Lol I guess you can dream

New York accepts

seriously bro? Dubas wouldn't even consider chiarot robertson straight up.

I thought it was pretty fair, fills a need for both teams.

I think there is 20 other moves the Flames make before they target Dvorak

Toronto has nearly lots of cap space to work with at the TDL now if they are spending a 1st on a LHD it should be someone like Giordano who is strictly better than Chiarot at everything but punching people

Really?! That surprises me since it also saves almost 2 mil cap space to add another player.

And that is what Toronto needs for a playoff run is a D that is capable of punishing players coming across their blueline.

Oilers and leafs reject those horrible offers.

They got Lyubushkin for that. Now they need someone who isn't a complete pylon with the puck, which Chiarot is

I get the Leafs offer is a huge overpay, but it's the Leafs and Habs no way is one going to just help the other without taking advantage of the situation. The Oilers on the other hand was Halloway and a 2nd or 3rd for Allen and Savard (retained for 2
more years). Two players that play positions where Edmonton needs a serious upgrade. To top it all off that isn't even much more than the price Tampa paid to get Savard just last season. I didn't ask for a 1st or Bourgault or Broberg or Bouchard or add anything extra on to the deal to make it the same value for Savard as last year and a 2nd for Allen.

Did you not watch the Leafs-Habs game 3 days ago? Montreal completely went untouched through the neutral zone and both Lyubushkin and Muzzin were in the game. The Habs just blew right by Lyubushkin like he was standing still. Where as every time the Leafs got near the Habs blueline the Habs were stepping up and making it harder to gain the zone. Chiarot himself wasn't much of a pylon as you say, not many Leafs players blew by him most ended up on the ice or with their faces plastered to the boards when they tried.

No I didn't watch the game but 1 game doesn't mean everything. Chiarot is a pylon overall. He's horrible at skating and really not that good defensively either.

Also Lyubushkin was not in that game, I question whether you even watched it now

If the Leafs end up going for a rental, my top two choices are Mark Giordano and Calvin de Haan pic.twitter.com/jApHC70iWP

— Michael (@TheLeafsIMO) February 18, 2022

These 2 would be what I would look at for different reasons

If a deal could be made for Hagel I would make it where we also take De-Haan

But realistically I want Toronto to go get Giordano. The guy is from Toronto, has been a solid 2-way Dman for what seems like forever and can fill in for Muzzin easily. Its up to him in that case but its worth a shot

Even then I'm not quite sure if it ends there. With Muzzin out until at least the playoffs I still think they should go after a top 4 RHD and move out Holl in the process. Add Gio + Severson both at 50% and the team is pretty solid. If Muzzin comes back you are looking at a d-core of: Rielly - Brodie, Muzzin - Severson, Gio - Lyubushkin, Sandin. That's pretty freaking good

I think if they bring in Gio and pair him with Brodie move Rielly to play with opposite dimension Lybushkin on the second pair and once Muzzin comes back go with Muzzin-Sandin on the third pair I think it could work nicely.

Holl can sit in the press box with Dermott probs getting moved for picks. But maybe Seattle takes Holl as part of the Gio deal (Hakstol knows him via Toronto days and Holl did well under him).

For me if we can leave the TDL with Hagel and Gio I'm good for now

As come game 1 of playoffs

Gio-Brodie
Rielly-Lybushkin (They honestly compliment eachother with Rielly focusing on offense and Lybushkin defense)
Muzzin-Sandin could be very interesting

And would be similar to Tampa as they focused on a strong LD and other than Cernak really didnt have a true top 4 RD (Schenn, Bogosian, Rutta)

I can tell you relatively confidently that Lyubushkin is not the guy you want in the top 4. He's a great depth guy but he is not a top 4 guy by any means. As for Gio, he had chemistry with Brodie in the past but Brodie pairs well with Rielly already

You are right my bad I watched the Columbus game as well 2 nights ago and Lyubushkin did very little to stop them from entering the zone. I live just east of Toronto and watch most Leafs games since the Habs are not local. I mixed up the games that's all.

BTW, that Oilers deal is pretty freaking accurate. Allen is worth a 2nd + 3rd. Savard probably a 2nd without retention. Add another 2nd for the retention and the value of the package sent is three 2nds and a 3rd. Montreal gives up 2 2nds and a 3rd to bump it to a 1st + 2nd or in this case Halloway + 2nd. That is almost spot on value.

Edmonton wouldn't trade Holloway for Allen and Savard, never mind the second.

I get he is a great prospect and one the Oilers likely want to keep. I just was going for something a little different and with slightly lower value than Bourgault or the 2023 1st. The Oilers are at risk of falling from a playoff spot after their goaltending has let them down recently. They need to do something and do something quickly. Desperate teams do desperate things around the deadline.

Lyubushkin was played in a top 4 role, he is not a top 4 defenseman. Neither is Chiarot though

Yeah I know he was played in a top 4 role, Chiarot is a top 4 D man though. He plays 20+ minutes a night and if paired properly with a mobile D man like Petry, Kulak or Romanov he does just fine. He may not be the most mobile D man in the league but he can still skate as well as 1/2 to 2/3 of the league. He is never going to win a foot race with the likes of McDavid, Marner, Matthews, Barkov or those top stars but he will keep up with the likes of the Tkachuk's, Pasternak, Kadri types of players an 3rd and 4th liners with the exception of the Byron's of the league. Since Chiarot is a 2nd pairing D man he really doesn't have to worry too much about facing the superstars since only about a 3rd of his shifts will be against the top line players anyway, unless the other team I on the PP and then the Habs will mostly be in their own end and speed isn't as much of a factor as positioning and shot blocking. 2 things Chiarot is excellent at.

Let me put it this way, Chiarot, like Zadorov, like Mayfield, like Savard, like Regehr, is a defenseman that can work really well in a trap based system. He can play in the top 4 but is ideally a 3rd pair shutdown guy on any team trying to contend. Toronto is not a team that runs the Trap, they run a style very similar to how the Penguins won their Stanley cups. They overwhelm the opponent with puck possession. However Every team needs a little bit of everything, hence bringing in a guy like Lyubushkin for the 3rd pair. Ben Chiarot does not fit their system though, he is not good a puck control and he is poor at skating. He would in reality never be in the lineup over someone like Sandin.

On the other hand someone like Giordano would, he is excellent at carrying the puck, excellent at defending and killing the PK, can skate well, and is solid offensively. From a need standpoint Toronto targets Gio over Chiarot 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, and twice on Sundays. It's not even up for debate, Gio is just the far better choice all around

Gio is the better D man and the better fit for Toronto but also with cost a 1st +. I just don't see Toronto wanting to spend a 1st or 1st + on one year of a 38 year old. I could be completely wrong and Dubas could be willing to take that risk over a Chiarot type of player and that is fine. One thing is for sure though IF Toronto wants to go anywhere in the playoffs they need to figure out their D.