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Forums/Armchair-GM

Who Says No

Created by: TheeDjeeEem
Team: 2022-23 Toronto Maple Leafs
Initial Creation Date: Dec. 23, 2022
Published: Dec. 23, 2022
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Description
TDL and Van is well out of it, selling Bo et al

This roster can actually win playoff series
Trades
1.
VAN
  1. Muzzin, Jake
  2. Niemelä, Topi
  3. 2023 3rd round pick (TOR)
  4. 2023 3rd round pick (OTT)
2.
TOR
  1. Roslovic, Jack ($2,000,000 retained)
Additional Details:
Not a rental
CBJ
  1. 2023 1st round pick (TOR)
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2023
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
2024
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the OTT
2025
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
23$82,500,000$79,942,913$212,500$850,000$2,557,087
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$950,000$950,000
LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$11,640,250$11,640,250
C
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$10,903,000$10,903,000
RW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Vancouver Canucks
$950,000$950,000 (Performance Bonus$850,000$850K)
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$11,000,000$11,000,000
C, LW
NMC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$6,962,366$6,962,366
RW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$3,500,000$3,500,000
LW, C, RW
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$0$0
C, RW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,250,000$2,250,000
RW, LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,100,000$2,100,000
RW, C, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$900,000$900,000
RW, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,500,000$1,500,000
C
UFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$7,500,000$7,500,000
LD
NMC
UFA - 8
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,000,000$5,000,000
LD/RD
NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$4,687,500$4,687,500
G
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,400,000$1,400,000
RD
RFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,800,000$1,800,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,400,000$1,400,000
LD
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$850,000$850,000
RD
RFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$800,000$800,000
LD
UFA - 2
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,000,000$2,000,000
RD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$796,667$796,667
LW, RW
RFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$840,630$840,630
LW, RW
UFA - 1

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Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:05 p.m.
#1
19 lotteries, 0 wins
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accept
TheeDjeeEem liked this.
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:05 p.m.
#2
Luguber
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Canucks says no imo, too cheap of a return for Kuzmenko and the added ball and chain of Muzzin.

I guess the Jackets say no aswell, with the retention there atleast.
remowilliams and majormoose007 liked this.
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:08 p.m.
#3
Hockey 1st Sens 2nd
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Columbus and Vancouver.
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Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:10 p.m.
#4
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Quoting: TCMonkey
Columbus and Vancouver.


y? they prolly won't receive better offers and this is what they need for their own futures to improve
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:11 p.m.
#5
mostly harmless
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Quoting: AndrewPawlack
accept

Multiple years of retention? I'm not so sure.

(Plus, there's stories floating around that Roz doesn't want to play in Canada at all.)
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:12 p.m.
#6
mostly harmless
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Quoting: TheeDjeeEem
they prolly won't receive better offers

Pro tip: if your argument starts out with an assertion like this, it is virtually inevitable that you're incorrect. Particularly since "better" is extremely subjective when it comes to NHL trades, since there are no fungible assets being moved.
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Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:18 p.m.
#7
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2M retention for 2years? I don't think they would do that for just a late round 1st, if they were a team like AZU who has all kinds of cap space its possible but they don't so I doubt they would send Roz with that retention for just a 1st
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:21 p.m.
#8
Ex Nucks fan
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Canucks don't want Muzzin
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:22 p.m.
#9
Dolzhenkov Is Coming
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Would definitely take that Roslovic deal. They've got Voronkov coming over next year, they could be adding a top tier center in the draft and with Roslovic's inconsistency getting a first for him would be amazing.
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Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:23 p.m.
#10
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Quoting: Viqsi
Pro tip: if your argument starts out with an assertion like this, it is virtually inevitable that you're incorrect. Particularly since "better" is extremely subjective when it comes to NHL trades, since there are no fungible assets being moved.


Pro tip huh? So you're a professional tipster? Seems like poor value by the following:

Amateur flip: if your argument includes the word fungible in an NHL trade forum you might want to make better assertions than not addressing the whole rest of the argument being made.

The offers fill Van and CBJ needs and most likely exceeds what any other team would offer them for assets they don't need for their future. Or maybe you can actually formulate something tangible stating otherwise? Like who exactly offers them what?

QED
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:27 p.m.
#11
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Quoting: Juiceman
Canucks don't want Muzzin


squinty smile: bc they're contending for a cup with their deep dcore?
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:28 p.m.
#12
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Quoting: Viqsi
Multiple years of retention? I'm not so sure.

(Plus, there's stories floating around that Roz doesn't want to play in Canada at all.)


He doesn't have any trade protection and will be a 3C on a potent offense
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:31 p.m.
#13
Ex Nucks fan
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Quoting: TheeDjeeEem
squinty smile: bc they're contending for a cup with their deep dcore?


I'm sure the Canucks want a 5 million dollar bandaid...
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:31 p.m.
#14
mostly harmless
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Quoting: TheeDjeeEem
Pro tip huh? So you're a professional tipster? Seems like poor value by the following:

Amateur flip: if your argument includes the word fungible in an NHL trade forum you might want to make better assertions than not addressing the whole rest of the argument being made.

...this is word salad, not a counterargument.

Quoting: TheeDjeeEem
The offers fill Van and CBJ needs

Can't speak to Vancouver, but the Jackets' big needs are quality centers and to not waste cap. We've got a lot of quality prospects already. So a 1st is nice, but not strictly a need. Roz's term is sufficiently short enough that it might work for the Jackets regardless, but it's not a no-brainer.

Quoting: TheeDjeeEem
and most likely exceeds what any other team would offer them

By what measure? That's why I brought up fungibility. A 1st doesn't automatically trump any other considerations.

Quoting: TheeDjeeEem
for assets they don't need for their future.

This is debatable.

Quoting: TheeDjeeEem
Or maybe you can actually formulate something tangible stating otherwise? Like who exactly offers them what?

Multiple times folks have offered high 2nds and adds for Roz without retention.

I'm not saying that your offer is a bad one. It's actually a fairly strong proposal. It's just not a no-brainer and you're not doing a good job of defending it.
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:32 p.m.
#15
mostly harmless
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Quoting: TheeDjeeEem
He doesn't have any trade protection and will be a 3C on a potent offense

He doesn't, but that might affect Toronto's interest if he's not going to be motivated to play out his contract there.
Dec. 23, 2022 at 5:35 p.m.
#16
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Quoting: Viqsi
...this is word salad, not a counterargument.


and yet you performed the task so well irregardless sarcasm
Dec. 23, 2022 at 6:38 p.m.
#17
LongtimeLeafsufferer
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Leafs have no interest in Roslovic especially at that price and his cap. Muzzin doesn't waive to the Canucks, never mind the Canucks want more than two thirds.
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Dec. 23, 2022 at 6:43 p.m.
#18
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Quoting: palhal
Leafs have no interest in Roslovic especially at that price and his cap. Muzzin doesn't waive to the Canucks, never mind the Canucks want more than two thirds.


tears of joy a 3C @ 2x2M is too much cap space?awesome face

Muzzin's career might be over so....

Van receives what becomes their best D prospect.... and 2 3rds in a deep draft... for a UFA winger
Dec. 23, 2022 at 6:46 p.m.
#19
LongtimeLeafsufferer
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Quoting: TheeDjeeEem
tears of joy a 3C 2x2M is too much cap space?awesome face

Muzzin's career might be over so....

Van receives what becomes their best D prospect.... and 2 3rds in a deep draft... for a UFA winger


Let's imagine Muzzin's career is over. So what's the purpose of including him in the trade. Totally meaningless.l
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Dec. 23, 2022 at 6:54 p.m.
#20
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Quoting: palhal
Let's imagine Muzzin's career is over. So what's the purpose of including him in the trade. Totally meaningless.l


Because it adds value to TOR who are handing over a very valuable prospect and teams receive insurance money for injured players
Dec. 23, 2022 at 7:58 p.m.
#21
PDG over PDO
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Canucks pass, we can get a better package for Kuzmenko
Dec. 23, 2022 at 8:00 p.m.
#22
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Quoting: theleano1
Canucks pass, we can get a better package for Kuzmenko


Like?

And whats JT Miller worth?
Dec. 23, 2022 at 8:04 p.m.
#23
PDG over PDO
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Quoting: TheeDjeeEem
Like?

And whats JT Miller worth?


We atleast can atleast get a 1st and a b prospect, cap space is so king in the leauge that him being only on his elc increases his value a lot, as for Miller, mangment probably still holds him to a 1st and a good prospect
Dec. 23, 2022 at 8:37 p.m.
#24
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Quoting: theleano1
We atleast can atleast get a 1st and a b prospect, cap space is so king in the leauge that him being only on his elc increases his value a lot, as for Miller, mangment probably still holds him to a 1st and a good prospect


Kuz will be a UFA on a cheap deal now with no track record in NHL

Niemelä is an A-/B+ prospect buddy

2 '23 3rds ~= next years late 1st ...take your pick

JT is worth a 1st despite needing a 1st to dump his bad deal in 4 years?
Dec. 23, 2022 at 8:39 p.m.
#25
Ex Nucks fan
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Quoting: TheeDjeeEem
Kuz will be a UFA on a cheap deal now with no track record in NHL

Niemelä is an A-/B+ prospect buddy

2 '23 3rds ~= next years late 1st ...take your pick

JT is worth a 1st despite needing a 1st to dump his bad deal in 4 years?


Wow, it is almost like his value now is completely different than his value in 4 years from now. Mind boggling isn't it
 
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