That's an easy no.

Not enough value in return for Fiala. Swap the 23 2nd for a Vilardi or Turcotte.

DUMBA = $6M

OR

ZUCCARELLO = $6M

PLUS

KULIKOV = $2M

OR

JOST = $2M

EQUALS

$8M TO RESIGN FIALA.


Guerin ABSOLUTELY has flexibility.

Our standing offer for Fiala is our 2022 first plus Turcotte (or Vilardi) plus a little something else.

is this just people on this site or was there a rumor this is what Blake offered?

Zucc wouldn’t really get moved would he? Don’t disagree with the flexibility you outlined but seems like the most logical option is either a Dumba or Fiala move. I think people on here grossly overstate the lack of flexibility all teams have.

There’s a ton of creative solutions teams can and have done - it becomes a question or risk appetite or willingness to spend in creative ways (cap dumps, sweeteners, three team trades, etc)

Yes. But it’s ignoring the replacement for Dumba in particular here, not to mention you will have to have a 7th defenseman/13th forward which means you only save 6 mil in cap. Likely less because a Dumba replacement probably costs more than league min. And don’t get me started on next year….

So your point that there is flexibility is true. I do however think that if you’re going down the line of using that, you might as well fire sale and load up for next years draft.

Dumbas replacement would be D prospect Addison. I don’t think a fire sale is likely to happen at all. BG just re-signed Kaprisov and wants to build a winning franchise to keep Kaprisov happy.

I think that it was people on this site (ahem).

If I were BG, yes, I’d move Zuc. However Russo has said that’s not likely to happen because Kaprisov and Zuc had a fantastic season together. BG wouldn’t do anything to jeopardize the Kaprisov relationship.

If Addison was ready for top 4 action, why was Jordie Benn chosen over him nearly every time it was an option? And let’s say Addison makes the lineup as a 3rd pair, which I think he does, that puts Goose into Dumba’s role. I don’t think there’s a person here that wants that. And it doesn’t change the fact you need to have a 7th defenseman.

The point of the above is that you need to make sacrifices. You need to make sure the sacrifice you make provides the most benefit and I guarantee you moving Fiala does that. Dumba would have been moved had a good offer come in. He wasn’t.

Very likely not.

But he switches to a 10-team M-NTC this off-season. So moving him is potentially doable. And if it meant keeping Fiala, Guerin should at least explore that option. Zuccarello will be 36 this year but has demonstrated he is more than capable of still producing with elite/high-end talent the past two seasons as Kaprizov's partner in goal crimes.

But no, I don't see it happening. I don't think it'd be wise to upset our franchise winger. Y'know...

Otherwise, I agree 100%. That's why the lowball offers from Devils fans irk me so damn much.

At least Kings and Sens fans have been reasonable. Isles fans are mixed, but I get where they're coming from. They're on the precipice of either rebuilding or trying go for it again next year. It's easy to be conflicted in that case.

Devils fans have mostly just lowballed, for the most part. Anything that would really be interesting they've been adamant about not giving up.

Russo and others have answered your question already. It’s because Spurgeon and Dumba are small so adding Addison would make one of the smallest Dcores “ever” (Russo’s words). Addison won’t be on the 3rd pair if Dumba and Spurgeon are back, he’ll be AHL or 7th man. Dumba has been available for 2+ years, no one has met BG’s ask. There’s already a top 4 RHD replacement on roster. So if people low ball for Fiala, the sacrifice you likely will see if BG’s ask for Dumba being lowered as a way to retain Fiala, even if it’s only for one more season (trade deadline move?). Also 7th D men come cheap in FA , that’s the least of our worries.

Russo has speculated it’s 95% chance Fiala is traded. I’d imagine teams will make a “fair” offer for Fiala and all this is moot. But I don’t think anyone is getting Fiala for Buch’s price tag.

I agree! Don’t understand that to get something you have to give something. The way I feel… if you’re not gonna offer the 2OA or the 2023 1st without protection then you better pony up some good prospects. I keep coming back to if it’s not Holtz then give us Mercer and a top 10 protected next year 1st. Think that’s fair value

I don’t think we’re close to looking at a Buch return. And like you said, I think it will end up being a moot point.

But one final thing on Addison (I promise I’m not trying to be obtuse), if he’s ready to step into a top 4 role and the coach decided to play Benn because he’s bigger then that’s more concerning than any transaction decision that occurs. Impact over size any day, I think there’s a recent corollary that emphasizes that but I could be wrong.

so no actual idea what LA may be wiling to offer? No rumors about that?

I mean, Holtz or Mercer both carry value commensurate to the 7th OVA pick. We aren't going to get either of those two and what would be akin to a second 1st rounder. Then it's an overpay on New Jerseys end. The best we'd get in addition to either of those two is probably a 2nd round pick. But definitely not another 1st.

The only real rumor of players and returns I’ve seen aside from the usual “1st and a prospect” type are the Anderson to NYI for 13OA. Cat, Fiala, and Pasta have all been moot on actual rumors. That said, Fiala is probably worth a 1st and decent prospect and Cat/Pasta that and another high end piece. Reasonable starting spot for our discussions IMO.

I agree, I think we’ll get a first round pick and a good prospect.

I’m not so sure, I think for a time last season we got pushed around by bigger teams (during our losing streak which I believe started against Calg). That’s a reason many believe BG made the moves to get bigger and tougher at the deadline. Teams generally don’t play top 4 prospects on the bottom pair. Similar to why teams don’t use top 6 forwards in a bottom line role. Not enough minutes for the prospect to develop and it’s a different role (more defensive).

I hear that. I also think they went after Middleton for his contract and on ice impact with high end D men. The fact he’s big is ancillary IMO. Deslauries was a bust and so was Benn. People talk about being pushed around but it’s actually just the other team being better.

Point and Kucherov are well under 6 foot. Makar and Toews are as well. They won cups because they’re good hockey players not because of how big or small they are.

I think had there not been a surplus of forward that could be available we could’ve gotten that type of deal but I think you’re right. Now if we want Mercer it’d maybe be 2nd round or lower but if it was Holtz it might be straight up. But truthfully I don’t think they’ll give up Holtz. I saw a different trade with a 2nd and 3rd rounders as well as 2 guys that won’t amount to anything more than depth players.

Yeah I haven't really seen any rumors about offers that Guerin is getting. I know there was some connecting the dots with the 7th overall pick but that's about it iirc.

I do not think you will be getting 2, Mercer, or Holtz.

Again, it all comes down to market on this one. In a vacuum probably not but I think NJD would be fine Moving Holtz/Mercer for Fiala if that’s what it took at the end of the day. Essentially just shift timelines and shifting prospect risk from one team to the other. The real issue for NJD is whether the market dictates another piece.

But 2OA is undoubtedly out.