Forums/Armchair-GM

Cap Situation and Sergachev Solution

Created by: OldNYIfan
Initial Creation Date: Feb 27, 2021
Published: Feb 27 at 4:22
Team: 2021-22 Tampa Bay Lightning
Team Explanation
Let's suppose Seattle obliges Tampa and takes one of the Lightning's big-hit forwards off their hands. That still doesn't solve Tampa's cap problem, because with Nikita Kucherov back, they have 16 players under contract with only $1,783,333 in cap space. So this trade might be necessary.

I've been kicking around variations of this idea with my friend ZiggyPalffy. We both agree that it would be great for the Kings, good for the Lightning, and unlikely to happen in real life. But it's fun to think about.

In the main trade, Jaret Anderson-Dolan and Tyler Madden are alternatives to Akil Thomas (who's right-handed), and there are a wide variety of bottom-6 forwards available as alternatives to Blake Lizotte.
Free Agent Signings
RFAYEARSCAP HIT
Foote, Cal2$1,250,000
Lizotte, Blake2$1,250,000
Volkov, Alexander2$980,000
Clague, Kale2$900,000
Raddysh, Taylor2$850,000
Barré-Boulet, Alex2$800,000
Day, Sean2$750,000
Borgman, Andreas2$750,000
Martin, Spencer2$750,000
UFAYEARSCAP HIT
Coleman, Blake4$2,500,000
Driedger, Chris2$1,325,000
Schenn, Luke2$800,000
Smith, Gemel2$750,000
Trades
TBL
    Seattle, not Las Vegas
    VGK
    1. Palat, Ondrej
    2. 2021 1st round pick (TBL)
    TBL
    1. Turcotte, Alex
    2. Thomas, Akil
    3. Lizotte, Blake [RFA Rights]
    4. Clague, Kale [RFA Rights]
    5. 2021 1st round pick (LAK)
    LAK
    1. Johnson, Tyler
    2. Sergachev, Mikhail
    Buyouts
    • Vincent Lecavalier: $0
    DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
    2021
    LAK
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    NSH
    NJD
    2022
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    2023
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    TBL
    ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES BONUSESCAP SPACE
    23$81,500,000$80,696,666$0$1,550,000$803,334
    Left WingCenterRight Wing
    TBL
    Coleman, Blake
    $2,500,000
    LW, RW
    UFA
    TBL
    Point, Brayden
    $6,750,000
    C, RW
    RFA - 1
    TBL
    Kucherov, Nikita
    $9,500,000
    RW
    NMC
    UFA - 6
    TBL
    Killorn, Alex
    $4,450,000
    LW
    NTC
    UFA - 2
    TBL
    Cirelli, Anthony
    $4,800,000
    C
    RFA - 2
    TBL
    Stamkos, Steven
    $8,500,000
    C, RW
    NMC
    UFA - 3
    TBL
    Gourde, Yanni
    $5,166,666
    C, LW, RW
    NTC
    UFA - 4
    LAK
    Turcotte, Alex
    $925,000
    C
    RFA - 2
    TBL
    Volkov, Alexander
    $980,000
    LW, RW
    RFA
    TBL
    Maroon, Patrick
    $900,000
    LW, RW
    NTC
    UFA - 1
    Lizotte, Blake
    $1,250,000
    C
    RFA
    TBL
    Raddysh, Taylor
    $850,000
    RW
    RFA
    TBL
    Joseph, Mathieu
    $737,500
    C, LW, RW
    RFA - 1
    TBL
    Stephens, Mitchell
    $737,500
    C
    RFA - 1
    Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
    TBL
    Hedman, Victor
    $7,875,000
    LD
    NMC
    UFA - 4
    TBL
    Cernak, Erik
    $2,950,000
    RD
    RFA - 2
    TBL
    Vasilevskiy, Andrei
    $9,500,000
    G
    NMC
    UFA - 7
    TBL
    McDonagh, Ryan
    $6,750,000
    LD
    NTC
    UFA - 5
    TBL
    Rutta, Jan
    $1,300,000
    RD
    UFA - 1
    Driedger, Chris
    $1,325,000
    G
    UFA
    Clague, Kale
    $900,000
    LD
    RFA
    TBL
    Foote, Cal
    $1,250,000
    RD
    RFA
    TBL
    Schenn, Luke
    $800,000
    RD
    UFA
    Taxi Squad
    LAK
    Thomas, Akil
    $795,000 ($0)
    C
    RFA - 2
    TBL
    Barré-Boulet, Alex
    $800,000 ($0)
    C
    RFA
    TBL
    Smith, Gemel
    $750,000 ($0)
    C
    UFA
    TBL
    Borgman, Andreas
    $750,000 ($0)
    LD
    RFA
    TBL
    Day, Sean
    $750,000 ($0)
    LD
    RFA
    TBL
    Martin, Spencer
    $750,000 ($0)
    G
    RFA

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    Feb 27 at 4:27
    #1
    Go Wings Go
    Joined: Jun 2016
    Posts: 28,999
    Likes: 6,704
    LA isn't trading Turcotte, Tyler Johnson isn't waiving for LA and Sergachev isn't going anywhere either.
    Bolts20Cup liked this.
    Feb 27 at 4:29
    #2
    Banned
    Joined: May 2018
    Posts: 9,721
    Likes: 2,801
    If we are taking Johnson too, then we probably don't have to add the 1st.

    Like I said, I wouldn't do it if it costed more than Turcotte and Clague, but this is interesting.
    OldNYIfan liked this.
    Feb 27 at 4:33
    #3
    Joined: May 2017
    Posts: 1,432
    Likes: 456
    No chance Tampa Bay pays to Dump Palat if Seattle takes Palat that's it. Pay to take Johnson not Palat.
    Forget Sergachev going anywhere
    Feb 27 at 4:42
    #4
    Moderna 5G
    Joined: Sep 2020
    Posts: 1,453
    Likes: 779
    "good for the Lightning"

    Terrible*

    Sergachev is the present and future of Tampa's blue line. Any deal involving him leaving Tampa is bad for the Lightning.
    Feb 27 at 4:46
    #5
    Thread Starter
    First NY Then LA
    Joined: Jun 2018
    Posts: 17,325
    Likes: 8,570
    Quoting: DiehardRedWingsFan58
    LA isn't trading Turcotte, Tyler Johnson isn't waiving for LA and Sergachev isn't going anywhere either.


    We're trading Turcotte if it means getting Sergachev. And it's probably the only way anyone does get Sergachev.
    ZiggyPalffy liked this.
    Feb 27 at 4:49
    #6
    Banned
    Joined: May 2018
    Posts: 9,721
    Likes: 2,801
    Quoting: CoopsTroops
    "good for the Lightning"

    Terrible*

    Sergachev is the present and future of Tampa's blue line. Any deal involving him leaving Tampa is bad for the Lightning.


    Read the bio moron, he explains the unlikelihood of it happening above.

    However, there's no question this is a complete overpay from LA.
    OldNYIfan liked this.
    Feb 27 at 4:50
    #7
    Thread Starter
    First NY Then LA
    Joined: Jun 2018
    Posts: 17,325
    Likes: 8,570
    Quoting: Bolts20Cup
    No chance Tampa Bay pays to Dump Palat if Seattle takes Palat that's it. Pay to take Johnson not Palat.
    Forget Sergachev going anywhere


    Yeah, I doubt that Sergachev goes anywhere, but it's the trade du jour, so I'm in.

    If Seattle doesn't take Palat (or Gourde or Johnson), your 2021-2022 cap situation goes from "abysmal" to "this year."
    ZiggyPalffy liked this.
    Feb 27 at 4:52
    #8
    Thread Starter
    First NY Then LA
    Joined: Jun 2018
    Posts: 17,325
    Likes: 8,570
    Quoting: CoopsTroops
    "good for the Lightning"

    Terrible*

    Sergachev is the present and future of Tampa's blue line. Any deal involving him leaving Tampa is bad for the Lightning.


    Right now your 2021-2022 roster is $6.78 million over the cap with only 17 guys signed, and without Coleman or Goodrow. The idea that "any deal involving Sergachev leaving Tampa is bad for the Lightning" ignores reality.
    Feb 27 at 4:54
    #9
    Moderna 5G
    Joined: Sep 2020
    Posts: 1,453
    Likes: 779
    Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
    Read the bio moron, he explains the unlikelihood of it happening above.

    However, there's no question this is a complete overpay from LA.


    Moron, the quote is directly from the bio. Specifically said:
    "We both agree that it would be great for the Kings, good for the Lightning"

    Whether you think it's realistic or not, it's worded as you think it's good for the Lightning. Take an English lesson maybe?
    Feb 27 at 4:59
    #10
    Moderna 5G
    Joined: Sep 2020
    Posts: 1,453
    Likes: 779
    Quoting: OldNYIfan
    Right now your 2021-2022 roster is $6.78 million over the cap with only 17 guys signed, and without Coleman or Goodrow. The idea that "any deal involving Sergachev leaving Tampa is bad for the Lightning" ignores reality.


    Why does Goodrow or Coleman have to be signed? There's no way we are going to keep them after the season to begin with. Also, the only thing ignoring reality with Sergachev were the people signing him to offer sheets left and right on here this fall and believing it would happen.
    Feb 27 at 5:06
    #11
    Banned
    Joined: May 2018
    Posts: 9,721
    Likes: 2,801
    Quoting: CoopsTroops
    Moron, the quote is directly from the bio. Specifically said:
    "We both agree that it would be great for the Kings, good for the Lightning"

    Whether you think it's realistic or not, it's worded as you think it's good for the Lightning. Take an English lesson maybe?


    Right after that it says "unlikely to happen in real life" so maybe you should look into reading classes or buy some glasses.

    When you have to trade someone you don't want to trade in order to fit 10+ in cap next year, you might wonder what it would look like with 900k Clague on your 3rd pair and 2-3 years of Turcotte on an ELC.

    Acting like this makes the Lightning worse when you have guys like Hedman and McDonagh is kind of funny. Clague plays a similar game to Sergachev, of course he's not near as good, but how many points does a 3LD actually need to put up when you have Hedman and McDonagh.

    I don't believe OldNYIFan meant to trigger you by posting this. However, I happen to be enjoying itwink
    OldNYIfan liked this.
    Feb 27 at 5:07
    #12
    Thread Starter
    First NY Then LA
    Joined: Jun 2018
    Posts: 17,325
    Likes: 8,570
    Quoting: CoopsTroops
    Why does Goodrow or Coleman have to be signed? There's no way we are going to keep them after the season to begin with. Also, the only thing ignoring reality with Sergachev were the people signing him to offer sheets left and right on here this fall.


    Well, I was under the impression that Coleman and Goodrow were worth more to you than the bottom-6 guys who would replace them.

    I really am surprised at your use of the word "terrible" to describe this trade from the Lightning's PoV. Right now you have a more than $10 million cap problem. With this trade (plus the Seattle selection), that problem is solved permanently and you get a prospect who is projected to be your #2 center in a couple of years, plus a 2021 first-round draft pick that's likely to be better than the one you have now, plus various other players including Blake Coleman and two NHLers. If you want to consider that an inadequate return for Sergachev, fine, but to consider this trade "terrible" for Tampa is to ignore the fact that you'd be unlikely to have him now but for the unfortunate injury to Nikita Kucherov.
    Feb 27 at 5:09
    #13
    Moderna 5G
    Joined: Sep 2020
    Posts: 1,453
    Likes: 779
    Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
    Right after that it says "unlikely to happen in real life" so maybe you should look into reading classes or buy some glasses.

    When you have to trade someone you don't want to trade in order to fit 10+ in cap next year, you might wonder what it would look like with 900k Clague on your 3rd pair and 2-3 years of Turcotte on an ELC.

    Acting like this makes the Lightning worse when you have guys like Hedman and McDonagh is kind of funny. Clague plays a similar game to Sergachev, of course he's not near as good, but how many points does a 3LD actually need to put up when you have Hedman and McDonagh.

    I don't believe OldNYIFan meant to trigger you by posting this. However, I happen to be enjoying itwink


    I give credit where due. You have one hard head. Enjoy your day.
    Feb 27 at 5:16
    #14
    Moderna 5G
    Joined: Sep 2020
    Posts: 1,453
    Likes: 779
    Quoting: OldNYIfan
    Well, I was under the impression that Coleman and Goodrow were worth more to you than the bottom-6 guys who would replace them.

    I really am surprised at your use of the word "terrible" to describe this trade from the Lightning's PoV. Right now you have a more than $10 million cap problem. With this trade (plus the Seattle selection), that problem is solved permanently and you get a prospect who is projected to be your #2 center in a couple of years, plus a 2021 first-round draft pick that's likely to be better than the one you have now, plus various other players including Blake Coleman and two NHLers. If you want to consider that an inadequate return for Sergachev, fine, but to consider this trade "terrible" for Tampa is to ignore the fact that you'd be unlikely to have him now but for the unfortunate injury to Nikita Kucherov.


    Goodrow and Coleman are going to be paid far more than what we can afford, with or without Sergachev on the roster. There's no price in prospects or draft capital that won't be paid to open up the cap space to be compliant with Kucherov back next year.

    As for Sergachev, you grossly undervalue him. Already producing at a higher 5v5 pace than Hedman and defense that is on the high end of 22 year olds in the NHL. He is the future of the defense and team, and to think we would be content with trading him because we still have McDonagh as a #2 is absurd. We'll cross the McDonagh bridge with a buyout, likely, down the line, but trading Sergachev might as well be JBB handing in his resignation papers to the owner.
    Bolts20Cup and JTBF81 liked this.
    Feb 27 at 5:16
    #15
    Banned
    Joined: May 2018
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    Quoting: CoopsTroops
    I give credit where due. You have one hard head. Enjoy your day.


    You as well. Try not to let mine and OldNYIFans trade ideas trigger you, you'll go bald and we don't want that.
    mhroblak liked this.
    Feb 27 at 5:18
    #16
    Hates Eichel Trades
    Joined: Aug 2020
    Posts: 822
    Likes: 349
    Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
    You as well. Try not to let mine and OldNYIFans trade ideas trigger you, you'll go bald and we don't want that.


    Oh my god
    Feb 27 at 5:18
    #17
    Moderna 5G
    Joined: Sep 2020
    Posts: 1,453
    Likes: 779
    Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
    You as well. Try not to let mine and OldNYIFans trade ideas trigger you, you'll go bald and we don't want that.


    NYI is fine. I might buy you a Rosetta Stone English package for valentines day next year though wink
    Feb 27 at 5:22
    #18
    Banned
    Joined: May 2018
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    Quoting: CoopsTroops
    NYI is fine. I might buy you a Rosetta Stone English package for valentines day next year though wink


    I'd appreciate that, I always wanted to learn Russian.
    OldNYIfan liked this.
    Feb 27 at 5:26
    #19
    Joined: May 2017
    Posts: 1,432
    Likes: 456
    Quoting: OldNYIfan
    Yeah, I doubt that Sergachev goes anywhere, but it's the trade du jour, so I'm in.

    If Seattle doesn't take Palat (or Gourde or Johnson), your 2021-2022 cap situation goes from "abysmal" to "this year."


    Seattle is going to be persuaded to take Johnson and if he's playing well it makes a lot of sense for them.i think Gonclaves a 3&5 does it. No chance they pay to Dump Palat a guy who over the last 3 season's has over 70%of his points 5x5 with 1 year on the contract and certainly not a 1 to do so if I'm miraculously wrong
    CoopsTroops liked this.
    Feb 27 at 5:27
    #20
    Thread Starter
    First NY Then LA
    Joined: Jun 2018
    Posts: 17,325
    Likes: 8,570
    Quoting: CoopsTroops
    Goodrow and Coleman are going to be paid far more than what we can afford, with or without Sergachev on the roster. There's no price in prospects or draft capital that won't be paid to open up the cap space to be compliant with Kucherov back next year.

    As for Sergachev, you grossly undervalue him. Already producing at a higher 5v5 pace than Hedman and defense that is on the high end of 22 year olds in the NHL. He is the future of the defense and team, and to think we would be content with trading him because we still have McDonagh as a #2 is absurd. We'll cross the McDonagh bridge with a buyout, likely, down the line, but trading Sergachev might as well be JBB handing in his resignation papers to the owner.


    I don't undervalue Sergachev at all. That's why I'm paying a 2019 first-round draft pick that was 5th overall and seems to be on a path to fulfilling that promise, another first-round draft pick, and an NHL-level LD that can at least fill the hole left on that side for Sergachev.

    I think that there's a little "target attraction" at work here. You seem to be focused narrowly on the idea of trading Sergachev away without even looking at the "big picture" that might justify it, even if only on the surface. I confess to the same myopia when someone suggests trading Anze Kopitar -- I would have a hard time agreeing to exchange him for Leon Draisaitl straight up. And don't get me started on John Gibson trades I see every week.
    ZiggyPalffy liked this.
    Feb 27 at 5:28
    #21
    Thread Starter
    First NY Then LA
    Joined: Jun 2018
    Posts: 17,325
    Likes: 8,570
    Quoting: Bolts20Cup
    Seattle is going to be persuaded to take Johnson and if he's playing well it makes a lot of sense for them.i think Gonclaves a 3&5 does it


    Good luck with that. For your sake, I hope that happens. (But why am I sympathizing with the current Stanley Cup holders for someone to solve their problems?)
    ZiggyPalffy liked this.
    Feb 27 at 5:30
    #22
    Joined: May 2019
    Posts: 5,941
    Likes: 2,053
    Why not offer Byfield?
    As an off-season deal, of course.
    If Tampa Bay really needs cap and/or center. Many seem to like him over Turcotte (not saying they're right).
    Feb 27 at 5:32
    #23
    Moderna 5G
    Joined: Sep 2020
    Posts: 1,453
    Likes: 779
    Quoting: OldNYIfan
    I don't undervalue Sergachev at all. That's why I'm paying a 2019 first-round draft pick that was 5th overall and seems to be on a path to fulfilling that promise, another first-round draft pick, and an NHL-level LD that can at least fill the hole left on that side for Sergachev.

    I think that there's a little "target attraction" at work here. You seem to be focused narrowly on the idea of trading Sergachev away without even looking at the "big picture" that might justify it, even if only on the surface. I confess to the same myopia when someone suggests trading Anze Kopitar -- I would have a hard time agreeing to exchange him for Leon Draisaitl straight up. And don't get me started on John Gibson trades I see every week.


    You're getting too complicated with this. Sergachev was the first one signed out of last seasons RFAs for a reason. He's the #1 priority along with Point moving forward for Tampa. He's untouchable. If you want to make a case for trading Cirelli or maybe Cernak, go for it, but that's still worst case scenario.
    Feb 27 at 5:32
    #24
    Banned
    Joined: May 2018
    Posts: 9,721
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    Quoting: NHLfan10506
    Why not offer Byfield?
    As an off-season deal, of course.
    If Tampa Bay really needs cap and/or center. Many seem to like him over Turcotte (not saying they're right).


    Because Kings aren't paying a 2OA pick for a guy that has gotten over 40 points once regardless of how many people overvalue Sergachev.
    OldNYIfan liked this.
    Feb 27 at 5:33
    #25
    Banned
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    Quoting: CoopsTroops
    You're getting too complicated with this. Sergachev was the first one signed out of last seasons RFAs for a reason. He's the #1 priority along with Point moving forward for Tampa. He's untouchable. If you want to make a case for trading Cirelli or maybe Cernak, go for it, but that's still worst case scenario.


    Untouchable lol. As long as Hedman is there, Sergachev is 'touchable'
     
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