after his last game I’ve changed my mind a little, we have to face it he has had a bad start to the season, but he looked better last night. But he still has a long way to go to getting back to his true form.
I say we give Ol’kadri some time and if he still sucks let’s say in around 10 games then we may trade him.

But I’d like Danult, I would view him as an upgrade.

And the rest of the trades, just give the bottom 6 some time get situated and set and we will see. Because remember we are still early.

I think it’s to early to press the panic button and completely rework the bottom 6.
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 6:32 p.m.
#4
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Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
Well this is how you ensure that Colorado wins the cup and Montreal misses the playoffs.


Hence the 50/50 uptake, some think it's wise to cash in on Danault now if the rumours are true that he declined their offer, and others think better to hold onto him for the run at the cup. Both have their pros and cons.
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 6:33 p.m.
#5
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Edited Jan. 28, 2021 at 6:53 p.m.
Quoting: Pond_Duck
I know people are thinking that Kadri sucks and he must be traded.
And after his last game I’ve changed my mind a little, we have to face it he has had a bad start to the season, but he looked better last night. But he still has a long way to go to getting back to his true form.
I say we give Ol’kadri some time and if he still sucks let’s say in around 10 games then we may trade him.

But I’d like Danult, I would view him as an upgrade.

And the rest of the trades, just give the bottom 6 some time get situated and set and we will see. Because remember we are still early.

I think it’s to early to press the panic button and completely rework the bottom 6.


Absolutely agree on the panic button aspect (normally us saying that to you isn't it :P ), but there's no question there needs to be some work done in the #3C department.
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 6:42 p.m.
#6
Go Avs Go
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Quoting: TJTwolf
Absolutely agree on the panic button aspect (normally us saying that you isn't it :P ), but there's no question there needs to be some work done in the #3C department.


3C is an issue, is it fixable without causing greater damage is the question
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 6:48 p.m.
#7
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Quoting: Internetkingz
3C is an issue, is it fixable without causing greater damage is the question


I'm not sure I'd consider this damage per se but I get your meaning if you mean loss of prospects/picks. Were not giving up all that much tbh. There are likely to be some available for less later in the day (TDL) but do we want to wait that long? It's a tricky one especially with a shortened season.
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 6:55 p.m.
#8
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Quoting: TJTwolf
I'm not sure I'd consider this damage per se but I get your meaning if you mean loss of prospects/picks. Were not giving up all that much tbh. There are likely to be some available for less later in the day (TDL) but do we want to wait that long? It's a tricky one especially with a shortened season.


100% agree, it was more of a general statement than a reflection on this trade - I think it is decent trade no 2nd round picks for 3 yrs sucks but if it is the cost of a CUP "would pay it all day every day and twice on Sunday"
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 6:58 p.m.
#9
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Quoting: Internetkingz
100% agree, it was more of a general statement than a reflection on this trade - I think it is decent trade no 2nd round picks for 3 yrs sucks but if it is the cost of a CUP "would pay it all day every day and twice on Sunday"


Yeah I think most of us would take that in a heartbeat, and there's always the possibility of re-acquiring picks in later trades as the cap becomes more of an issue. Seconds are valuable but at least we kept all the firsts intact in this scenario. I'd say this would set us up to be contenders for more than one cup as well.
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:00 p.m.
#10
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Quoting: TJTwolf
Yeah I think most of us would take that in a heartbeat, and there's always the possibility of re-acquiring picks in later trades as the cap becomes more of an issue. Seconds are valuable but at least we kept all the firsts intact in this scenario. I'd say this would set us up to be contenders for more than one cup as well.


Definitely would keep the window open for some time
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:00 p.m.
#11
Serf
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Which Sens fans did you talk to because that's not even close for Tierney? Tierney isn't going to be traded for quantity.
Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:03 p.m.
#12
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Quoting: sensibleguy
Which Sens fans did you talk to because that's not even close for Tierney? Tierney isn't going to be traded for quantity.


LOL! You were one of them. Admittedly you didn't come back on the prospect bit at the end but you'd said the pick, add Bellemare and wanted a good prospect. I listed them all but got no reply so I picked one of the best. So it must be pretty close by your own admission. What more do you want now? LOL!
Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:04 p.m.
#13
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Quoting: TJTwolf
LOL! You were one of them. Admittedly you didn't come back on the prospect bit at the end but you'd said the pick, add Bellemare and wanted a good prospect. I listed them all but got no reply so I picked one of the best. So it must be pretty close by your own admission. What more do you want now? LOL!


Link please
Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:08 p.m.
#14
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Quoting: sensibleguy
Link please


https://www.capfriendly.com/forums/thread/412187
Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:16 p.m.
#15
gavinray
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Sens say no thank you
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:17 p.m.
#16
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Quoting: TJTwolf
LOL! You were one of them. Admittedly you didn't come back on the prospect bit at the end but you'd said the pick, add Bellemare and wanted a good prospect. I listed them all but got no reply so I picked one of the best. So it must be pretty close by your own admission. What more do you want now? LOL!


I found this thread
https://www.capfriendly.com/forums/thread/412178

The proposed trade was

COL
Tierney, Chris
OTT
Bellemare, Pierre-Édouard
Pateryn, Greg
2022 3rd round pick (COL)

My specific comments are these, with a couple others included

Quoting: sensibleguy
Tierney isn’t a long term solution in Ottawa, but he’s just 26 and plays an important role, and it’s unlikely they trade him for a couple of older players that aren’t even better than he is. So no, Ottawa doesn’t trade a younger better player for two older worse players, even if you include a late 3rd.


Quoting: TJTwolf
What are you thinking of as a starting point?


Quoting: TCMonkey
Honestly, Ottawa has no need for another B prospect with a low ceiling; they have plenty of those and more coming with four 2nd round picks in the next two years.
Tierney's under contract next season too so there's no pressure to move him for us. If we get a late first or a 2nd+ for him, maybe, but for less... I don't see it.


Quoting: TJTwolf
All fair points hence I re-did my offer in another post. Having done a little more digging I realised just how seriously I'd lowballed the starting point. Looking forward to seeing how he plays tonight to see if the eye test matches the stats (and yes I realise 1 game is no great sample, I'll try to watch more during the season) if I can stay awake for it.


Quoting: sensibleguy
I should expand on my comment, Justin Barron is the right prospect to offer for Tierney, in this situation. In 2012 redrafts, Tierney goes in the same pick range as Barron, and there’s no wondering what his impact in the NHL will be. This is a safe bet, and the age difference is the payment for getting the player you want.


My comment was the last in that particular thread.

My point was, Tierney should, and will probably be, traded for a defence upgrade, but in this situation, I figured a defence prospect would be close, but it had to be a comparable one in value though.

Justin Barron seems to be a decent prospect. Not looking for a Drysdale of course, but a late 1st round pick, that deserved to be first round, and hasn't regressed.
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:19 p.m.
#17
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Quoting: sensibleguy
I found this thread
https://www.capfriendly.com/forums/thread/412178

The proposed trade was

COL
Tierney, Chris
OTT
Bellemare, Pierre-Édouard
Pateryn, Greg
2022 3rd round pick (COL)

My specific comments are these, with a couple others included











My comment was the last in that particular thread.

My point was, Tierney should, and will probably be, traded for a defence upgrade, but in this situation, I figured a defence prospect would be close, but it had to be a comparable one in value though.

Justin Barron seems to be a decent prospect. Not looking for a Drysdale of course, but a late 1st round pick, that deserved to be first round, and hasn't regressed.


Yep we then went onto the one I linked above with an improved offer. Obviously still work needed there.
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:29 p.m.
#18
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Quoting: TJTwolf
https://www.capfriendly.com/forums/thread/412187


Quoting: sensibleguy
If the Avs are going for it, you should keep Compher and trade for Tierney. This is about making the Avs better by a lot, not just a little.


Quoting: sensibleguy
Avs might be good enough to win the cup without Tierney, but as other Stanley Cup winners have shown, it doesn’t hurt to be extra good enough. The prospect is just a prospect, and has a lot less value than the cup. But it’s all good, this is just a fun conversation. Cheers!


Quoting: sensibleguy
How has Bellemare played this season? If he hasn’t been good, add him, because this is about making the Avs better. With that $1.8MM, and the $2MM space right now, it’s enough, barely.

For Ottawa, it would have to be an expiring contract, so that means Bellemare, Calvert, or Pateryn added as a dump.


Quoting: sensibleguy
I really think you’re better off keeping Compher, is there another B+ prospect instead of Justin Barron? I hesitate to call him an A-, since that’s more in line with draft picks in the 10-20 range, and although Barron is close, he’s still in that 50/50 success rate group at the end of the first round, and has no outstanding skill, he’s solid across the board, a typical 4/5 D, which is good, of course, 4/5 D don’t grow on trees, lol.


It looks like I'm still talking about Barron. I remember seeing the list of prospects and just moving on because they were mostly forwards.

Foudy and a 3rd would be considered quantity. The Sens would be looking for a comparable single prospect, a late 1st round defenceman, if they decided on a prospect rather than a roster defenceman. I'd prefer that the Sens went after Marcus Pettersson, personally.

In the end, this is all just chat.
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:31 p.m.
#19
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Quoting: sensibleguy
It looks like I'm still talking about Barron. I remember seeing the list of prospects and just moving on because they were mostly forwards.

Foudy and a 3rd would be considered quantity. The Sens would be looking for a comparable single prospect, a late 1st round defenceman, if they decided on a prospect rather than a roster defenceman. I'd prefer that the Sens went after Marcus Pettersson, personally.

In the end, this is all just chat.


But of course. Might be that the Avs would have to gamble on Helleson stepping up and trade Barron or else send more than one prospect (i.e. Helleson as a D prospect a step down from Barron AND Foudy for example). Chat is always good. smile
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:40 p.m.
#20
Buffbry
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I know you said any team but let's scratch wings off that list. You pay for us to take him if he'd coming to us
Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:49 p.m.
#21
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Quoting: buffbry
I know you said any team but let's scratch wings off that list. You pay for us to take him if he'd coming to us


Donskoi still has that much value to any team that can fit him under the cap. Avs wouldn't be needing to pay anyone to take him I'm sure. They'd get a late 3rd/early 4th easily.
Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:56 p.m.
#22
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I do like Danault, but I don't think I'd do this deal unless he came with an extension. And even then why not wait to the off season and keep Kadri. Trading Naz throws a pretty big wrench in the chemistry. I would be down to sign Danault as a UFA and let Kadri go when his contract is up.

I also hate giving up Foudy. His ceiling is so enticing that I would be bummed.

Team looks good though and the trades aren't too crazy, so nice job.
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:56 p.m.
#23
Buffbry
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Quoting: TJTwolf
Donskoi still has that much value to any team that can fit him under the cap. Avs wouldn't be needing to pay anyone to take him I'm sure. They'd get a late 3rd/early 4th easily.


Not from the red wings, if you trade him elsewhere that is correct, if it's insisting on being the wings then avs pay for us to take him, not the other way around. We are not trading picks for these types of players at all during this rebuild. If you want the cap relief and it's to wings you pay. If it's to a playoff team you get your pick.
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Jan. 28, 2021 at 7:57 p.m.
#24
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@sensibleguy do you think the Sens would be interested in a Graves for Tierney trade if the Avs decided he was surplus to requirements?
Jan. 28, 2021 at 8:01 p.m.
#25
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Quoting: Anus_McLeod
I do like Danault, but I don't think I'd do this deal unless he came with an extension. And even then why not wait to the off season and keep Kadri. Trading Naz throws a pretty big wrench in the chemistry. I would be down to sign Danault as a UFA and let Kadri go when his contract is up.

I also hate giving up Foudy. His ceiling is so enticing that I would be bummed.

Team looks good though and the trades aren't too crazy, so nice job.


Thanks for the kind comment, don't get them too often LMAO. Yeah giving up Foudy would suck as I agree with you, but got to give to get. I think Danault is an upgrade, though only small, over Kadri. Signing him as a UFA and keeping both him and Kadri would be tough on the cap situation, hence both teams get something from the deal but yes, it does depend on getting Danault signed so there'd need to be at least some indication of that.
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