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2021-2022 NHL Offseason Discussion Thread #11 - Will Lamoriello ever announce Kadri's signing?

Aug. 18, 2022 at 11:11 p.m.
#701
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Quoting: SevenLeg
I'd see it as Subban is traded for 5 1st round picks, then the 5 1st round picks are flipped for Weber... because it is what happens. Hypothetically, both Weber and Subban would be worth 5 1st round picks. N

Now if another random team retained on Weber and received MTL's 4th rounder in 2067 (like the Lehner trade you used as a comparable earlier), I'd consider it as a three-way trade. If not, it's two subsequent moves with an asset in common. There's a reason CapFriendly lists the Dach & Romanov trades in different threads unlike the Domi, Lehner trades.

Now since NYI and CHI had no mutual link in the Romanov-Dach thing, it's not a three-way. It's Romanov + stuff for a 1st, then 1st + stuff for Dach.

Well you’re entitled to your opinion I guess, even if it’s foolish. You could literally break every trade down like that and say you acquired infinite firsts with that logic, you just so happened to also trade every single one of them back where they came from. Calling it an acquisition because of it not being submitted as a 3-way trade when the two trades in question very obviously wouldn’t have happened if all 3 parties weren’t in agreement is being deliberately obtuse and pedantic at best. At the end of the day though, he doesn’t have the 1st, he has Dach. Give him props for what he’s done, not what his hypothetical best outcome would have been. Or if you’re gonna insist on saying he acquired 4 1sts, put his feet to the fire for immediately dumping one for a worse asset.
Aug. 18, 2022 at 11:21 p.m.
#702
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Quoting: Alfie11
Well you’re entitled to your opinion I guess, even if it’s foolish. You could literally break every trade down like that and say you acquired infinite firsts with that logic, you just so happened to also trade every single one of them back where they came from. Calling it an acquisition because of it not being submitted as a 3-way trade when the two trades in question very obviously wouldn’t have happened if all 3 parties weren’t in agreement is being deliberately obtuse and pedantic at best. At the end of the day though, he doesn’t have the 1st, he has Dach. Give him props for what he’s done, not what his hypothetical best outcome would have been. Or if you’re gonna insist on saying he acquired 4 1sts, put his feet to the fire for immediately dumping one for a worse asset.


The first part makes literally no sense because 1st rounders are very rarely flipped within the same day/week/month so it doesn't apply to every trade at all.

The Blackhawks get Beauvillier and the Islanders get McCabe in the draft day thing, or heck the Blackhawks retain on Romanov (if he was under contract) - that's a 3-way trade, because the first and third parties have a direct link one with the other.

And I give props to Treliving for what he's done, because he never received a 1st rounder from Florida in the Tkachuk as he doesn't have it anymore.
Aug. 18, 2022 at 11:44 p.m.
#703
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Farewell
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Edited Aug. 18, 2022 at 11:49 p.m.
Never mind, broken link
Aug. 19, 2022 at 12:08 a.m.
#704
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Edited Aug. 19, 2022 at 12:55 a.m.
Quoting: SevenLeg
The first part makes literally no sense because 1st rounders are very rarely flipped within the same day/week/month so it doesn't apply to every trade at all.

The Blackhawks get Beauvillier and the Islanders get McCabe in the draft day thing, or heck the Blackhawks retain on Romanov (if he was under contract) - that's a 3-way trade, because the first and third parties have a direct link one with the other.

And I give props to Treliving for what he's done, because he never received a 1st rounder from Florida in the Tkachuk as he doesn't have it anymore.

Yeah I literally said that lol. Calgary got Huberdeau, Weegar, Schwindt, and the cap space to sign Kadri for Tkachuk+Monahan 🤷‍♂️

If you can rework the trade so that the Habs send Romanov+3rd+4th to Chicago for Dach, who then trades Romanov+4th on to NYI for 13oa, which you can and end up in the same exact outcome, then you don’t get to claim ever owning the 1st. It’s not yours and it was never going to be yours. Dach is yours.
Aug. 19, 2022 at 12:18 a.m.
#705
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Quoting: Alfie11
Yeah I literally said that lol. Calgary got Huberdeau, Weegar, Schwindt, and the cap space to sign Kadri for Tkachuk+Monahan 🤷‍♂️

If you can rework the trade so that the Habs send Romanov+3rd+4th to Chicago for Dach, who then trades Romanov+4th on to NYI for 13oa, which you can and end up in the same exact outcome, then you don’t get to claim every owning the 1st. It’s not yours and it was never going to be yours. Dach is yours.


How'd they get Dach?
Aug. 19, 2022 at 1:00 a.m.
#706
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Quoting: SevenLeg
How'd they get Dach?

By giving up Romanov, a 3rd, and a 4th
Aug. 19, 2022 at 2:28 a.m.
#707
me wan da poonani
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Quoting: DirtyDangle
4th, what the hell are the habs doing with all those forwards


retaining and trading for 4th rd picks ig
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Aug. 19, 2022 at 5:09 a.m.
#708
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Quoting: Tintin
retaining and trading for 4th rd picks ig


the marc bergevin special
Aug. 19, 2022 at 6:58 a.m.
#709
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Quoting: DirtyDangle
the marc bergevin special


Well Byron’s apparently also an LTIR player, I’d assume the guys with 1 year ( so Drou, Dadonov, Monahan might be traded w/o retention during the season to clear roster spots and get assets back, we’re definitely not resigning all of them )
Aug. 19, 2022 at 8:07 a.m.
#710
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Quoting: Alfie11
By giving up Romanov, a 3rd, and a 4th


Then why isn't Romanov a Blackhawk?
Aug. 19, 2022 at 8:13 a.m.
#711
EklundCelebriniSmith
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Reading this argument was like scratching nails on a chalkboard lol - still better than the Monahan conditions.
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Aug. 19, 2022 at 8:19 a.m.
#712
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Quoting: SevenLeg
Then why isn't Romanov a Blackhawk?

That doesn’t matter for Montreal. It was Romanov+3rd+4th out, Dach in. Evaluating it from Montreal’s pov any other way is a waste of time, because that was what they gave up and received at the end of the day.
Aug. 19, 2022 at 8:24 a.m.
#713
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Quoting: Alfie11
That doesn’t matter for Montreal. It was Romanov+3rd+4th out, Dach in. Evaluating it from Montreal’s pov any other way is a waste of time, because that was what they gave up and received at the end of the day.


It does matter, because if it was a simple Romanov + picks for Dach, Romanov would be on Blackhawks. Now why is Romanov on the Islanders?

It means they received a 1st, then flipped the 1st.

To flip the 1st, they acquired the 1st because you can't trade assets you don't possess.

I get taking shortcuts, but ignoring the complete process to fit your narrative is dumb.
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Aug. 19, 2022 at 8:25 a.m.
#714
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Quoting: Alfie11
That doesn’t matter for Montreal. It was Romanov+3rd+4th out, Dach in. Evaluating it from Montreal’s pov any other way is a waste of time, because that was what they gave up and received at the end of the day.


You could look at it as a 3-way trade and MTL never really had the first-round pick or as Hughes used the asset he traded for by flipping it for another asset that he like better. Your both right lol.
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Aug. 19, 2022 at 9:23 a.m.
#715
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Now that the Kadri domino has fallen and the news about Price to LTIR has hit...

Did Evan Rodrigues already sign with NYI 3 weeks ago and it will be announced later by Lou along with extensions for Dobson/Romanov?

Will Montreal continue to use their newfound Cap space to make moves (Tyson Barrie for David Savard w/50% retention?)

What does Florida do to clear the cap and fix their defense? They are about $2 million over and have another $3 million to clear when Duclair comes off LTIR; and they still need to add a solid blueliner (Calvin de Haan?). Hornqvist cap dump trade? To who (Arizona with Mayo coming back?) With what assets? If Monahan's $6.4 million cost a 1st to move and Florida only has 2 presumably low 2nd rounders in the next 3 drafts what else do they give up?
Aug. 19, 2022 at 9:28 a.m.
#716
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Quoting: HockeyScotty
Now that the Kadri domino has fallen and the news about Price to LTIR has hit...

Did Evan Rodrigues already sign with NYI 3 weeks ago and it will be announced later by Lou along with extensions for Dobson/Romanov?

Will Montreal continue to use their newfound Cap space to make moves (Tyson Barrie for David Savard w/50% retention?)

What does Florida do to clear the cap and fix their defense? They are about $2 million over and have another $3 million to clear when Duclair comes off LTIR; and they still need to add a solid blueliner (Calvin de Haan?). Hornqvist cap dump trade? To who (Arizona with Mayo coming back?) With what assets? If Monahan's $6.4 million cost a 1st to move and Florida only has 2 presumably low 2nd rounders in the next 3 drafts what else do they give up?


I think Sonny Milano is more likely in NYI. I think Montreal just signs Dach and maybe trades Dvorak. Florida, not really sure they have no picks so it's gonna be tough to dump cap space.
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Aug. 19, 2022 at 9:32 a.m.
#717
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Quoting: ARMCHAIRGMOFTHEYEAR
I think Sonny Milano is more likely in NYI. I think Montreal just signs Dach and maybe trades Dvorak. Florida, not really sure they have no picks so it's gonna be tough to dump cap space.


If Sonny does end up in NYI, where will he end up in the lineup, and will he have anything resembling the chemistry he had with Trevor Zegras? If so, with who?
Aug. 19, 2022 at 9:37 a.m.
#718
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Quoting: Bobcat205
If Sonny does end up in NYI, where will he end up in the lineup, and will he have anything resembling the chemistry he had with Trevor Zegras? If so, with who?


I Was just saying more likely than EROD. think Nelson and Barzal could both develop Chemistry with him. I wouldn't be surprised if NYI traded one of Clutterbuck or Matt Martin to create space for Bellows. One of the younger teams making a jump this year could be interested kinda how the Rangers traded for Reaves.
Aug. 19, 2022 at 10:00 a.m.
#719
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Quoting: SevenLeg
Then why isn't Romanov a Blackhawk?


Chicago wanted a top 15 pick for Dach, Obviously they didn't value Romanov that high (which makes sense because he hasn't improved since he entered the NHL)
Aug. 19, 2022 at 10:22 a.m.
#720
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Quoting: A_Habs_fan
Well Byron’s apparently also an LTIR player, I’d assume the guys with 1 year ( so Drou, Dadonov, Monahan might be traded w/o retention during the season to clear roster spots and get assets back, we’re definitely not resigning all of them )


what teams have the cap space for those players without retention tho. and if you had the cap space isnt there much better options.
Aug. 19, 2022 at 10:23 a.m.
#721
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All these questions, and i don't see one person asking the REAL big questions, like "Where does Loui Eriksson go?"
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Aug. 19, 2022 at 10:24 a.m.
#722
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Quoting: HockeyScotty
Now that the Kadri domino has fallen and the news about Price to LTIR has hit...

Did Evan Rodrigues already sign with NYI 3 weeks ago and it will be announced later by Lou along with extensions for Dobson/Romanov?

Will Montreal continue to use their newfound Cap space to make moves (Tyson Barrie for David Savard w/50% retention?)

What does Florida do to clear the cap and fix their defense? They are about $2 million over and have another $3 million to clear when Duclair comes off LTIR; and they still need to add a solid blueliner (Calvin de Haan?). Hornqvist cap dump trade? To who (Arizona with Mayo coming back?) With what assets? If Monahan's $6.4 million cost a 1st to move and Florida only has 2 presumably low 2nd rounders in the next 3 drafts what else do they give up?


im surprised montreal hasn't done anything with their defense. if anything they downgraded their d. for some reason added a few forwards tho
Aug. 19, 2022 at 10:41 a.m.
#723
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Lou would still come out quite well from this offseason by signing E-Rod and Milano.
With their goalie tandem and solid top 4, that should put them clear of teams like the Sabres, Sens and Red Wings
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Aug. 19, 2022 at 10:42 a.m.
#724
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Friedman stated that Romanov and Dobson are signed. He thinks Romanovs AAV will be in the 3 mill range. He also believes Dobson is going to come in at a big number, which I’m assuming means long term. 7 mill x 8?


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Aug. 19, 2022 at 10:44 a.m.
#725
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Quoting: Db1899
Friedman stated that Romanov and Dobson are signed. He thinks Romanovs AAV will be in the 3 mill range. He also believes Dobson is going to come in at a big number, which I’m assuming means long term. 7 mill x 8?




I think 8 x 6.5 just above Pulocks AAV
Romanov 3 x 2.75
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