I agree with your last point, I don't think Tarasenko or Kane are good fits for the Leafs. I just don't know why you guys are getting so offended. I never said Bertuzzi is a bad player, if he got traded last year or the year before he 1000% gets a 1st when the competition is Foligno, Hall and Savard or Chiarot and Giroux. Also what does players of different positions have to do with anything? They're going to bring in 1sts. How many 1sts do you think will be traded this year? 7?

'so called significant injury'. He had surgery for this injury, no? That's rather significant. The fact you have to try and downplay it just shows he is a distressed asset.

I am not offended. I welcome a healthy conversation/debate.

If I had to guess how many firsts would be traded I would say probably between 6-9 total.

If you asked more specifically how many 2023 1sts will be traded I would say anywhere from 3-5 so, call it 4.

Players like Bo Horvat or Jakob Chychrun could get two 1sts alone.

When you say, if this was last year, you could easily see Bertuzzi going for this kind of return, the argument could be made that, what has changed with Bertuzzi since then to warrant being viewed as no longer worthy? If it’s two unlucky unrelated injuries directly due to his competitive nature, then the answer is absolutely nothing.

What makes Bertuzzi valuable is the exact reason why he isn’t playing right now. And as crazy as that sounds, it’s true. He has always put his body on the line for his team, steps up for his teammates, does all the little things and can score 30 goals. His teammates adore him and so do his coaches. Guy’s a stud.

Not many Leaf fans I know would pay that for bertuzzi; if we’re burning a 1st + 3rd + top 3 prospect from our system I’d expect a lot more coming back than a rental bertuzzi, no offense. That’s a no.

Brother u can argue semantics all you want. They forgot my sauce at Taco Bell last week and that was pretty significant to me because I need sauce with my tacos.

Point is, you understand what the guy is trying to say. It’s not like it’s an ACL, or a chronic injury. It was two freak injuries, clean breaks from blocked shots. He will be back, good as new.

I don't see the Devils as Stanley Cup winners this year, even before the downfall, but I would say it makes no sense from the main point of why spend so much in an area that is realistically least important to fill the void of moving forward? If Nemec isn't ready, get a 1yr fill-in to cover the gap...not give up a 1st AND a really solid prospect playing above his draft expectations who himself could maybe even push out Nemec.

Siegenthaler already signed an extension before this year that is a truly great team-friendly deal, so he's out of your equation.

As far as where to make moves? it's all about goaltending to me and then maintaining depth. Severson, Graves, Wood, and all other UFAs are gone. I wouldn't give any of them the type of term I expect someone else to give them. I may even like Graves, but it would be silly to get caught in setting up their own cap hell knowing they will be paying Luke Hughes in three years. Now, why not pay him for the next three years? There is no guarantee Graves maintains a UFA contract value, most UFAs decrease in value...Also Luke might be a #4 LHD sooner than later playing with someone like Marino to babysit him defensively.

As far as forwards, the main core is just Hischier, Hughes, Bratt in nor particular order. Maintaining depth to me would be Sharangovich, Mercer, and getting Palat back. Beyond that, let's see what Holtz can become. Bring back McLeod and Bastian as I do believe they make a great 4th line.

So what is missing? I need a legit 3C, more likely a veteran. This keeps Mercer at the wings. We need a goalie that runs that net with no worries. I'm not terrified of VV's downturn, I think he can make a comeback, but I'm done with Blackwood. I have no true answer there, but that is far more of a worry than anything else.

So, in summary, give me a top 6 including Hughes, Hischier, Mercer, Bratt, Palat for sure, and then one more top winger. A bottom six including Sharangovich, Zetterlund, McLeod, Bastian, and Holtz along with a legit 3C. Not an overly expensive one, just someone in UFA that won't need more than a three year term. A defense with a 1-2yr veteran added to the mix to keep Luke at 3LHD and focus on PP time, and a 1yr veteran RHD to keep Nemec down (if he isn't ready, I'll admit I don't pay as much attention to Utica this year). I'm solid with Siegs and even Brendan Smith (3rd) on LHD and Hamilton/Marino on RHD.

Don't trade the 1st this year....draft the best goalie in the draft (as one should go in high 20s) if the Devils don't continue to fall off the cliff and no other forward stands out entirely. Solve the problem long term for that Stanley Cup team...just use these years as learning experiences so when they are that Stanley Cup team, I don't have to hear about experience the whole time...

If I'm spending on anything it is size with some skill, not just speed, we have speed. No, no, no, not Josh Anderson, size does not mean good. His contract STINKS.

With you 100% boss. I think Kasper could be special, he’s been growing on me since I preferred Conor Geekie (I still do), but aside from Marco, there just isn’t another guy that we can look at and say, “that guy is going to be a stud.”

This draft could set us up nicely in that department if we’re able to capitalize on the trade deadline this year.

Hronek is the perfect 2nd pair D. Last season was an anomaly. He has been steady otherwise. He is still young by defenseman standards especially. Sure he is lighting up the offense, but he has always been a great puck moving defenseman, sans last year. He plays well positionally, and can fill in on tbe top pair, though he is not equipped to take on the McDavids and Matthews of the league. That can be remedied with good coaching.

Hronek is signed to a reasonable contract with some term left. The question is, is this season Hroneks arrival (now that he has a competent partner, forwards who receive the puck, and a coach who isn't Blashill), or will Hronek regress? Based on his earlier seasons, I'd say last year was just a bad year, and Hronek is a top 4 easily tbe rest of his career. I have no idea on the NJ prospects here, but the 1st does not intrigue me as much as Hronek. A late 1st...sure you might strike gold, but if you were drafting a D, you'd aspire to get what Hronek is this season, and wish or hope you end up with something better but no guarantees.

Thank you for that complete rundown. I appreciate the perspective you have given me.

Based on your assessment, you guys need a Center and stability in net.

Do you think adding say, Ryan O’Reilly makes the team a contender?

I just think with how deep the team is with Defense prospects, albeit each one is a couple years away, giving up a 1st rounder to be able to take a crack at a cup This year with This group, that seemingly won’t be together very long, could be worth the investment, if they win.

Hronek may be good, but he's not worth it to the Devils. Devils already have Hamilton and John Marino...if you are forgetting about or ignoring Marino, that just isn't showing much knowledge.

O'Reilly will likely get term and too much money, just because GMs are silly. I may look at someone like Sean Monahan (no Habs fans, I'm not trading much for him, rather get him as a UFA) or someone like that.

As far as cracking at the cup this year, it's just rushing it. This team has flaws in areas that don't make sense. Even now, why am I trading for Hronek this year when I have Severson? I don't even hate Severson, he just needs his nose cracked once and a while.

Oh, man, the Devils have some straight up baller defense prospects in the pipeline. Their group of Simon Nemec, Luke Hughes, Shakir Mukhamedullin & Seamus Casey rivals the Wings’ Simon Edvinsson, William Wallinder, Albert Johansson & co. It is much better in fact, well, in my opinion.

Hands tend to be kind of important to hockey players, especially skilled ones. You hope he'll be good as new but you can't say for sure ... which is kind of the point. It's especially relevant because we aren't talking a long recovery time. He won't be with the Leafs past this season so it's how he will play immediately upon returning from those hand injuries which is a big gamble for teams to take and hence the distressed asset.

Bs have no use for Prius. Need a bottom 6 FW with size plays heavy game. Certainly that’s not him. Better off keeping the picks and Snith.

Fair enough. I'm not familiar with the Devils D outside of Nemec. From the Wings side, Edvinsson needs another year, and appears to be a better offense version of Seider with less cerebral ability (which Seider is off the charts for his age). Johansson struggled coming to North America, but a half season in the AHL and he looks like he is ready to fill in for 9 games this year. Johansson might be another 1D, to be honest. I'm not as sold on Wallinder as others, but the dude has a chip on his shoulder after being snubbed by team Sweden last year and has been lights out since. Not sure if his game translates to North America. Don't sleep on the steady Buium, who has been above expectations. Sebrango is a nice possible late bloomer who gets pushed out from the other depth at D.

Acquiring any prospect D is just to give more competition, and trade options.

Oh, and Hughes. He has been underperforming I thought? Not anything to worry about yet, but not hitting his pedigree.

Luke Hughes is currently captain of team USA in the tournament and scored a sick goal today. I have no worries about him.

Also, you really should look up Seamus Casey.

Huh? Hands? Important? Ohhhh, man, you know you’re right. I was confusing hockey with soccer cuz there’s like a goal and a goalie and all that stuff, I forgot that hands are important. Hey, honestly, thanks man. I goofed up big time on that one.

Hey, do you think I could get your valuable perspective on the Frosties from Wendy’s? Cuz it comes with a spoon but, you also get a straw so, is it ice cream or is it a shake or maybe something previously nameless in between, like umm, idk maybe like a frost… ahh, that’s it - its not ice cream or a shake; it’s a Frosty. Thanks again, man wow, you are on a roll today.

Buium I really like but, another LHD. I could see Sebrango being a really solid 7th defenseman in the NHL but not really much more than that. There’s just not enough to his game that stands out.

It is measured based on what he has done this season. If you look at the previous track records, Muzzin will easily get the Leafs a first+ if we we trade him. Past history doesn't mean anything, it's based on what they are doing right now

Oh, lord. You’re one of those people. Okay, here we go.

I guess Anthony Cirelli, Bo Byram, Samuel Girard & Josh Norris wouldn’t net a 1st round pick if they were traded too, huh?

Just stop man. These players aren’t defined by the little they’ve played this year, it is of course considered but, it won’t dictate their values more than a marginal difference. Quit.

Been an interesting discussion. Clearly we Leaf fans don’t value bertuzzi the way wings fans do. Let me see if we can bridge the difference.

Assuming positions were switched - Wings in playoffs and Leafs on outside looking in…Would wings fans pay a 1st + 3rd + top 3 prospect for Michael bunting? Bunts is similar type player, puts up similar (actually better) numbers than Bertuzzi, they are similar age and both are pending FAs?

Let’s add a few more variables in there like, do we have 4 players eating up 50% of our cap and bounced in the 1st round the last 5 years in a row and our best player and arguably the 2nd or 3rd best player in the world leaving us in 1.5 seasons, the answer would be “No, thank you, we’re good on Michael Bunting.” However, if you were offering Tyler Bertuzzi, a guy who hasn’t benefitted from playing with $20m line mates for the duration of his 18 month career sporting inflated production, the answer would be, “Yes, we would.”

Agree on Sebrango. But every now and again he has a game where you think he is that perfect Hjmarlson guy. Or he makes a superb elite play. 3rd pair for sure, but I can't get a read on if there is more there, consistently. I have mixed feelings.

Biuim is at least 2 to 3 years away, but might be one of those Rafalski type super late bloomers. I haven't seen enough, but what I have seen is a REALLY smart player who only has the physical ability to match the smarts sometimes. Physicality can be gained over time, smarts like Biuim is much harder to learn or teach. I see him as a 28 year old 2D or an NHL never been. Still got a couple years.

Yes the Wings would consider it. Bertuzzi is better though, despite limited analytics. Bunting puts similar numbers up on a better team. Much better team the last few years. Bertuzzi put his numbers up on a team with limited/only 1 legit top 4 D that can move the puck. Huge difference where you start with the puck on offense and how much you have to back check. Bunting also plays with one of the best playmakers (take your pick amongst Tavares or Marner) and one of the best 2 goal scorers right now.