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Statement to Wild Fans

Created by: JustanIdea
Team: 2022-23 Ottawa Senators
Initial Creation Date: Jun. 29, 2022
Published: Jun. 29, 2022
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
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    Congrats on the return for Fiala. It isn't bad but it's way off from what you were saying.

    Thinking specifically about the return I think that thte 7th OA pick would have been enough to make the team bite but I don't think Dorian offered it because 7th OA is about the same value as what the Sens had in the 7th OA pick.


    I also wonder if they had a deal going to Ottawa but Fiala wouldn't sign long-term there which forced the Wild to look elsewhere.
    Buyouts
    DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
    2022
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    2023
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    2024
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    ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
    15$82,500,000$52,880,714$0$4,025,000$29,619,286
    Left WingCentreRight Wing
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    $8,205,714$8,205,714
    LW
    UFA - 6
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    $950,000$950,000
    C
    UFA - 1
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    $4,975,000$4,975,000
    RW, LW
    UFA - 5
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    $3,600,000$3,600,000
    RW, LW
    UFA - 1
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    $1,200,000$1,200,000
    C, RW
    UFA - 1
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    $925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$2,500,000$2M)
    C
    UFA - 1
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    $1,500,000$1,500,000
    RW, LW
    UFA - 1
    Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
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    $8,000,000$8,000,000
    LD
    UFA - 6
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    $4,500,000$4,500,000
    RD
    M-NTC
    UFA - 2
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    $2,750,000$2,750,000
    G
    UFA - 3
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    $750,000$750,000
    LD
    UFA - 1
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    $3,000,000$3,000,000
    RD
    UFA - 1
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    $1,300,000$1,300,000
    LD
    M-NTC
    UFA - 1
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    $2,500,000$2,500,000
    RD
    UFA - 1
    Logo of the Ottawa Senators
    $925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$925,000$925K)
    LD
    UFA - 2
    ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
    Logo of the Ottawa Senators
    $4,687,500$4,687,500
    G
    M-NTC
    UFA - 2
    Logo of the Ottawa Senators
    $925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$600,000$600K)
    C
    RFA - 1

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    Jun. 30, 2022 at 12:22 a.m.
    #26
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    Quoting: MNBassman
    My assessment of Faber is: his ceiling is an nhl average top pairing rhd, and his floor is nhl average 2nd paring rhd.


    I don't love the deal (mainly because the prospects in this year's draft don't seem that great outside the top 5-6) but if Faber turns out to be a top pairing defenseman it would be hard to call this trade anything but a W in the future.
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    Jun. 30, 2022 at 12:34 a.m.
    #27
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    Quoting: TanSor
    I don't love the deal (mainly because the prospects in this year's draft don't seem that great outside the top 5-6) but if Faber turns out to be a top pairing defenseman it would be hard to call this trade anything but a W in the future.


    Don’t make me tap the sign that says “Next year’s draft is better than this one’s every year.”
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    Jun. 30, 2022 at 12:45 a.m.
    #28
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    Quoting: jnowariak
    It signals an Addison move more than a Dumba move….


    I disagree with this. More of a move to keep Addison and see the writing on the wall with Dumba
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    Jun. 30, 2022 at 12:53 a.m.
    #29
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    Quoting: Legendsofthenorth
    I disagree with this. More of a move to keep Addison and see the writing on the wall with Dumba


    I don’t think it’s clear one way or the other, especially how they’ve treated Addison this past season. I’ve heard a few good points for why Fabers arrival means Dumba is on the way out but I think it’s far from written on the wall.
    Jun. 30, 2022 at 12:57 a.m.
    #30
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    Quoting: jnowariak
    Don’t make me tap the sign that says “Next year’s draft is better than this one’s every year.”


    I think that sign will be very correct (for once). I don't like this year's draft at all. The top end talent isn't there, and what does count for top talent this year is a very shallow pool. I do think there will end up being more quality players than usual in the later rounds when people look back at this year (and last) draft class 10 years from now.

    I think GMBG simply woke up this morning and said today is the day to trade Fiala. Caller #1 will be the winner of this unannounced sweepstakes.

    I don't think an OS was a real threat of happening to Fiala. The only teams that could have tried that are teams that are bad (giving up an unprotected 1st is really dumb) or ones that have no cap space. Even if it did happen I don't think Fiala would have signed it and would have forced arbitration instead.

    I'm guessing (pure speculation) Fiala told GMBG he's wasn't signing longterm for non-Playoff teams. That helped force the trade happen before that news made it's way to the press.

    This is close (I think I had a FWD prospect from LA and not Faber) to the return I was expecting (and dreading).
    Jun. 30, 2022 at 1:24 a.m.
    #31
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    Quoting: jnowariak
    I don’t think it’s clear one way or the other, especially how they’ve treated Addison this past season. I’ve heard a few good points for why Fabers arrival means Dumba is on the way out but I think it’s far from written on the wall.


    I don't think it means anything about Dumba and his future in MN. Faber is at least 2 years (possibly 3 or 4) away from the NHL. Spurgeon's full NTC ends in 2 seasons. Addison is as ready now as he'll ever be, but has another year of waivers exemption. Dumba is a UFA after the season. MN has 6 d-men signed for the NHL roster, Middleton will make 7.

    For me, Addison is Spurgeon's replacement. The team wanted nothing to do with both of them in the lineup at the same time last year. IIRC they put Addison as the 12th FWD a couple of times instead of d-man (and played Benn) last season with Spurgeon in the lineup. There was also some comments about from the coach/GM about it last year at some point.

    I think everyone is trying to read the tea leaves when there is really nothing to see. It's just a distraction from the realization MN just got worse as a team next season.

    Faber needs to find some offense before he'll ever get a real shot at the NHL. It's just the way the game is now. It's also why the Wild sent ROR was sent back to the OHL instead of playing in the AHL last season. He needed to find an o-zone game.
    Jun. 30, 2022 at 8:14 a.m.
    #32
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    Quoting: jnowariak
    Don’t make me tap the sign that says “Next year’s draft is better than this one’s every year.”


    Eh, we will see but I liked the prospects in last year's draft far more than this one.

    If we end up keeping the picks I'd hope we take chances on guys like Yurov, Miroschnichenko, Lambert, etc. All guys that have very high ceilings but various risks.
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    Jun. 30, 2022 at 8:24 a.m.
    #33
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    Quoting: TanSor
    Eh, we will see but I liked the prospects in last year's draft far more than this one.

    If we end up keeping the picks I'd hope we take chances on guys like Yurov, Miroschnichenko, Lambert, etc. All guys that have very high ceilings but various risks.


    I think we’re absolutely gonna take Miro or Yurov. Lambert isn’t my cups tea tho.
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    Jun. 30, 2022 at 8:33 a.m.
    #34
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    Quoting: RazWild
    I don't think it does.

    I've said this before, but I've slowly come to think that Guerin and company view Addison as Spurgeon's eventual replacement and not Dumba's. Especially given the fact the coaching staff has been fairly adamant that he change how he plays to be more like Spurgeon than Dumba.

    Having two potential top 4 RHD defenseman prospects lends credence to that theory. One for each of them.

    Furthermore, one is a offensive puck-moving defenseman, while the other is a Brodin like shutdown defensive defenseman. It actually makes sense to have and keep both going forward.


    Spurgeon is signed through the 2026 season, he’s not going anywhere for a long time.
    Jun. 30, 2022 at 8:37 a.m.
    #35
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    Quoting: jnowariak
    No qualms with this, and I think you’re spot on. The problem discussing it is that Dumba is the next domino to go and the discussion hinges on Addison, which I don’t have a problem with if the goal is to build for the day when Addison is playing the Spurg role. But that’s in stark comparison to the competitiveness rhetoric we’ve heard.

    The way I see it is Dumba’s next contract starts with a 4, which is very enticing if you want to be competitive since he still provides huge impact when he’s on the ice. I think we’d be having a different conversation if his advocacy off the ice because it has very likely hurt his trade value as and he should get a decent prospect or pick coming back for him, which is why you need to hold him unless you get that.

    But I think what gets me the most is that he’s taken so much trash from a good chunk of the fan base for all of the wrong reasons. I think he’s a good defenseman. I think he was utilized poorly on the PP the last few years. I think his injuries have taken a toll. I also think that Addison and Faber will be great NHL players, but they aren’t yet. And man are we taking a lot of liberties when talking about being able to replace Dumba and not Fiala.

    Rant done.


    I think Raz had it, with Brodin covering you can have an offensive Dman. Brodin makes his partner look better than he is (see Dumba). The amount of times Dumba is out of position or beat and Brodin covers for him, truly amazing. Addison replacing Dumba IMO wouldn’t be a huge drop off in play, initially sure, let the rookie get his feet under him. I’m more confident in Addison replacing Dumbas production than I am of anyone replacing Fiala’s. I don’t know how we do that yet. Maybe BG has more moves coming.
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    Jun. 30, 2022 at 8:38 a.m.
    #36
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    Quoting: jnowariak
    I think we’re absolutely gonna take Miro or Yurov. Lambert isn’t my cups tea tho.


    Agreed not really a Lambert fan either but if he's there at 24 I think the talent would be tough to pass up.
    Jun. 30, 2022 at 8:39 a.m.
    #37
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    Quoting: jnowariak
    I don’t think it’s clear one way or the other, especially how they’ve treated Addison this past season. I’ve heard a few good points for why Fabers arrival means Dumba is on the way out but I think it’s far from written on the wall.


    They treat Addison with his size playing a huge role. And that has more to do with Dumba and Spurgeon. Russo and others have said this on KFAN. Right or wrong (I’m not arguing that), BG and Evason held his small size against him.
    Jun. 30, 2022 at 8:48 a.m.
    #38
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    Quoting: drmantalban
    “Way off”

    Lol there were plenty of reasonable Wild fans proposing or discussing returns very similar to 19th + Faber. Id even argue that 19th OA + Grans was probably one of the most popular frameworks on this site.

    But yeah, always nice to hear some veiled condescension from a 3rd party, so cheers bud.


    I proposed pretty close to the exact trade framework HERE and you didn't seem too convinced. And reading back on some of your posts just in THIS THREAD alone, you must be pretty salty with this return.
    Jun. 30, 2022 at 10:03 a.m.
    #39
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    “Despite the Wild’s deep pool of blue-line prospects, Calen Addison is the only one who shoots from the right side, although the team recently signed right-shot 2018 fifth-round pick Simon Johansson. Faber’s addition now gives the Wild insurance if this is Matt Dumba’s final year with the team. Dumba can become an unrestricted free agent in the summer of 2023. This is possibly a big reason the Wild didn’t prioritize adding a center or forward in general over a right-shot, potential Dumba replacement like Faber”

    Michael Russo’s latest article.
    Jun. 30, 2022 at 10:09 a.m.
    #40
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    Quoting: Pierre_from_Orleans
    I proposed pretty close to the exact trade framework HERE and you didn't seem too convinced. And reading back on some of your posts just in THIS THREAD alone, you must be pretty salty with this return.


    By saying “we shall see” in regards to whether or not his value would be that of Reinharts? Lmao guy, if you think that’s some sort of gotcha, you’ve got some bad tunnel vision going on.

    Or by saying markets can change, so comps aren’t perfect? Idk things like, say, DeBrincat and Pasta joining the rumor mills?

    I’m not salty at all. It’s pretty much exactly in line with what I projected out in value here:

    Fiala Packages

    I wanted a bit more, but Guerin decided against creating a bidding war, so it is what it is
    Jul. 1, 2022 at 12:04 a.m.
    #41
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    Quoting: drmantalban
    “Way off”

    Lol there were plenty of reasonable Wild fans proposing or discussing returns very similar to 19th + Faber. Id even argue that 19th OA + Grans was probably one of the most popular frameworks on this site.

    But yeah, always nice to hear some veiled condescension from a 3rd party, so cheers bud.



    Thanks man, it's more of those bot/troll poster who were sending FIala for the farm but there were sometimes that I didn't agree with you're opinion but I'd say we were in the middle in terms of valu . It was the Hockey something or other guy that I blocked that I couldn't stand cause his deals were outrageous.
    Jul. 1, 2022 at 12:06 a.m.
    #42
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    Quoting: palhal
    I thought the Wild got the most they would have received from any team. A pick and prospect but more important cap space.
    Why I think the Sens weren't really in the bidding. They can spend 7,75m on a UFA (not necessarily this year) instead of Fiala and keep their 7th overall pick or top prospects (whatever the selling price was)


    Sens are one of those teams that can't afford the big name guys and they have to build through the draft.

    The fact that Tkachuk, Batherson, Chabot, and hopefully others have signed long-term is a great thing for the organization and the city. Now it's time to get an arena on LeBreton Flats.
    Jul. 1, 2022 at 12:09 a.m.
    #43
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    Quoting: IcemanJoe
    Russo kind of mentioned on KfAN that there was risk in waiting for the draft. With the other scorers on the market LAK could’ve turned their attention elsewhere. And supposedly BG and our scouts love Faber, they wanted him in the deal. I think BG maybe could’ve gotten more by waiting for the draft but he also potentially could have gotten less when the musical chairs ended.

    This also signals the end of Dumba in MN. I just wonder if they trade him now or at the deadline? Feels like a waste to let him walk via FA for nothing.


    It'll be tough to get a read on Dumba cause Faber likely takes his spot in the future when they sign him to his ELC but I wouldn't be suprised if Guerin held him as an own rental cause even though Dumba is valuable he is probably more valuable to the team making a push next year and keeping Karprizov happy then trading off a solid RHD that can shutdown. I also think that Guerin might jump through more hoops to keep Dumba.
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    Jul. 1, 2022 at 12:12 a.m.
    #44
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    Jul. 1, 2022 at 12:13 a.m.
    #45
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    Jul. 1, 2022 at 12:16 a.m.
    #46
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    Quoting: JustanIdea
    It'll be tough to get a read on Dumba cause Faber likely takes his spot in the future when they sign him to his ELC but I wouldn't be suprised if Guerin held him as an own rental cause even though Dumba is valuable he is probably more valuable to the team making a push next year and keeping Karprizov happy then trading off a solid RHD that can shutdown. I also think that Guerin might jump through more hoops to keep Dumba.


    He’s tried to trade Dumba for 2+ years, why do you think he’d jump through hoops to keep him? I think it’s the opposite. And you called Dumba a shutdown D???? 🧐🧐🧐 I’m sorry but that couldn’t be further from the truth
    Jul. 1, 2022 at 12:17 a.m.
    #47
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    I've summoned all the Minni Fans, what have I done....

    Damn, the image meme didn't work frown
    Jul. 1, 2022 at 12:19 a.m.
    #48
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    Quoting: IcemanJoe
    He’s tried to trade Dumba for 2+ years, why do you think he’d jump through hoops to keep him? I think it’s the opposite. And you called Dumba a shutdown D???? 🧐🧐🧐 I’m sorry but that couldn’t be further from the truth


    I'm not all that well versed on Wild players but I don't think that Dumba is not all that bad in his own zone.

    I've also always though of him as a shutdown D but I think a better term is a good two way transitional D.
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    Jul. 1, 2022 at 12:22 a.m.
    #49
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    Quoting: JustanIdea
    I'm not all that well versed on Wild players but I don't think that Dumba is not all that bad in his own zone.

    I've also always though of him as a shutdown D but I think a better term is a good two way transitional D.


    I watch damn near every game, he’s a liability in his own zone. Terrible gap control, awful TOs, and out of position constantly. Brodin saves his ass damn near every shift.
    Jul. 1, 2022 at 12:23 a.m.
    #50
    LongtimeLeafsufferer
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    Quoting: JustanIdea
    Sens are one of those teams that can't afford the big name guys and they have to build through the draft.

    The fact that Tkachuk, Batherson, Chabot, and hopefully others have signed long-term is a great thing for the organization and the city. Now it's time to get an arena on LeBreton Flats.


    Agree with your hockey sentiment. But building an arena....it isn't so much the cost of building arena that is stumbling block for owners/cities, it's what entity covers the of the operating overages. The owners never want to pay for it and never does the cities.. Unless the arena is operating with events about 230 days a year, that doesn't cover the the cost of the arena.
    Hockey has about 50 games....what about the 180 dates? Can Ottawa support that?
    The LA, Toronto, and Rangers arenas have the most dates in North America.
     
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