Forums/Armchair-GM

Nylander and Chychrun

Created by: OldNYIfan
Initial Creation Date: May 26, 2022
Published: May 26, 2022
Team: 2022-23 Los Angeles Kings
Team Explanation
In this effort to step outside the box, I'm trading away our formerly projected goalie of the future. I'm not convinced that this is a winning strategy for us, but Toronto should like the three-year term on Petersen's contract.

I don't mind losing Turcotte because with Byfield and Kupari already on the main roster and Pinelli and Helenius coming up, plus two excellent wing prospects already in the system, we should have adequate pipeline depth at forward. I also don't mind trading away two of our five RDs because I think that we are adequately prepared at that position, despite our experience this season.

The 13th and 14th forward RFA signings could also be promotions from Ontario. (We'll have to wait for training camp to see which of Anderson-Dolan and Andersson makes the team, hence the 24-man roster.) Re-signing Andreas Athanasiou is also a possibility with this cap space.

Note that with both Bjornfot and Spence waivers-exempt, it's possible to re-sign Alex Edler for defensive depth on the left side with this amount of cap space ($3,871,800).

This is something of a pipe dream, of course, and what we would do for a starting goaltender in 2023-2024 is a real question!
Free Agent Signings
RESERVE LISTYEARSCAP HIT
Johnson, Ryan2$925,000
RFAYEARSCAP HIT
Kempe, Adrian5$5,200,000
Anderson, Michael3$3,000,000
Durzi, Sean3$2,500,000
Lemieux, Brendan2$1,750,000
Grundström, Carl2$1,250,000
Vilardi, Gabriel2$1,000,000
Anderson-Dolan, Jaret2$900,000
Andersson, Lias2$900,000
Moverare, Jacob2$900,000
Allard, Frédéric2$800,000
Södergran, Johan2$800,000
Villalta, Matt2$800,000
UFAYEARSCAP HIT
Wedgewood, Scott3$1,250,000
Trades
1.
LAK
  1. Nylander, William
  2. 2022 1st round pick (TOR)
Additional Details:
If Edmonton defeats Calgary, pick will be 26th overall, otherwise 27th
TOR
  1. Petersen, Cal
  2. 2022 1st round pick (LAK)
  3. 2023 3rd round pick (LAK)
Additional Details:
19th overall

Toronto gets the earlier of LA's two 2023 third-rounders
2.
LAK
  1. Chychrun, Jakob
ARI
  1. Iafallo, Alex
  2. Walker, Sean
  3. Turcotte, Alex
  4. 2023 1st round pick (LAK)
3.
LAK
  1. Johnson, Ryan [Reserve List]
BUF
  1. Grans, Helge
4.
LAK
  1. 2024 7th round pick (CGY)
SEA
  1. Wagner, Austin
Additional Details:
More than a third of the slots on Seattle's 50-man roster are open
Buyouts
  • Dion Phaneuf: $1,062,500
Termination Fees
  • Mike Richards: $900,000
DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
2022
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Logo of the LAK
Logo of the PIT
Logo of the LAK
Logo of the LAK
Logo of the LAK
2023
Logo of the LAK
Logo of the PIT
Logo of the LAK
Logo of the LAK
Logo of the LAK
Logo of the LAK
2024
Logo of the LAK
Logo of the LAK
Logo of the LAK
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Logo of the LAK
Logo of the CGY
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
24$82,500,000$79,528,200$637,500$3,495,000$2,971,800
Left WingCenterRight Wing
Logo of the LAK
Kempe, Adrian
$5,200,000
LW, RW
UFA - 4
Logo of the LAK
Kopitar, Anze
$10,000,000
C
NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the TOR
Nylander, William
$6,962,366
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the LAK
Moore, Trevor
$1,875,000
RW, LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the LAK
Danault, Phillip
$5,500,000
C
NMC
UFA - 5
Logo of the LAK
Arvidsson, Viktor
$4,250,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the LAK
Kaliyev, Arthur
$894,167
RW, LW
RFA - 2
Logo of the LAK
Byfield, Quinton
$894,167
C
RFA - 2
Logo of the LAK
Kupari, Rasmus
$863,333
C, LW, RW
RFA - 1
Logo of the LAK
Grundström, Carl
$1,250,000
LW
RFA - 2
Logo of the LAK
Lizotte, Blake
$1,675,000
C
RFA - 2
Logo of the LAK
Vilardi, Gabriel
$1,000,000
C
RFA - 1
Logo of the LAK
Lemieux, Brendan
$1,750,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the LAK
Anderson-Dolan, Jaret
$900,000
C
RFA - 1
Logo of the LAK
Andersson, Lias
$900,000
C, LW
RFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the LAK
Anderson, Michael
$3,000,000
LD
RFA
Logo of the LAK
Doughty, Drew
$11,000,000
RD
NMC
UFA - 5
Logo of the LAK
Quick, Jonathan
$5,800,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the ARI
Chychrun, Jakob
$4,600,000
LD/RD
UFA - 3
Logo of the LAK
Roy, Matt
$3,150,000
RD
UFA - 2
Wedgewood, Scott
$1,250,000
G
UFA - 2
Logo of the LAK
Björnfot, Tobias
$894,167
LD
RFA - 1
Logo of the LAK
Durzi, Sean
$2,500,000
RD
RFA
Logo of the LAK
Spence, Jordan
$820,000
RD
RFA - 2

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May 26 at 2:58 p.m.
#1
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I'd just sign campbell for that money and move Nylander for actual fair value before doing this because Campbell > Peterson. This isn't close to fair
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May 26 at 3:01 p.m.
#2
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No other way to say it, the Kings/Leafs deal is just plain bad.
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May 26 at 3:03 p.m.
#3
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Not nearly enough for Nylander and tor has better options to put in net they can acquire via cheaper trade or FA
Arz is prob fine with Iafallo being the true roster player, will probably want to replace Walker with something more prospect like or younger roster player
Buf takes that
Seattle has no need to do that
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May 26 at 3:07 p.m.
#4
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A sub .900 goalie is a very easy pass for the Leafs. How you thought the Leafs needed to send a 1st the otherway too is just mind boggling.
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May 26 at 3:12 p.m.
#5
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As a sabres fan I'd be good with that swap
May 26 at 3:18 p.m.
#6
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Respectfully, that is not remotely in the ballpark for nylander
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May 26 at 3:24 p.m.
#7
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Nylander is going to cost as much as Chychrun if not more. Goalies don't have that much trade value, except for a handful of the elite.

Even without the Leafs adding a first they don't do that trade
May 26 at 3:33 p.m.
#8
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Dealing away your future starting goaltender is not a great idea, which is fine because Toronto would never take that. They will sooner resign Campbell just like everyone is telling you already. Quick can’t play forever, and it makes a hell of a lot more sense to try to trade him than it would Petersen anyway. That said Petersen’s value is not as high as you think. But if you’re going to trade him send him back to Buffalo, because it would be really funny.
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May 26 at 3:49 p.m.
#9
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Quoting: Byrr
A sub .900 goalie is a very easy pass for the Leafs. How you thought the Leafs needed to send a 1st the otherway too is just mind boggling.


Quoting: GMBL
Even without the Leafs adding a first they don't do that trade


The Leafs aren't adding a first. In fact, the Leafs are moving up from #26 to #19.
May 26 at 3:56 p.m.
#10
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Quoting: OldNYIfan
The Leafs aren't adding a first. In fact, the Leafs are moving up from #26 to #19.


and if you take that 1st out entirely, the Leafs still wouldn't do the trade. That's how far off you are. Petersen's performance this season was akin to Mrazek, he has longer term and is being paid a lot more. Why would anyone move a point per game winger for that and to move up 7 spots to an almost 20+ pick in the draft? It's one of the worst trades I've seen in a non-joke thread here.
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May 26 at 4:03 p.m.
#11
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Quoting: Byrr
and if you take that 1st out entirely, the Leafs still wouldn't do the trade. That's how far off you are. Petersen's performance this season was akin to Mrazek, he has longer term and is being paid a lot more. Why would anyone move a point per game winger for that and to move up 7 spots to an almost 20+ pick in the draft? It's one of the worst trades I've seen in a non-joke thread here.


Well, thanks for the heartfelt perspective.
May 26 at 4:06 p.m.
#12
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Quoting: OldNYIfan
The Leafs aren't adding a first. In fact, the Leafs are moving up from #26 to #19.


Quoting: Byrr
and if you take that 1st out entirely, the Leafs still wouldn't do the trade. That's how far off you are.


Quoting: OldNYIfan
Well, thanks for the heartfelt perspective.


What Byrr said is what I meant in regards to the Leafs adding a first.
May 26 at 4:08 p.m.
#13
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Quoting: Tjm220
Dealing away your future starting goaltender is not a great idea, which is fine because Toronto would never take that. They will sooner resign Campbell just like everyone is telling you already. Quick can’t play forever, and it makes a hell of a lot more sense to try to trade him than it would Petersen anyway. That said Petersen’s value is not as high as you think. But if you’re going to trade him send him back to Buffalo, because it would be really funny.


The assumption here is that Toronto can't re-sign Campbell and thus has to look elsewhere for a starting goalie next season. I guess I should have put that in the Team Explanation, but I assumed that everyone would be smart enough to understand why Toronto would be trading for a starting goalie to begin with. My mistake.

The real issue is the one raised by @byrr. He thinks that the value isn't anywhere close. To me, a starting goalie for three years, a cap improvement of almost $2 million, a move up in the draft and an additional third to a very very thin dance card is an improvement on standing pat on a team that has proven beyond question that it isn't going to get to the conference finals as is.
May 26 at 4:10 p.m.
#14
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Quoting: leafs101
I'd just sign campbell for that money and move Nylander for actual fair value before doing this because Campbell > Peterson. This isn't close to fair


The assumption here is that Toronto can't re-sign Campbell and thus has to look elsewhere for a starting goalie next season. I guess I should have put that in the Team Explanation, but I assumed that everyone would be smart enough to understand why Toronto would be trading for a starting goalie to begin with. My mistake.

The real issue is the one raised by @byrr. He thinks that the value isn't anywhere close. To me, a starting goalie for three years, a cap improvement of almost $2 million, a move up in the draft and an additional third to a very very thin dance card is an improvement on standing pat on a team that has proven beyond question that it isn't going to get to the conference finals as is.
May 26 at 4:11 p.m.
#15
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Quoting: OldNYIfan
The assumption here is that Toronto can't re-sign Campbell and thus has to look elsewhere for a starting goalie next season. I guess I should have put that in the Team Explanation, but I assumed that everyone would be smart enough to understand why Toronto would be trading for a starting goalie to begin with. My mistake.

The real issue is the one raised by byrr. He thinks that the value isn't anywhere close. To me, a starting goalie for three years, a cap improvement of almost $2 million, a move up in the draft and an additional third to a very very thin dance card is an improvement on standing pat on a team that has proven beyond question that it isn't going to get to the conference finals as is.


The problem you had is considering Petersen a starting goalie. He had no hint of success at it this season. Why would he be considered valuable like a top line winger? Imagine the other goalies who would be available you could get for that kind of package. Say the Islanders, could probably get Varlomov + Mayfield for Nylander. It's very debatable that the Kings would be able to trade Petersen for anything at all with that contract after his last season.
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May 26 at 4:13 p.m.
#16
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Quoting: Byrr
The problem you had is considering Petersen a starting goalie. He had no hint of success at it this season. Why would he be considered valuable like a top line winger? Imagine the other goalies who would be available you could get for that kind of package. Say the Islanders, could probably get Varlomov + Mayfield for Nylander. It's very debatable that the Kings would be able to trade Petersen for anything at all with that contract after his last season.


A legitimate point of view.
May 26 at 4:17 p.m.
#17
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Quoting: Byrr
The problem you had is considering Petersen a starting goalie. He had no hint of success at it this season. Why would he be considered valuable like a top line winger? Imagine the other goalies who would be available you could get for that kind of package. Say the Islanders, could probably get Varlomov + Mayfield for Nylander. It's very debatable that the Kings would be able to trade Petersen for anything at all with that contract after his last season.


Let me ask you another question. Assume that the goalie at issue here was, say, Jordan Binnington. (Other conditions remain the same.) Would you still think that the deal was ridiculously unfair?
May 26 at 4:18 p.m.
#18
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Edited May 26 at 4:25 p.m.
Quoting: OldNYIfan
Let me ask you another question. Assume that the goalie at issue here was, say, Jordan Binnington. (Other conditions remain the same.) Would you still think that the deal was ridiculously unfair?


Binnington hasn't been a great goalie either and has an even worse contract than Petersen. If the Leafs are going to spend 5-6 million on a middling goalie, they might as well just re-sign Campbell.

Traditionally goalies trade for much less than expected. They are the lowest value position on the team when it comes to acquiring assets from other teams. To get a point per game top line winger, it would have to be an impressive goalie. Nylander is an impact forward, the Leafs would expect an impact goalie in return as a minimum. Neither Binnington nor Petersen comes close to that level.
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May 26 at 4:24 p.m.
#19
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Quoting: OldNYIfan
The assumption here is that Toronto can't re-sign Campbell and thus has to look elsewhere for a starting goalie next season. I guess I should have put that in the Team Explanation, but I assumed that everyone would be smart enough to understand why Toronto would be trading for a starting goalie to begin with. My mistake.

The real issue is the one raised by byrr. He thinks that the value isn't anywhere close. To me, a starting goalie for three years, a cap improvement of almost $2 million, a move up in the draft and an additional third to a very very thin dance card is an improvement on standing pat on a team that has proven beyond question that it isn't going to get to the conference finals as is.


Only the top Vezina-caliber goalies would command a similar or greater trade value to Nylander (an elite forward). The guys who teams would be comfortable paying 8m+ now, the guys getting signed for 5-6m now won't be traded for that much even if they win the Vezina. If the Leafs can't sign Campbell it's because they are offering him less than 5m.
May 26 at 4:29 p.m.
#20
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Quoting: Byrr
Binnington hasn't been a great goalie either and has an even worse contract than Petersen. If the Leafs are going to spend 5-6 million on a middling goalie, they might as well just re-sign Campbell.

Traditionally goalies trade for much less than expected. They are the lowest value position on the team when it comes to acquiring assets from other teams. To get a point per game top line winger, it would have to be an impressive goalie.


Again, the assumption underlying this construction was that Toronto can't re-sign Campbell. Obviously, that is by far the best outcome for Toronto even if he costs more than Petersen.

Also, I think you should re-examine your assessment of Binnington's contract as "worse than Petersen's." Assume both play to starting-goalie standards for the remainder of their respective contracts. Which would you rather have: the guy signed for three years at $5 million, who will then presumably have to get more if he's successful, or the guy locked in to $6 million for 5 years (which should be this team's window)?

I'm evaluating Binnington as having a better track record (and thus being worth significantly more) than Petersen -- discount this past regular season and consider his playoff performance this year as well as his career -- so I think that he would be an even better candidate for the Maple Leafs than Petersen. But try posting an ACGM trading Binnington and the Blues fanatics come out of the woodwork.
May 26 at 4:33 p.m.
#21
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Quoting: GMBL
Only the top Vezina-caliber goalies would command a similar or greater trade value to Nylander (an elite forward). The guys who teams would be comfortable paying 8m+ now, the guys getting signed for 5-6m now won't be traded for that much even if they win the Vezina.


Well, the other conditions of this trade were specifically designed to address that. If you think that Los Angeles should still add someone or something significant, I'll accept that.

Quoting: GMBL
If the Leafs can't sign Campbell it's because they are offering him less than 5m.


I'm rooting for you. But I've seen a lot of Toronto guys complaining about 2022-2023 projections that Campbell should get more than $4 million, which I think is a bad analysis.
May 26 at 4:43 p.m.
#22
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Quoting: OldNYIfan
Again, the assumption underlying this construction was that Toronto can't re-sign Campbell. Obviously, that is by far the best outcome for Toronto even if he costs more than Petersen.

Also, I think you should re-examine your assessment of Binnington's contract as "worse than Petersen's." Assume both play to starting-goalie standards for the remainder of their respective contracts. Which would you rather have: the guy signed for three years at $5 million, who will then presumably have to get more if he's successful, or the guy locked in to $6 million for 5 years (which should be this team's window)?

I'm evaluating Binnington as having a better track record (and thus being worth significantly more) than Petersen -- discount this past regular season and consider his playoff performance this year as well as his career -- so I think that he would be an even better candidate for the Maple Leafs than Petersen. But try posting an ACGM trading Binnington and the Blues fanatics come out of the woodwork.


They can acquire Pettersen for picks and B-prospects (if Petersen is good enough then an A-goalie prospect if a team acquiring him had one). A player like Nylander who probably hasn't hit his ceiling yet (probably won't in Toronto as the 4th wheel) and is a point per game player isn't going to be traded for a goalie of less value as the center piece of the trade (the goal would be the roster player they acquire). Unless they trade him for Gibson which is probably a mistake if they aren't getting other pieces back, the only other goalies he would be traded for are Hellebuyck and Vasilevskiy and they both will cost more than him, Vasilevskiy for sure. If Price was healthy and retain at 50% then maybe.
May 26 at 4:46 p.m.
#23
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Quoting: OldNYIfan
Also, I think you should re-examine your assessment of Binnington's contract as "worse than Petersen's." Assume both play to starting-goalie standards for the remainder of their respective contracts. Which would you rather have: the guy signed for three years at $5 million, who will then presumably have to get more if he's successful, or the guy locked in to $6 million for 5 years (which should be this team's window)?


Why would you assume both play to starting goalie standards when neither have? Their play has been very inconsistent and even in their good seasons they are below league average. They should be treated as such and as such, their term isn't a bonus, its a liability.
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May 26 at 4:49 p.m.
#24
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Quoting: OldNYIfan
Well, the other conditions of this trade were specifically designed to address that. If you think that Los Angeles should still add someone or something significant, I'll accept that.



I'm rooting for you. But I've seen a lot of Toronto guys complaining about 2022-2023 projections that Campbell should get more than $4 million, which I think is a bad analysis.


Goaltending is a funny position and lots of goalies struggled playing in Toronto. They also have the cap problems. I think for now fans and Toronto management would want Campbell under 4m, I think they wanted Andersen for 4m flat (and he's been pretty consistent). They would rather have Campbell out play his contract and pay him more down the road without risking getting stuck with an albatross contract. Just look at Mrazek's situation. He can easily be bought out by a team with cap space and some people on here think Toronto need to give a first to dump him.
May 26 at 5:23 p.m.
#25
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It's been laid out pretty clearly what Arizona wants in a Chychrun deal from various sources. This is not it. Neither the pieces or the value.

Also, no reason for Arizona to acquire a player that is hurt as much as Turcotte and a player that hasn't played for almost the whole season (Walker). Injury history applies to Chychrun as well, but he has shown to come back fine from it. Until Walker has played it's not smart for Arizona to consider acquiring him.

I understand Clarke is off the table. Faber seems to be as well, but you can't get quality without giving up something of value in return. I'd consider a combination of Faber, Vilardi and your next two 1sts. Otherwise, there are plenty of suitors that I appreciate more. For example, any of Columbus' 1sts or Ottawa 1st.

Anyways, I always like your AGMs. They are well thought out and presented in a good way.
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