What if we just had Toews and no other changes lol

I mean...the team went to the ECF without Toews in 2020-21, so as much as I dislike the trade I think we should start trying to move past it. Are you happy with Ryan Pulock & Mat Barzal? Because Lou had to choose 2 of those 3 guys after the flat cap came into play.

And turning Bailey/Varalamov/Chara into Eberle/Lehner/Toews in 2021-22 isn't enough to turn them from an 84 point team to a 101 point team, IMO. Sure, they're better, but they finished 16 points out of playoff positioning last year. I don't think that trio gives them 8-9 extra wins in an 82 game season.

Eberle was a scapegoat by the fanbase. He was a legitimate 1st line winger on the isles and there were fans who wanted to give up a pick to get rid of him.

still trash

Lou did not have to choose between those three, he could have easily bought out Leddy to retain Toews .

Toews + Eberle would have given them an extra 8 wins. Chara and Bailey are negative assets who cost them 5-7 wins. Both Toews and Eberle are elite at generating scoring chances.

isles own the rangers

And I'd argue right back that keeping Lehner over Varlamov means that Sorokin doesn't come over from CSKA in 2020, meaning you're rolling with Lehner and, I dunno, Thomas Greiss? Cory Schneider? last season instead of Sorokin/Varalmov, which promptly gives back at least half of those extra wins that you're giving them here.

I dunno, I just really dislike these posts because you're arguing that a guy would put up the same numbers here that he's put up on his new team. We all saw how Barry worked these past 4 years, there's no guarantee he would've deployed Toews the way that Bednar has in Colorado, so continuing to pine after him 2+ years after he was traded just comes off like the guy still pining after his ex. Move on! The team is good now after a down year. They're beating good teams and showing a fight that they didn't last year, and the numbers are backing them up.

I'm not talking about Lehner, just about Toews and Eberle . but when healthy he's a top 10 and if there's one thing Lou can do well it's evaluating goaltenders.

Toews was just as good, if not better on the isles than he is on the Avs. The only difference is the Avs have more players who can capitalize on the chances he creates. He was on PP1 under Trotz and he's up there with pelech for best defensive defenseman in the league. Fans are always going to harp on bad trades, Edmonton still does with the Reinhart for Barzal. It's understandable when you trade a top 10 defenseman in the league for scraps. I think the isles win the cup in 20-21 season if they had Toews over Leddy

Fair enough, and I don't completely disagree. I just think the "what if we kept Toews" posts are getting close to the Boston fans redoing the 2015 draft posts at this point. You are right that Lou basically picked Leddy over Toews at the time, and while it's not a *great* decision it's at least a decision you can squint and say "well I guess I get it" - it's not like he picked Thomas Hickey over Toews, ya know? And that extra year of Nick Leddy turned into a trade where Detroit somehow gave us back a 2nd rounder we had traded away, and now we all have Aatu Raty in our lives because of him. So it's not all bad in the end.

I would rather Hickey 😂 - Yes the trade Lou made with DET was good, but I was really hoping the isles could get Toews on a 4.5 x 5 mill contract (which we now know was doable).

I just think overall isles fans overrate the hell out of certain players around the league while underrating some of the players on the isles. Toews, Eberle, Nino , Wahlstrom - even Barzal. I don’t think Wahlstrom is going to get traded, but if he does it will sting more than Toews because whoever gets him is featuring him on the left dot on PP1.

He’s not a top 10 dman in the league. Though it helps when you play with Cale Makar and the avs forward group

Toews is definitely top 10. Toews makes Makar a better player at even strength. The points went up once he went to COL but he’s always been an elite two way defenseman

Lou could have traded a combination of Hickey/ Komarov . Either broughtout or traded a first to get rid of Leddy. When Lou gave an extension of 2.5 million/year to Hickey he mis-evaluated his defensive prospect pool. I understand retaining Pulock instead of Toews at the time because he is a RHD and also completes the first pair that isles use in their system. Toews has clearly out performed Pulock in offensive and defensive metrics. Those are the kind of predictive statements that the development staff have to evaluate when contract extensions are due.

i would understand that but I am very into advanced analytics and Toews was prone to breakout. Him getting protected over Leddy was moronic.

He’s still not a top 10 defenseman. (In no particular order)
Makar
Hedman
Fox
Mcavoy
Josi
Ekblad
Slavin
Heiskanen
Hughes
Dahlin
Are all better than devon

slavin , Hughes, and Ekblad. are not better. than toews.

He's in the 99th percentile , there aren't 10 defenseman better than him
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Send me all the charts you want it doesn’t matter to me. Learn to use your eyes bro, toews has never been a number 1 dman playing number 1 minutes and has only ever been on good teams. Let’s see him try to put up those numbers playing minutes like werenski or hughes or dahlin.
You claim ekblad and slavin are worse than Devon, ekblad does enough for an entire d core and slavin is the best defender in the league.

Toews averaged 25 min TOI last season. He’s a #1 caliber defenseman. He’s elite at every aspect of the game, was the same thing on NYI. He plays tougher minutes than Hughes, Werenski etc..

Eye test and the analytics back up that Toews is top 10, you won’t find many top 10 D lists without Devon Toews