Forums/Armchair-GM

Kaprizov and Upgrades

Created by: Leafs_and_Sens_Fan
Initial Creation Date: Aug 9, 2021
Published: Aug 10 at 12:44
Team: 2021-22 Carolina Hurricanes
Free Agent Signings
RFAYEARSCAP HIT
Svechnikov, Andrei3$6,500,000
Kaprizov, Kirill2$7,500,000
Trades
CAR
  1. Kaprizov, Kirill [RFA Rights]
MIN
  1. Bokk, Dominik
  2. 2022 1st round pick (CAR)
  3. 2023 1st round pick (CAR)
CAR
  1. Miller, Colin ($1,937,500 retained)
BUF
  1. Gardiner, Jake
  2. 2022 2nd round pick (CAR)
  3. 2023 2nd round pick (CAR)
DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
2022
CAR
CHI
CAR
CAR
CAR
ANA
CAR
CBJ
2023
CAR
CAR
CAR
CAR
CAR
2024
CAR
CAR
CAR
CAR
CAR
CAR
CAR
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES BONUSESCAP SPACE
21$81,500,000$79,405,250$0$1,037,500$2,094,750
Left WingCenterRight Wing
CAR
Svechnikov, Andrei
$6,500,000
LW, RW
UFA - 8
CAR
Aho, Sebastian
$8,460,250
C, LW
UFA - 3
CAR
Teräväinen, Teuvo
$5,400,000
RW, LW
UFA - 3
Kaprizov, Kirill
$7,500,000
LW, RW
UFA - 5
CAR
Trocheck, Vincent
$4,750,000
C, RW
UFA - 1
CAR
Necas, Martin
$863,333
RW, C
RFA - 1
CAR
Niederreiter, Nino
$5,250,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
CAR
Staal, Jordan
$6,000,000
C, LW
NMC
UFA - 2
CAR
Jarvis, Seth
$894,167
RW
RFA - 3
CAR
Martinook, Jordan
$1,800,000
C, LW, RW
UFA - 3
CAR
Stepan, Derek
$1,350,000
C
UFA - 1
CAR
Fast, Jesper
$2,000,000
RW
UFA - 2
CAR
Lorentz, Steven
$725,000
C, LW
RFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
CAR
Slavin, Jaccob
$5,300,000
LD
NTC
UFA - 4
CAR
Pesce, Brett
$4,025,000
RD
UFA - 3
CAR
Andersen, Frederik
$4,500,000
G
NTC
UFA - 2
CAR
Skjei, Brady
$5,250,000
LD
NTC
UFA - 3
CAR
Bear, Ethan
$2,000,000
RD
RFA - 1
CAR
Raanta, Antti
$2,000,000
G
UFA - 2
CAR
Cole, Ian
$2,900,000
LD/RD
UFA - 1
BUF
Miller, Colin
$1,937,500
RD
UFA - 1

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Aug 10 at 12:54
#1
Leafs suck
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,244
Likes: 621
What is that kaprizov trade
Aug 10 at 12:59
#2
Miss the Thrashers
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 9,876
Likes: 2,199
1) Gardiner needs back surgery and will be out for the year. He's a non-entity. Miller isn't worth 2 2nds

2) You have badly underdone the Kaprizov trade, and this likely ends up costing Trocheck and Necas with no cap space options
Aug 10 at 1:01
#3
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 7,951
Likes: 2,078
Quoting: mauston_atthews
What is that kaprizov trade


What do you mean by that? You think it's an overpay?
Aug 10 at 1:02
#4
Do I look nervous
Joined: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,230
Likes: 1,799
I hope people understand that Kaprizov is not a guy you want on your team. He’s gonna dip in free agency the first chance he gets. There are so many players better than him that will be cheaper. What kind of 25 year old rookie turns down a 9 million dollar contract just because he wants to hit free agency and make even more. He’s in it for the money and the money only. Don’t waste your futures on a guy who ain’t gonna return unless you pay him like McDavid
Aug 10 at 1:03
#5
Joined: Sep 2020
Posts: 10,370
Likes: 5,327
Quoting: Leafs_and_Sens_Fan
What do you mean by that? You think it's an overpay?


MASSIVE underpay
mauston_atthews liked this.
Aug 10 at 1:08
#6
Leafs suck
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,244
Likes: 621
Quoting: Leafs_and_Sens_Fan
What do you mean by that? You think it's an overpay?


Massive underpay
Aug 10 at 1:13
#7
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,849
Likes: 1,994
Quoting: Leafs_and_Sens_Fan
What do you mean by that? You think it's an overpay?


I actually think it’s pretty close without retention. I think the Wild would like to swap Suzuki for one of those 1sts but I like the value for both sides.
Aug 10 at 1:15
#8
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 368
Likes: 64
Quoting: Caniac2000
1) Gardiner needs back surgery and will be out for the year. He's a non-entity. Miller isn't worth 2 2nds

2) You have badly underdone the Kaprizov trade, and this likely ends up costing Trocheck and Necas with no cap space options


What is Colin Miller worth?
Aug 10 at 1:24
#9
Miss the Thrashers
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 9,876
Likes: 2,199
Quoting: IceDragon
What is Colin Miller worth?


After the year he had in Buffalo, maybe a 3rd straight up... that would be with a bidding war. You could probably get him for a 4th or 5th
Aug 10 at 1:25
#10
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 2,819
Likes: 1,225
Quoting: Juiceman
I hope people understand that Kaprizov is not a guy you want on your team. He’s gonna dip in free agency the first chance he gets. There are so many players better than him that will be cheaper. What kind of 25 year old rookie turns down a 9 million dollar contract just because he wants to hit free agency and make even more. He’s in it for the money and the money only. Don’t waste your futures on a guy who ain’t gonna return unless you pay him like McDavid


Maybe that’s true. He may just not want to live in minny long term too tho, who knows. Either way, a deal like this makes sense for a few teams, Carolina potentially being one. They need an upgrade in their top 6 and he’s definitely that. They’re entering their cup window prime so why not take a chance on Kaprizov for 2-3 years and who cares if he leaves if it gives you a couple shots at raising a cup.

I don’t disagree that there are other options and they might be cheaper. He also probably wouldn’t sign a deal this low in Carolina either so doubt it realistic but if he did I would do this as a Canes fan 10/10.
Aug 10 at 1:29
#11
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 368
Likes: 64
Quoting: Caniac2000
After the year he had in Buffalo, maybe a 3rd straight up... that would be with a bidding war. You could probably get him for a 4th or 5th


I wonder if Miller's role with the Sabres may improve with liability Ristolainen gone. The Sabres could use help long term in right defensemen.
Aug 10 at 1:29
#12
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 2,819
Likes: 1,225
Quoting: Caniac2000
1) Gardiner needs back surgery and will be out for the year. He's a non-entity. Miller isn't worth 2 2nds

2) You have badly underdone the Kaprizov trade, and this likely ends up costing Trocheck and Necas with no cap space options


If we did 2x9 I think they could make it work - 5.2 coming off for Nino, most of which goes to Necas on a bridge deal. Troch probably gets an offer up to 5.5AAV from canes FO. Idk if that’ll keep him here or not but if it does that’s less than 1M you need to find to keep him which you can easily do with somebody like Cole or Miller (in this situation, I agree he doesn’t make sense for us) coming off and being replaced by Sellgren.
Aug 10 at 1:33
#13
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 2,819
Likes: 1,225
Not sure about the trade value for Kaprizov - tough to pin down if he really can’t come to terms with Minny I suppose it’s better for them to get something for him rather than nothing. If that package is what it takes and we had an agreement in place with him then I’d take it.

I do think you’re 1.5-2M short on a short term deal tho. I think 2x9-9.5 would be more realistic which you should still be able to fit in here.

Miller doesn’t make sense for the Canes tho. They already have 8 1-way D contracts for next year. Gardiner can be moved to LTIR with a potential back surgery coming up or you can dump him somewhere for the sake of argument. You can put TDA in on the right side instead of Miller and 7D is B. Smith.

I don’t think this is realistic largely bc Kaprizov probably wants to play in NYC or Florida so idk why he’d choose to come to Carolina but if this was an option I’d gladly take it.
Aug 10 at 4:27
#14
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 7,951
Likes: 2,078
Quoting: Gmonwy
MASSIVE underpay


Quoting: mauston_atthews
Massive underpay


I respectfully disagree. Kaprizov is basically a 4 year rental before he jumps ship for the highest bidder. He's not gonna be on a team friendly contract and is gonna milk the team for every dollar like Nylander and Marner. He'll also set a precident for the other young players on the team much like Tavares' contracts did for Toronto's 3 young stars.

The reason why I think it's worth it for Carolina is that they are trying to compete now and he fills a big need that I think can push them over the top.

Quoting: jnowariak
I actually think it’s pretty close without retention. I think the Wild would like to swap Suzuki for one of those 1sts but I like the value for both sides.


That seems fair if you let Carolina have the pick between whether they keep the 2022 pick or 2022 pick.

Quoting: IceDragon
What is Colin Miller worth?


Not sure the market for defencemen is kind of crazy right now. In this post I valued him with retention as being worth a 2nd round pick. The other 2nd is to move Gardiner's contract.

If Buffalo is willing to take less in a trade to take on Gardiner and retain half on Miller I'm all for it but I think what I posted is pretty fair for both sides.

Quoting: vikhodush
Maybe that’s true. He may just not want to live in minny long term too tho, who knows. Either way, a deal like this makes sense for a few teams, Carolina potentially being one. They need an upgrade in their top 6 and he’s definitely that. They’re entering their cup window prime so why not take a chance on Kaprizov for 2-3 years and who cares if he leaves if it gives you a couple shots at raising a cup.

I don’t disagree that there are other options and they might be cheaper. He also probably wouldn’t sign a deal this low in Carolina either so doubt it realistic but if he did I would do this as a Canes fan 10/10.


It's a high risk, high reward trade.
Aug 10 at 4:30
#15
Banned
Joined: Jul 2021
Posts: 509
Likes: 76
Quoting: Leafs_and_Sens_Fan
I respectfully disagree. Kaprizov is basically a 4 year rental before he jumps ship for the highest bidder. He's not gonna be on a team friendly contract and is gonna milk the team for every dollar like Nylander and Marner. He'll also set a precident for the other young players on the team much like Tavares' contracts did for Toronto's 3 young stars.

The reason why I think it's worth it for Carolina is that they are trying to compete now and he fills a big need that I think can push them over the top.



That seems fair if you let Carolina have the pick between whether they keep the 2022 pick or 2022 pick.



Not sure the market for defencemen is kind of crazy right now. In this post I valued him with retention as being worth a 2nd round pick. The other 2nd is to move Gardiner's contract.

If Buffalo is willing to take less in a trade to take on Gardiner and retain half on Miller I'm all for it but I think what I posted is pretty fair for both sides.



It's a high risk, high reward trade.


The kaprizov deal is bunch of trash. Dominik isn't good, and he's not making NHL. Late 1st round picks doesn't mean Jack squat. Kaprizov can be kept for 3 years
mauston_atthews liked this.
Aug 10 at 4:37
#16
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 2,819
Likes: 1,225
Quoting: Amakoue
The kaprizov deal is bunch of trash. Dominik isn't good, and he's not making NHL. Late 1st round picks doesn't mean Jack squat. Kaprizov can be kept for 3 years


2 firsts and a B+ prospect who's projecting out well and continuing to develop well isn't trash. I agree that that's not enough value but disagree that any of those pieces are "trash".
jnowariak and Devil1122 liked this.
Aug 10 at 4:38
#17
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 7,951
Likes: 2,078
Quoting: Amakoue
The kaprizov deal is bunch of trash. Dominik isn't good, and he's not making NHL. Late 1st round picks doesn't mean Jack squat. Kaprizov can be kept for 3 years


I'd be willing to give up Suzuki instead of one of the "late" 1sts.

The problem is that Kaprizov is gonna milk the team for every dollar he can get and isn't gonna be on a discount contract. Rumors are a KHL team offered him an 8 figure contract (which would be tax free).

At this point the Wild might lose him for nothing as he plays the next 3 years in the KHL.

I'm not sure what you're expecting to get back in a trade for Kaprizov.
vikhodush liked this.
Aug 10 at 4:50
#18
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,849
Likes: 1,994
Quoting: Leafs_and_Sens_Fan
I'd be willing to give up Suzuki instead of one of the "late" 1sts.

The problem is that Kaprizov is gonna milk the team for every dollar he can get and isn't gonna be on a discount contract. Rumors are a KHL team offered him an 8 figure contract (which would be tax free).

At this point the Wild might lose him for nothing as he plays the next 3 years in the KHL.

I'm not sure what you're expecting to get back in a trade for Kaprizov.


I’d take the rumors with a grain of salt. If Kap doesn’t play in the NHL the until he gets to UFA, he probably loses out on 10-20 mil on his UFA deal. Yeah, he might have a 10 mil one year deal for him in the K but the extra 2 mil he would get would cost him in the long term.

It’s more about getting him signed and then figuring it out.
Aug 10 at 5:00
#19
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 7,951
Likes: 2,078
Quoting: jnowariak
I’d take the rumors with a grain of salt. If Kap doesn’t play in the NHL the until he gets to UFA, he probably loses out on 10-20 mil on his UFA deal. Yeah, he might have a 10 mil one year deal for him in the K but the extra 2 mil he would get would cost him in the long term.

It’s more about getting him signed and then figuring it out.


Don't forget Russian players don't pay taxes on the money they make in the KHL whereas taxes here are probably 40-50% so he actually makes an extra 5 million signing in the KHL. I'm pretty sure that teams would still be willing to pay him the same amount if he spends a year lighting it up in the KHL.

Kaprizov is basically asking for UFA money in contract negotiations with the Wild and he has the leverage to do so with the big KHL contract.
Aug 10 at 5:03
#20
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,849
Likes: 1,994
Quoting: Leafs_and_Sens_Fan
Don't forget Russian players don't pay taxes on the money they make in the KHL whereas taxes here are probably 40-50% so he actually makes an extra 5 million signing in the KHL. I'm pretty sure that teams would still be willing to pay him the same amount if he spends a year lighting it up in the KHL.

Kaprizov is basically asking for UFA money in contract negotiations with the Wild and he has the leverage to do so with the big KHL contract.


I’ll disagree with you here, and that’s fine. He’s already proven he’s too good for the K. Teams will offer him 10 mil AAV in UFA if he stays in Russia whereas I think he could get 12 if he continues in the NHL. On a 7 year deal, that’s 14 mil. Not nothing.
Aug 10 at 5:16
#21
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 7,951
Likes: 2,078
Quoting: jnowariak
I’ll disagree with you here, and that’s fine. He’s already proven he’s too good for the K. Teams will offer him 10 mil AAV in UFA if he stays in Russia whereas I think he could get 12 if he continues in the NHL. On a 7 year deal, that’s 14 mil. Not nothing.


If he only cared about maxing his income he'd just stay in the KHL.

I think he wants to play in the NHL but wants to maximize his earnings. If he takes a 4 year deal he'd be 28 and ready to get a huge 7 or 8 year deal.

The 7 or 8 year deal that Minnesota wants would take him to age 31 or 32. I don't see many 31 or 32 year olds getting massive 7 or 8 year extensions.

Now he's just pointing out to the Wild that he's not desperate to stay in NA if they aren't gonna pay him what he thinks he's worth taking away most of their RFA leverage.
Aug 10 at 9:32
#22
Banned
Joined: Jul 2021
Posts: 509
Likes: 76
Quoting: Leafs_and_Sens_Fan
I'd be willing to give up Suzuki instead of one of the "late" 1sts.

The problem is that Kaprizov is gonna milk the team for every dollar he can get and isn't gonna be on a discount contract. Rumors are a KHL team offered him an 8 figure contract (which would be tax free).

At this point the Wild might lose him for nothing as he plays the next 3 years in the KHL.

I'm not sure what you're expecting to get back in a trade for Kaprizov.


It's bs agenda by his agent which is why he why he let out rumors of 1 year.
Aug 10 at 9:40
#23
Banned
Joined: Jul 2021
Posts: 509
Likes: 76
Quoting: Leafs_and_Sens_Fan
Don't forget Russian players don't pay taxes on the money they make in the KHL whereas taxes here are probably 40-50% so he actually makes an extra 5 million signing in the KHL. I'm pretty sure that teams would still be willing to pay him the same amount if he spends a year lighting it up in the KHL.

Kaprizov is basically asking for UFA money in contract negotiations with the Wild and he has the leverage to do so with the big KHL contract.


Quoting: Leafs_and_Sens_Fan
If he only cared about maxing his income he'd just stay in the KHL.

I think he wants to play in the NHL but wants to maximize his earnings. If he takes a 4 year deal he'd be 28 and ready to get a huge 7 or 8 year deal.

The 7 or 8 year deal that Minnesota wants would take him to age 31 or 32. I don't see many 31 or 32 year olds getting massive 7 or 8 year extensions.

Now he's just pointing out to the Wild that he's not desperate to stay in NA if they aren't gonna pay him what he thinks he's worth taking away most of their RFA leverage.


His team is broke, and can't give him that contract. Also that league has a cap of like 7 mil. So no, wild still has all the leverage. People close to kaprizov said to wild beat writer whose traveling to Russia that kaprizov is preparing to play for wild
Aug 10 at 9:41
#24
Banned
Joined: Jul 2021
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Quoting: Leafs_and_Sens_Fan
If he only cared about maxing his income he'd just stay in the KHL.

I think he wants to play in the NHL but wants to maximize his earnings. If he takes a 4 year deal he'd be 28 and ready to get a huge 7 or 8 year deal.

The 7 or 8 year deal that Minnesota wants would take him to age 31 or 32. I don't see many 31 or 32 year olds getting massive 7 or 8 year extensions.

Now he's just pointing out to the Wild that he's not desperate to stay in NA if they aren't gonna pay him what he thinks he's worth taking away most of their RFA leverage.


Wild already offered him 9.5mil so what you are saying is wrong. It's not about money
Aug 10 at 9:50
#25
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 7,951
Likes: 2,078
Quoting: Amakoue
Wild already offered him 9.5mil so what you are saying is wrong. It's not about money


Did you read what I wrote. I already said it's not about money.

Still what was the 9.5M for? 8 years? Taking a long term deal hurts his earning potential.
 
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