Forums/Armchair-GM

Shea Weber and David Poile

Created by: Habs4ever
Initial Creation Date: Feb 2, 2021
Published: Feb 2 at 11:12
Team: 2020-21 Montreal Canadiens
Team Explanation
I really don't understand GM David Poile. He gave a glowing interview about Shea Weber saying he is still felt in the preds locker room to this day, when he retires we will have a special place with the preds. His leadership is unmatched. His qualities of a human being is impressive. He cannot say enough good things about him and how good he was in the dressing room and on the ice. Then why trade him? he took on an extra $1.2 million in Subbans contract. There is just over 3 1/2 years in difference between the two players. Does PK have the leadership and pedigree of a Weber? NOPE, then why trade him? to add to the wound Subbans in Jersey now. Bad trade Mr. Poile!
Buyouts
  • Karl Alzner: $3,958,333
Buried
  • Jordan Weal: $325,000 ($1,400,000)
DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
2021
MTL
MTL
TBL
MTL
CHI
WSH
MTL
STL
VGK
MTL
OTT
PHI
MTL
MTL
2022
MTL
MTL
MTL
MTL
MTL
MTL
MTL
STL
2023
MTL
MTL
MTL
MTL
MTL
MTL
MTL
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES BONUSESCAP SPACE
22$81,500,000$81,541,309$0$3,137,500-$41,309
Left WingCenterRight Wing
MTL
Drouin, Jonathan
$5,500,000
LW
UFA - 3
MTL
Danault, Phillip
$3,083,333
C
UFA - 1
MTL
Anderson, Josh
$5,500,000
RW
UFA - 7
MTL
Tatar, Tomas
$4,800,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
MTL
Kotkaniemi, Jesperi
$925,000
C, LW
RFA - 1
MTL
Toffoli, Tyler
$4,250,000
RW, LW
UFA - 4
MTL
Byron, Paul
$3,400,000
LW, RW
UFA - 3
MTL
Suzuki, Nick
$863,333
C, RW
RFA - 2
MTL
Gallagher, Brendan
$3,750,000
RW
NMC
UFA - 1
MTL
Lehkonen, Artturi
$2,400,000
LW, RW
RFA - 1
MTL
Evans, Jake
$750,000
C, RW
RFA - 2
MTL
Armia, Joel
$2,600,000
RW, LW
UFA - 1
MTL
Perry, Corey
$750,000
RW
UFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
MTL
Edmundson, Joel
$3,500,000
LD
NTC
UFA - 4
MTL
Weber, Shea
$7,857,143
RD
UFA - 6
MTL
Price, Carey
$10,500,000
G
NMC
UFA - 6
MTL
Chiarot, Ben
$3,500,000
LD
NTC
UFA - 2
MTL
Petry, Jeff
$5,500,000
RD
NMC NTC
UFA - 1
MTL
Allen, Jake
$4,350,000
G
UFA - 1
MTL
Kulak, Brett
$1,850,000
LD
UFA - 2
MTL
Romanov, Alexander
$894,167
LD/RD
RFA - 2
MTL
Mete, Victor
$735,000
LD/RD
RFA - 1
Taxi Squad
MTL
Poehling, Ryan
$925,000 ($0)
C, LW
RFA - 1
MTL
Fleury, Cale
$771,666 ($0)
RD
RFA - 1
MTL
Lindgren, Charlie
$750,000 ($0)
G
UFA - 1
MTL
Frolík, Michael
$750,000 ($0)
LW, RW
UFA - 1

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Feb 2 at 11:15
#1
StarWars addict here
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 11,386
Likes: 5,104
Poile is a very subpar GM.

The Johansen and Duchene deal look awful

I knew from day one Bergevin robbed NSH by getting Weber

It was obvious to me that Jones would become much better than Johansen

Edit: not to mention the Girard trade
Kotkaniemi15 and Habs4ever liked this.
Feb 2 at 11:17
#2
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 94
Likes: 68
With Subban only playing 3years there, MTL easily won that trade imo. My feeling at the time of the trade and now are that Poile was scared about that contract running until Weber is like 41. Dman that play this type of game usally fall off a cliff past 30 but Weber proved he is such a great athlete that age wasn't such a big factor in his play.
Feb 2 at 11:18
#3
StarWars addict here
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 11,386
Likes: 5,104
Quoting: JulHok92
With Subban only playing 3years there, MTL easily won that trade imo. My feeling at the time of the trade and now are that Poile was scared about that contract running until Weber is like 41. Dman that play this type of game usally fall off a cliff past 30 but Weber proved he is such a great athlete that age wasn't such a big factor in his play.


Weber is basically Chara 2.0. He ages like the best of wines.

I'm willing to bet on Shea still being elite in 2 years, at 37
Kotkaniemi15 and Habs4ever liked this.
Feb 2 at 11:24
#4
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 2,607
Likes: 1,481
As great as Weber was in NSH, the team had hit a plateau. Subban brought new energy to the Preds. They started playing with swagger and hit new heights they hadn't reached with Weber (Finals run, President's trophy). NSH was winning that trade for awhile. Subban's body broke down before Weber's, but that couldn't have been predicted at the time of the trade. When PK's game started falling off Poile was smart to get out of his contract and get a decent return. I don't love that he used all PK's freed up cap space on Duchene, but that's a separate matter.
Feb 2 at 11:27
#5
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 9,271
Likes: 5,540
It’s safe to say that Poile simply overrated Subban.
Feb 2 at 11:29
#6
StarWars addict here
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 11,386
Likes: 5,104
Quoting: Kotkaniemi15
It’s safe to say that Poile simply overrated Subban.


Subban is the most overrated player of the 10s bar none
Kotkaniemi15 liked this.
Feb 2 at 11:35
#7
Thread Starter
Habs4ever
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,591
Likes: 655
Quoting: KakkoForMauriceRichardAward
Poile is a very subpar GM.

The Johansen and Duchene deal look awful

I knew from day one Bergevin robbed NSH by getting Weber

It was obvious to me that Jones would become much better than Johansen

Edit: not to mention the Girard trade


ya you brought up the Jones trade. Don't understand that one either!
Feb 2 at 11:38
#8
Thread Starter
Habs4ever
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,591
Likes: 655
Quoting: JulHok92
With Subban only playing 3years there, MTL easily won that trade imo. My feeling at the time of the trade and now are that Poile was scared about that contract running until Weber is like 41. Dman that play this type of game usally fall off a cliff past 30 but Weber proved he is such a great athlete that age wasn't such a big factor in his play.


good point but Weber's contract was very front loaded, if you look at his last three years. Yes I understand the cap but still. To be fair, Weber has slowed a little and Petry is now #1 d-man, which is fine because Weber still brings so many other intangibles.
Feb 2 at 11:38
#9
StarWars addict here
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 11,386
Likes: 5,104
Quoting: Habs4ever
good point but Weber's contract was very front loaded, if you look at his last three years. Yes I understand the cap but still. To be fair, Weber has slowed a little and Petry is now #1 d-man, which is fine because Weber still brings so many other intangibles.


Petry is only number 1 at offense.
habs_fan123 liked this.
Feb 2 at 11:39
#10
Thread Starter
Habs4ever
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,591
Likes: 655
Quoting: KakkoForMauriceRichardAward
Weber is basically Chara 2.0. He ages like the best of wines.

I'm willing to bet on Shea still being elite in 2 years, at 37


I think that assessment is fair. I was telling my son last night that Petry is now #1and Weber has slowed a touch but he still has this season and 2 more left in him. The last three years might be difficult.
Feb 2 at 11:46
#11
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 9,271
Likes: 5,540
Quoting: KakkoForMauriceRichardAward
Petry is only number 1 at offense.


Petry’s no slouch defensively. IMO he just goes under the radar because he’s peaked in his 30s and didn’t have a lot of recognition around the league like Weber did when he was younger. Weber is still really good, but I’d say that Petry’s slightly better than Weber right now.
Feb 2 at 11:46
#12
Thread Starter
Habs4ever
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,591
Likes: 655
Quoting: gmgb
As great as Weber was in NSH, the team had hit a plateau. Subban brought new energy to the Preds. They started playing with swagger and hit new heights they hadn't reached with Weber (Finals run, President's trophy). NSH was winning that trade for awhile. Subban's body broke down before Weber's, but that couldn't have been predicted at the time of the trade. When PK's game started falling off Poile was smart to get out of his contract and get a decent return. I don't love that he used all PK's freed up cap space on Duchene, but that's a separate matter.


I can see some of your points and agree with them. PK did bring a swagger but I have known PK personally since 2007. Fantastic family but I remember Guy Boucher with Hamilton Bulldogs of AHL calling me on the phone saying PK was driving him nuts and he was hard to keep focused. I told Guy, he will give you 4 amazing games and 1 game you will want to kill him. Focus on the 4 good ones he is giving you and try to flush the bad one. When he got to Montreal, I think in 5th or 6 season, I am pretty sure it was year six, there was a social gathering with the current players with alumni and their family. PK arrived wearing a massive hat and absolutely loved all the attention he was getting. Yvon Lambert and Stephan Lebeau both told me their overheard Guy Lafleur saying in French, someone needs to slap that guy to teach to respect those that played before him. Several of the players from the 70's were very put off by PK that night and it reached Bergevin's ears and his no trade was kicking in and he was concerned he might get worse once his no trade kicked in. So the decision was made to trade him.
Feb 2 at 11:47
#13
Thread Starter
Habs4ever
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,591
Likes: 655
Quoting: KakkoForMauriceRichardAward
Petry is only number 1 at offense.


I am only speaking this season. Petry is plus 10 and Weber just got out of the minus and it back to zero. Don't get me wrong, Weber is still a massive part of this team and important in many facets of the game.
Feb 2 at 11:50
#14
Thread Starter
Habs4ever
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,591
Likes: 655
Quoting: Kotkaniemi15
Petry’s no slouch defensively. IMO he just goes under the radar because he’s peaked in his 30s and didn’t have a lot of recognition around the league like Weber did when he was younger. Weber is still really good, but I’d say that Petry’s slightly better than Weber right now.


Petry was horrible defensively for many years. Case in point he is -106 for his career. I did not like Petry the first four years he was with Montreal and wanted to trade him. It has only been in the last three years I have liked his game.
Feb 2 at 11:52
#15
StarWars addict here
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 11,386
Likes: 5,104
Quoting: Habs4ever
I can see some of your points and agree with them. PK did bring a swagger but I have known PK personally since 2007. Fantastic family but I remember Guy Boucher with Hamilton Bulldogs of AHL calling me on the phone saying PK was driving him nuts and he was hard to keep focused. I told Guy, he will give you 4 amazing games and 1 game you will want to kill him. Focus on the 4 good ones he is giving you and try to flush the bad one. When he got to Montreal, I think in 5th or 6 season, I am pretty sure it was year six, there was a social gathering with the current players with alumni and their family. PK arrived wearing a massive hat and absolutely loved all the attention he was getting. Yvon Lambert and Stephan Lebeau both told me their overheard Guy Lafleur saying in French, someone needs to slap that guy to teach to respect those that played before him. Several of the players from the 70's were very put off by PK that night and it reached Bergevin's ears and his no trade was kicking in and he was concerned he might get worse once his no trade kicked in. So the decision was made to trade him.


Pk is a cancer
ColonelX liked this.
Feb 2 at 11:57
#16
Thread Starter
Habs4ever
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,591
Likes: 655
Quoting: KakkoForMauriceRichardAward
Pk is a cancer


I understand what you are trying to say. He is such a wonderful and kind human being but he has a hard time turning it off or knowing when to lower his presence for the greater good. I tried and tried and tried to remind him of that. So has his mother, father and sister lol
Feb 2 at 12:09
#17
StarWars addict here
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 11,386
Likes: 5,104
Quoting: Habs4ever
I understand what you are trying to say. He is such a wonderful and kind human being but he has a hard time turning it off or knowing when to lower his presence for the greater good. I tried and tried and tried to remind him of that. So has his mother, father and sister lol


Wait... you know him personally??
Feb 2 at 12:54
#18
Thread Starter
Habs4ever
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,591
Likes: 655
Quoting: KakkoForMauriceRichardAward
Wait... you know him personally??


I know this may be hard to believe but yes. Also it really doesn’t help that so many people lie online or are downright rude and ignorant to each other but I coached for 23 years in the Q & O. From 1998 until 2012 I had a large dry land training in the summer with 400 athletes from Ontario to Newfoundland. I worked with or met over a hundred nhl/ahl players. In 2014 I took retirement but still advise on the side. I actually enjoy cap friendly and think it is a good forum to share ideas. I still love the game. One team I was with after the first day of training camp I told my wife, we will make the playoffs, get swept in first round and only one player will have a successful career in the nhl. Exactly what I said happened. Not because I was a bad coach but because the GM and owner had lost their hunger for the game and lost their vision. So yes I really know him personally lol
Feb 2 at 2:05
#19
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 284
Likes: 69
easy to say with hindsight. then pk was a norris finalist and weber was hurt for two years straight. PLUS he was able to ditch the subban contract. this is mega monday morning qb'ing, was reasonable move and smash went to a cup final in his first year. this is a brutal take.
Feb 2 at 2:10
#20
Thread Starter
Habs4ever
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,591
Likes: 655
Quoting: Steve_321
easy to say with hindsight. then pk was a norris finalist and weber was hurt for two years straight. PLUS he was able to ditch the subban contract. this is mega monday morning qb'ing, was reasonable move and smash went to a cup final in his first year. this is a brutal take.


Weber was not injured at the time of the trade. I am only going on the interview given by GM David Poile. Based on what he said, I then went and looked at the age difference, contract and intangibles. I am only basing this post on what came out of the mouth of Mr. Poile recently, not what the players have done after the trade.
Feb 2 at 2:43
#21
habs_fan
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 2,881
Likes: 669
Quoting: Habs4ever
I know this may be hard to believe but yes. Also it really doesn’t help that so many people lie online or are downright rude and ignorant to each other but I coached for 23 years in the Q & O. From 1998 until 2012 I had a large dry land training in the summer with 400 athletes from Ontario to Newfoundland. I worked with or met over a hundred nhl/ahl players. In 2014 I took retirement but still advise on the side. I actually enjoy cap friendly and think it is a good forum to share ideas. I still love the game. One team I was with after the first day of training camp I told my wife, we will make the playoffs, get swept in first round and only one player will have a successful career in the nhl. Exactly what I said happened. Not because I was a bad coach but because the GM and owner had lost their hunger for the game and lost their vision. So yes I really know him personally lol


thats so cool
Habs4ever liked this.
Feb 2 at 3:21
#22
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 190
Likes: 16
The Trade was not about Webber or PK, It was all about the 13-8-8M signing Bonus Webber was owed and the length left on his contract . Subban was owed only 2-2M and was traded before his 6M bonus kicked in. IT WAS ALL ABOUT MONEY, Nashville is a small market hockey team.
Feb 2 at 3:31
#23
Thread Starter
Habs4ever
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,591
Likes: 655
Quoting: PrezDan
The Trade was not about Webber or PK, It was all about the 13-8-8M signing Bonus Webber was owed and the length left on his contract . Subban was owed only 2-2M and was traded before his 6M bonus kicked in. IT WAS ALL ABOUT MONEY, Nashville is a small market hockey team.


This is something to chew on, but we need to break it down further. Nashville had already paid four consecutive seasons of $13 million signing bonus for a total of $52 million already paid out. Nashville at this point had two years left of signing bonus at $8M each. If what you are saying is correct then the only thing I see is the owners ran into money troubles because the "pain" of the contract had already been paid out by this time.
 
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