Forums/Armchair-GM

Whos Better Please Read The Description First

Created by: Bbpagewolf
Initial Creation Date: Feb. 24, 2022
Published: Feb. 24, 2022
Team: 2021-22 New York Rangers
Team Explanation
Let’s get something out of the way immediately, I know these two will not be traded let alone for each other and let alone one for one. This is merely to start a discussion and a hypothetical. Let’s say in some bizarre universe Adam Fox and Cale Makar are indeed traded for one another. Who do you think is the better player? Are they both equal? Would the trade be one for one if it ever happened? Who would have to add more pieces to make this trade happen? I wanna know what everyone’s thoughts and opinions are and what you think would be the outcome. Please keep it civil in the comments and understand that this is merely a hypothetical what if situation.
Trades
1.
NYR
  1. Makar, Cale
COL
  1. Fox, Adam
Buyouts
  • Henrik Lundqvist: $1,500,000
  • Kevin Shattenkirk: $1,433,333
  • Dan Girardi: $1,111,111
  • Anthony Deangelo: $383,334
  • Brad Richards: $0
DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
2022
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2023
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2024
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ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
23$81,500,000$79,240,594$0$7,100,000$2,259,406
Left WingCenterRight Wing
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Kreider, Chris
$6,500,000
LW
NMC
UFA - 6
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Zibanejad, Mika
$5,350,000
C
NMC
UFA - 1
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Lafrenière, Alexis
$925,000
LW, RW
RFA - 2
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Panarin, Artemi
$11,642,857
LW
NMC
UFA - 5
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Strome, Ryan
$4,500,000
C, RW
UFA - 1
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Kakko, Kaapo
$925,000
RW
RFA - 1
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Goodrow, Barclay
$3,641,667
LW, C, RW
NTC
UFA - 6
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Chytil, Filip
$2,300,000
C, LW
RFA - 2
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Gauthier, Julien
$775,000
RW
RFA - 1
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Hunt, Dryden
$762,500
LW, RW
UFA - 2
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Rooney, Kevin
$750,000
LW, C, RW
UFA - 1
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Reaves, Ryan
$1,750,000
RW
UFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
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Lindgren, Ryan
$3,000,000
LD
RFA - 3
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Makar, Cale
$9,000,000
RD
UFA - 6
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Shesterkin, Igor
$5,666,667
G
UFA - 4
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Miller, K'Andre
$925,000
LD
RFA - 2
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Trouba, Jacob
$8,000,000
RD
NMC
UFA - 5
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Georgiev, Alexandar
$2,425,000
G
UFA - 1
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Nemeth, Patrik
$2,500,000
LD
NTC
UFA - 3
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Schneider, Braden
$925,000
RD
RFA - 3
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
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Barron, Morgan
$925,000
C
RFA - 2
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Blais, Samuel
$1,500,000
RW
UFA - 1
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Hájek, Libor
$874,125
LD
RFA - 1
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McKegg, Greg
$750,000
C, LW
UFA - 1

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Feb. 24 at 12:09 p.m.
#1
Pens are the best
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Makar all day everyday
Feb. 24 at 12:10 p.m.
#2
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Neither of them are good defensively, so you take the player with the better offense. That is Makar.
Feb. 24 at 12:12 p.m.
#3
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I’d take makar but both are soo good it’s a win win no matter what.
Feb. 24 at 12:26 p.m.
#4
Daddy
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Quoting: Caniac2000
Neither of them are good defensively, so you take the player with the better offense. That is Makar.


?? They're both very good defensively. What makes you say they're not?
Fox_Czar_Cup liked this.
Feb. 24 at 12:27 p.m.
#5
resident habs expert
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the consensus will be makar with fox in a close second.
Feb. 24 at 12:29 p.m.
#6
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Quoting: AustonMatthews3443
?? They're both very good defensively. What makes you say they're not?


Both have a negative xGA, and both have pulled defensive partners xGA down. They're very good going one way, and both horrible the other. Makar at times positions himself like a forward, and it's...okay if he's got the right partner with him (Devon Toews) but it gets exposed sometimes. Same with Fox and Lindgren.
Feb. 24 at 12:30 p.m.
#7
Daddy
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Quoting: Caniac2000
Both have a negative xGA, and both have pulled defensive partners xGA down. They're very good going one way, and both horrible the other. Makar at times positions himself like a forward, and it's...okay if he's got the right partner with him (Devon Toews) but it gets exposed sometimes. Same with Fox and Lindgren.


Are you referring to xGA/60?
Feb. 24 at 12:32 p.m.
#8
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Quoting: AustonMatthews3443
Are you referring to xGA/60?


GAx%
Feb. 24 at 12:42 p.m.
#9
Daddy
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Quoting: Caniac2000
GAx%


I'm not huge on analytics for dmen. I just use xGA/60 and the eye test. How exactly does xGA% differ from xGA/60? As both of their xGA/60 are good and even though Makar is up on the rush a lot, he passes the eye test.
Fox_Czar_Cup liked this.
Feb. 24 at 1:14 p.m.
#10
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Quoting: Caniac2000
Both have a negative xGA, and both have pulled defensive partners xGA down. They're very good going one way, and both horrible the other. Makar at times positions himself like a forward, and it's...okay if he's got the right partner with him (Devon Toews) but it gets exposed sometimes. Same with Fox and Lindgren.


Quoting: Caniac2000
GAx%


Maybe its just the way this was worded, but im kind of confused. Youre saying a lower expected goals against is bad? Pretty sure limiting goals against is a good thing. Also can you explain what xGA% is? I dont see that anywhere on evolving hockey unless you mean xGF% or xGA/60 like @AustonMatthews3443 said

I cant really find any metric which suggests that either Makar or Fox is bad defensively:

By EV Defensive WAR Makar is in the 66.7th percentile and Fox is in the 70.1st percentile this season among players with 100+ mins of EV TOI (data from Patrick Bacon, which is where JFresh gets his WAR data)

By Evolving Hockey Makar has -0.05 xGA/60 relative to teammates and Fox has -0.13 xGA/60 relative to teammates (negative here is a good thing)

By Dom's player cards Makar's 5v5 On Ice Defensive Impact is in the 90-100th percentile and Fox's 5v5 On Ice Defensive Impact is in the 70-90th percentile (tbh not really sure what stat this is, it isnt labelled on the cards)
Xqb15a liked this.
Feb. 24 at 1:33 p.m.
#11
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So I like Fox, grudgingly respect him, but the things Makar does, and he does it in a way that he makes his teammates better. Other teams have to game plan for how they are going to handle him, I don’t know that they do it to the extent they do for Fox. That’s why I’m team Makar hands doen
Feb. 24 at 5:59 p.m.
#12
Daddy
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Quoting: UpsideDownQue
Maybe its just the way this was worded, but im kind of confused. Youre saying a lower expected goals against is bad? Pretty sure limiting goals against is a good thing. Also can you explain what xGA% is? I dont see that anywhere on evolving hockey unless you mean xGF% or xGA/60 like AustonMatthews3443 said

I cant really find any metric which suggests that either Makar or Fox is bad defensively:

By EV Defensive WAR Makar is in the 66.7th percentile and Fox is in the 70.1st percentile this season among players with 100+ mins of EV TOI (data from Patrick Bacon, which is where JFresh gets his WAR data)

By Evolving Hockey Makar has -0.05 xGA/60 relative to teammates and Fox has -0.13 xGA/60 relative to teammates (negative here is a good thing)

By Dom's player cards Makar's 5v5 On Ice Defensive Impact is in the 90-100th percentile and Fox's 5v5 On Ice Defensive Impact is in the 70-90th percentile (tbh not really sure what stat this is, it isnt labelled on the cards)


I was also so confused lol, never heard of xGA%.
 
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