Not sure about that but they did pick a lot of LD’s

Agreed Foligno was the right target but Dubas MASSIVELY overpaid. One of the biggest TDL overpays in recent memory.

Ownership has been the reason they are in that mushy middle and wont rebuild. I don't think theyll blow it up

Our Med Staff are gods

Got Kase to 50 games and heck if Duchene was not throwing high elbows could have been 65

It was mentioned by I believe Dangle. There was an incident between the two before the Van trade.

But man Holl was Hakstol's project and he loved him with Muzzin

Im seeing CGY fans trading out Mangipane is AGMs. He also has started slow like the rest of the flames. Wonder if management thinks the same. Id love to buy low on him...

Agreed, it’s the retention for me too. Murray was out of the league and OTT was desperate to trade him so they could acquire DeBrincat and Giroux. Only getting 25% and a 3rd rounder was terrible negotiating.

I think we could have done better, but i disagree on the alternative route. I think (for the aquisition cost) he was a good bet and it looks to be working out so far knock on wood

If I've learned anything from ACGM, its that fans have absolutely zero idea of whats going on, so I wouldn't hold my breath lmao

That being said, if Mangipane is on the block I would be on the phone with Treliving so quickly. Talk about a legit top 6 forward

With 5.65 mill Toronto should go to either Edmonton or Pittsburgh and be like hey we see u got 2 struggling guys could we swing a deal.

As if u play your cards right pay almost nothing and get someone who could come in and thrive with a change of scenery

Oh ya, I’m fine with going after him, goalies are voodoo and they are setting themselves up to have pretty much an open bank when Matthews is up in 2024.

But not getting more from OTT was a mistake.

LMFAO

And yes, absolutely

They have no idea sure, but they do espouse general feelings about the team

Actually the only difference id have made was having OTT pay a 3rd team to retain an additional 37.5%

I had the leafs getting a 3rd back for the trouble in my head (and i have a post somewhere saying this too)

Hard to figure out what Sutter is thinking here with his lineups

I think he is thinking something along the lines of: "**** **** crap **** asshole why wont anything work!?!?!?"

Or something like that

I’ll just say, OTT was desperate to move him, he has a NTC and only wanted to play in TOR. Dubas should have taken Dorrion to the cleaners in this trade or better yet just wait till they buy him out. Sign him for whatever.

With the way things are going high 3rd could turn into another Niemela. Would have liked more retention but just saying if he ends with 35 gp and a 0.915 and its a winning record would be funny and a good joke for our rivals

In general if Foligno was healthy yeah. But our injury bug hit him and we got aa 10% version

I don’t know how the conditions fully work but ARI has the choice of our 2023 3rd or 2025 2nd from the Ritchie trade. It’s possible that OTT goes to ARI if they so choose.

Again, the main goal for OTT was to save as much money as they could. If they bought him out they would have saved 5 of the 15 million dollars he was still owed. They would have been on the hook for 10 of that 15 million. By trading him for 25% retained, they saved 11.25 million dollars (6.25 more than if they bought him out). The Leafs basically gifted them 6.25 million more, a divisional rival no less, that SHOULD net you more than a 3rd and 7th.

I was happy with the gamble, even more so since he looks to be in great form (IF he can stay healthy). But I will die in the hill this was a terrible negotiation by Kyle.

Its our 3rd or the 2025 3rd not Ott's

So even if they take the 3rd we got OTT's

Traded • Ryan Dzingel • Ilya Lyubushkin to Maple Leafs for • Nick Ritchie • draft pick (Coyotes choice of 2023 third round pick or 2025 second round pick)

So, yes we would keep OTT pick. That’s still not enough

There is also the legendary 7th which through our history turns out good

Actually a lot of people were really praising that deadline and particularly that move for Dubas. They were all wrong.

Plus, what really bothers me is that the Foligno deal was partially in consequence the whole expansion draft thing; at least it seems so to me. In Dubas's interviews around the time he was talking about how usually he's not a rental guy, but given the circumstances of the x-draft it might make sense. Sounds like they had already decided to keep Holl and didn't want to get a fwd with term and lose him for nothing and so went for Foligno rather than a guy with control and then go 7-3-1 where they could've exploited the surplus of forwards like you mentioned.

With all this talk about Foligno, does anyone have faith in Dubas that he can pull off a trade that helps this team offensively? The need was so clearly there in the offseason yet he doubled down on getting defensive players. His track record fit identifying young talent in the draft is really good. But his ability to win trades or impactful ones is not.

His trade history leaves a lot to be desired. Like outside of the Kapanen deal and Campbell deal, there is not very much to like or improve this team. Even the Muzzin trade (it was so clear even then they NEEDED an RD, with Muzzin even coming out saying he has played RD and will play wherever Babcock wants him). John Tavares was the last player Kyle brought in to help this team offensively (you could make the argument Tavares only wanted to play here). Michael Bunting also but again you can make the argument he only wanted to play in Toronto also.

Kyle’s trade history

He walked into a situation with a loaded team, he has done a good job at revamping the Dcore (from what Lou has built) but my faith in him making the right decision is very low.

Thoughts?