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Start developing and Marner rant

Created by: GarthBrooks
Team: 2021-22 Toronto Maple Leafs
Initial Creation Date: Jun. 2, 2021
Published: Jun. 2, 2021
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Description
Give SDA and Robertson minutes next season. It’s not like SDA can be any worse than Kerfoot when it comes to goal scoring. Adam Brooks gets a full time spot on the roster as well. Sign Hakanpaa, a young big strong defensive defenseman. Resign Simmonds cause he’d be cheap and can still be a net front presence on the PP (even though he forgot in the playoffs). Rielly and Sandin need new contracts after this season, but i wouldn’t pay Rielly 7 or 8 million because he isn’t worth #1 D man money just because he puts up points. The other end matters too

Marners getting a lot of flack by reporters recently with stories coming out about him being a prima dona to teammates/staff and refused to change roles on the PP but that probably comes from getting paid 11 million dollars after his ELC. Dubas set this kid up for failure but we’re never going to get proper value back so keep him. Tell Keefe to grow some nuts and punish the kid for mistakes, Jon Cooper benched Kucherov after giveaways and Kucherov is way better than Mitch. A guy who is top 5 in the league in points and it mostly comes from assists and he has a generational goal scorer on his line, does he really deserve all the credit? Martin St.Louis won the art Ross, he had Lecavalier and Stamkos on his line throughout his career, both Lecavalier and Stamkos got paid like a superstar while St.Louis got less because people understood why. It’s not like he got paid peanuts, it was still a good amount, but imagine if teams paid guys like them as much as the generational goal scorer on their line. It doesn’t make any sense. I know it’s hard to distinguish the assist man’s impact on goals like Eichel and Skinner where it’s Eichel that was the generational talent passing to Skinner and then Skinner got paid heavy and now you see he’s trash. Maybe if Kruger kept them on the same like Skinner would get a bunch of secondary assists (and Eichel was healthy) and we’d go oh Skinners a great player too. It’s a mess but it’s Dubas’ mess so instead of dropping classic excuses take some responsibility for this trash bag of a cap hit.
Free Agent Signings
UFAYEARSCAP HIT
3$4,500,000
1$750,000
1$1,250,000
4$4,000,000
2$3,000,000
3$2,000,000
2$3,000,000
1$1,000,000
Trades
Retained Salary Transactions
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2021
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Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
2022
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Logo of the TOR
2023
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
21$81,500,000$81,296,450$0$400,000$203,550
Left WingCentreRight Wing
$3,000,000$3,000,000
LW, RW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$11,640,250$11,640,250
C
UFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$6,962,366$6,962,366
RW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$4,500,000$4,500,000
RW, LW
UFA - 7
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$11,000,000$11,000,000
C, LW
NMC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$10,903,000$10,903,000
RW
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$796,667$796,667
LW, RW
RFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$766,667$766,667
C
RFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,645,000$1,645,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,000,000$1,000,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$725,000$725,000
C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$750,000$750,000
C, RW
UFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,000,000$5,000,000
LD
NMC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,000,000$5,000,000
LD/RD
NTC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,650,000$1,650,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,625,000$5,625,000
LD
NTC
UFA - 3
$4,000,000$4,000,000
RD
UFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$894,167$894,167
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,000,000$2,000,000
RD
M-NTC
UFA - 2
$1,250,000$1,250,000
G
UFA - 2
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$863,333$863,333 (Performance Bonus$400,000$400K)
RD
RFA - 1
$3,000,000$3,000,000
LD/RD
UFA
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,000,000$2,000,000
LW, C, RW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$750,000$750,000
RW
RFA - 2
Taxi Squad
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,250,000$1,250,000 ($125,000$125K$125,000$125K)
RW, LW
UFA - 1

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Jun. 2, 2021 at 4:24 p.m.
#1
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Edited Jun. 2, 2021 at 4:30 p.m.
Ignoring his poor Playoffs, you can't take his regular season stats away from him by saying "he plays with Matthews"..

Marner put up similar stats with Tavares (also a star) but most importantly he did it with Bozak and Van Riemsdyk

As for the St. Louis comparison, he signed 2 contracts in the salary cap era. The first was at age 28 and was 6 years at 13.46% of the cap. This would be $10,969,900 per year over 6 years today... Keep in mind that this contract also took him to the age of 35 so it missed most of his prime, which Marners deal is not.. Despite this, the value is actually $900k above what Marner is being paid..

If you are however referring to his final contract, I dont think it is fair to compare a guy signing at the age of 22 to a guy signing at the age of 35 but nonetheless.. St. Louis signed a 4 year deal worth 9.47% of the cap, which would be $7,718,050 per year today. He would only have been making about $3M less than Marner and you get a 35-39 year old St. Louis vs a 22-28 year old Marner...

To blame Dubas for any of this mess is a bit crazy too. Not only does he have to sign his stars young because that is what the league is dictating now, but not even 3 years ago people were praising Marner for being the only "playoff player" the leafs had while jumping all over Willy. This year is now the complete opposite. This isnt to defend Marner though, because when you are being paid like he is then he needs to perform. My point is to defend Dubas as he made all the right moves.

Just a horrible take tbh..
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Jun. 2, 2021 at 4:25 p.m.
#2
Smythe.over.Hart
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In all honesty Marner is paid about 1.5 mill too much. If the Salary Cap had kept rising as well anticipated it would it wouldn't be as glaring. Matthews was paid about a million too much and 2 years to short on term. So now it is up to Dubas to find an extra 2.5 M in value for free. This is also the final year of Kessel on the books. Another 1.2 million. So it is darn close to 4 million that Dubas needs to find in value in other players to make up for these mistakes, his mistakes or not.

This year we got outrageous value on return for Spezza. I hope beyond reasoning that he comes back. Convincing a player like Getzlaf to sign for a low deal would be of extreme value. I said it at the start of the season that Montreal got the greatest bargain in Corey Perry however. He is a playoff performer.

Resigning Hyman is of top priority. Getting a solid tandem for Campbell. And acquiring yet again another grit type player who can go anywhere in the lineup. Foligno, Coleman, Jenner. Let Sandin continue to try and develop on the 3rd pairing. Brooks should play full time now (so happy about that too!). Hopefully another kid is ready to make an impact. Robertson in my mind has shown zero reason to be full time NHL ready. If other players such as Bogosion and Simmonds are available for cheap deals they bring value as well. Bogo was great for us in the playoffs.
sammy_daws1997 liked this.
Jun. 2, 2021 at 4:30 p.m.
#3
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So basically if Keefe coaches more like Babcock. 🤣
Jun. 2, 2021 at 4:34 p.m.
#4
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Quoting: faulkmydzingel
In all honesty Marner is paid about 1.5 mill too much. If the Salary Cap had kept rising as well anticipated it would it wouldn't be as glaring. Matthews was paid about a million too much and 2 years to short on term. So now it is up to Dubas to find an extra 2.5 M in value for free. This is also the final year of Kessel on the books. Another 1.2 million. So it is darn close to 4 million that Dubas needs to find in value in other players to make up for these mistakes, his mistakes or not.

This year we got outrageous value on return for Spezza. I hope beyond reasoning that he comes back. Convincing a player like Getzlaf to sign for a low deal would be of extreme value. I said it at the start of the season that Montreal got the greatest bargain in Corey Perry however. He is a playoff performer.

Resigning Hyman is of top priority. Getting a solid tandem for Campbell. And acquiring yet again another grit type player who can go anywhere in the lineup. Foligno, Coleman, Jenner. Let Sandin continue to try and develop on the 3rd pairing. Brooks should play full time now (so happy about that too!). Hopefully another kid is ready to make an impact. Robertson in my mind has shown zero reason to be full time NHL ready. If other players such as Bogosion and Simmonds are available for cheap deals they bring value as well. Bogo was great for us in the playoffs.


I think re-signing Bogo is also a priority to play with Sandin/Dermott. He would have to be about $1M or less though..
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Jun. 2, 2021 at 5:05 p.m.
#5
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Quoting: sammy_daws1997
Ignoring his poor Playoffs, you can't take his regular season stats away from him by saying "he plays with Matthews"..

Marner put up similar stats with Tavares (also a star) but most importantly he did it with Bozak and Van Riemsdyk

As for the St. Louis comparison, he signed 2 contracts in the salary cap era. The first was at age 28 and was 6 years at 13.46% of the cap. This would be $10,969,900 per year over 6 years today... Keep in mind that this contract also took him to the age of 35 so it missed most of his prime, which Marners deal is not.. Despite this, the value is actually $900k above what Marner is being paid..

If you are however referring to his final contract, I dont think it is fair to compare a guy signing at the age of 22 to a guy signing at the age of 35 but nonetheless.. St. Louis signed a 4 year deal worth 9.47% of the cap, which would be $7,718,050 per year today. He would only have been making about $3M less than Marner and you get a 35-39 year old St. Louis vs a 22-28 year old Marner...

To blame Dubas for any of this mess is a bit crazy too. Not only does he have to sign his stars young because that is what the league is dictating now, but not even 3 years ago people were praising Marner for being the only "playoff player" the leafs had while jumping all over Willy. This year is now the complete opposite. This isnt to defend Marner though, because when you are being paid like he is then he needs to perform. My point is to defend Dubas as he made all the right moves.

Just a horrible take tbh..


Yes but Lecavalier got paid 7.7 which equates to whatever percentage Iunno the maths too good. And even that was bad because I think it’s safe to say St. Louis career ended better than Lecavalier. But say St. Louis got paid closer to Lecavalier like within a million, and then they signed Stamkos to close to that amount after his ELC (he signed a bridge I believe) (he’s the Tavares cap implication in this scenario), would that 2011 team made a run? I doubt they could afford to bring in the depth pieces they did. I get Dubas future brained it and signed them to these contracts thinking it would be more valuable as the cap moves up. I don’t blame the GM for trying something new if that was his plan. But it’s business he’s supposed to be negotiating contracts that would help the team in the long run. Now we have a window of 3-4 years before these guys hit free agency cause they weren’t signed long term which only favors the player in negotiations there is no way that helps the team signing them to that, we as fans buy tickets and merchandise to make this team one of the most profitable teams in the league and now we’re going to have to wait again. The team spent to the cap, these are all Dubas’ contracts, there’s no more Lou messed up the team, so far he has no track record of succeeding past what Lou did because he took the team to the 1st round as well and went 7 against Boston, Washington while Dubas couldn’t get us past the play in round last year and Montreal this year? The teams regressing, the North Division was just a smoke screen, the teams in it weren’t that good (or ravaged by covid), and next year we’re going to playing in a division with Boston, Tampa and Florida
Jun. 3, 2021 at 8:56 a.m.
#6
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Quoting: GarthBrooks
Yes but Lecavalier got paid 7.7 which equates to whatever percentage Iunno the maths too good. And even that was bad because I think it’s safe to say St. Louis career ended better than Lecavalier. But say St. Louis got paid closer to Lecavalier like within a million, and then they signed Stamkos to close to that amount after his ELC (he signed a bridge I believe) (he’s the Tavares cap implication in this scenario), would that 2011 team made a run? I doubt they could afford to bring in the depth pieces they did. I get Dubas future brained it and signed them to these contracts thinking it would be more valuable as the cap moves up. I don’t blame the GM for trying something new if that was his plan. But it’s business he’s supposed to be negotiating contracts that would help the team in the long run. Now we have a window of 3-4 years before these guys hit free agency cause they weren’t signed long term which only favors the player in negotiations there is no way that helps the team signing them to that, we as fans buy tickets and merchandise to make this team one of the most profitable teams in the league and now we’re going to have to wait again. The team spent to the cap, these are all Dubas’ contracts, there’s no more Lou messed up the team, so far he has no track record of succeeding past what Lou did because he took the team to the 1st round as well and went 7 against Boston, Washington while Dubas couldn’t get us past the play in round last year and Montreal this year? The teams regressing, the North Division was just a smoke screen, the teams in it weren’t that good (or ravaged by covid), and next year we’re going to playing in a division with Boston, Tampa and Florida


Lecavaliers $7.7M deal was 13.63% of the cap at the time which would be $11,108,450 per year today. And that was for 11 years as well at the age of 28... They are extremly comparable to Matthews and Marner in fact except they were about 6-7 years older. The main difference between them and the leafs today is that St. Louis and Lecavalier signed their contracts 4 years apart with large increases to the cap over that time. By the time Lecavalier signed his deal St. Louis was already 35 and on a deal that paid him only 9.33% of the cap instead of the 13.46% it was when he signed.. Stamkos was also still on his elc when they went on that run in 2011 so it is rediculous to compare that 2011 team and specifically his $900k cap hit to Tavares $11M and the current Leafs team.

If your point regarding Stamkos is to look to after he signed his 2nd deal worth 11.6% of the cap ($9,454,000 today) then you would be looking at aa scenario similarish to the Leafs today. That signing was right after their 2011 run and if you remember, the Lightning MISSED THE PLAYOFFS the next year and actually finished 3rd last 2 seasons later resulting in the 3rd overall pick...

The good point that you are making is actually that the biggest problem that Dubas has is that he is in the unfortunate position of signing 3 large value contracts right before an unprecedented pandemic which stopped any cap increases for a couple years. He also had to sign all 4 of his large value contracts within 2 years of each other.. Out of the 4 big value signings he made 2 of them are underpayments and 2 of them are slight overpayments but on shorter deals as to not kneecap the team long term.. Obviously if Matthews or Marner dont re-sign with the Leafs then the contracts are a failure, but neither you or I can predict the future..
 
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