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Purging CHawks

Created by: Ross_Johnston
Team: 2022-23 Edmonton Oilers
Initial Creation Date: Jan. 12, 2023
Published: Jan. 12, 2023
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Trades
1.
EDM
  1. Domi, Max ($1,500,000 retained)
  2. McCabe, Jake
  3. Raddysh, Taylor
  4. 2024 7th round pick (CHI)
CHI
  1. Broberg, Philip
  2. Foegele, Warren
  3. Puljujärvi, Jesse
  4. 2023 1st round pick (EDM)
  5. 2024 2nd round pick (EDM)
2.
Buyouts
Retained Salary Transactions
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2023
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the EDM
2024
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the CHI
2025
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the EDM
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
22$82,500,000$80,094,833$896,000$850,000$2,405,167
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$8,500,000$8,500,000
C, LW
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$12,500,000$12,500,000
C
NMC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$5,125,000$5,125,000
LW, RW
NMC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$5,125,000$5,125,000
LW, C
NMC
UFA - 7
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$5,500,000$5,500,000
RW, LW
NMC
UFA - 6
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$1,250,000$1,250,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$1,500,000$1,500,000
C, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$3,100,000$3,100,000
RW
RFA - 2
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$750,000$750,000
LW, RW
RFA - 1
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$1,250,000$1,250,000
C, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$798,000$798,000
C
RFA - 1
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$758,333$758,333
RW
RFA - 2
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$9,250,000$9,250,000
LD
NMC
UFA - 8
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$3,250,000$3,250,000
RD
UFA - 3
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$5,000,000$5,000,000
G
M-NTC
UFA - 5
Logo of the Chicago Blackhawks
$2,000,000$2,000,000
LD/RD
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$863,333$863,333 (Performance Bonus$850,000$850K)
RD
RFA - 1
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$2,750,000$2,750,000
LD/RD
UFA - 4
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,500,000$3,500,000
RD
UFA - 3
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$750,000$750,000
G
UFA - 1
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$762,500$762,500
LD
UFA - 2
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$4,167,000$4,167,000
LD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$750,000$750,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Edmonton Oilers
$2,200,000$2,200,000
G
UFA - 1

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Jan. 12, 2023 at 2:51 p.m.
#1
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Ya the habs would much rather have savard than barrie and lavioe isnt worth anything
Jan. 12, 2023 at 2:52 p.m.
#2
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Quoting: Black61
Ya the habs would much rather have savard than barrie and lavioe isnt worth anything


Habs don't have a dman for the PP and have several defensive defencemen
Jan. 12, 2023 at 3:00 p.m.
#3
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Quoting: stephane_robidas
Habs don't have a dman for the PP and have several defensive defencemen


when they actually need a pp quarterback barrie will no longer be under contract so not really any point. Savard will get moved for futures if he is dealt.
Jan. 12, 2023 at 3:07 p.m.
#4
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Edmonton declines both, and it's not close.

- Broberg and the 2023 1st are the most valuable pieces in the Chicago trade. There's not nearly enough value coming back to justify giving up the two best assets in the deal.

- Barrie is on pace for nearly 60 points this year and is playing the best 2-way hockey of his career. Meanwhile Savard doesn't defend very well anymore and never did bring any offense.
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Jan. 12, 2023 at 3:29 p.m.
#5
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Quoting: stephane_robidas
Habs don't have a dman for the PP and have several defensive defencemen


Barries "skill" is existing on the pp with mcdavid and draisaitl the majority of his pp points arent primary points and that shows in his lack of ES production
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Jan. 12, 2023 at 3:50 p.m.
#6
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Hawks decline. Change the 2024 2nd to the 2024 1st, and swap Broberg for either Schaffer or Bourgault, and the Hawks probably agree.
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Jan. 12, 2023 at 4:15 p.m.
#7
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Quoting: CD282
Edmonton declines both, and it's not close.

- Broberg and the 2023 1st are the most valuable pieces in the Chicago trade. There's not nearly enough value coming back to justify giving up the two best assets in the deal.

- Barrie is on pace for nearly 60 points this year and is playing the best 2-way hockey of his career. Meanwhile Savard doesn't defend very well anymore and never did bring any offense.


Meanwhile, Foegele is about a cap dump and JP isn't far behind

Barrie also is scoring all those points on the PP with McD and Drais...he's benefiting from those guys and at the same time defensively is not good. As fans, we get caught up in point production and when it comes to defenders, unless they are truly driving scoring and as much in 5on5, than it simply doesn't make up for bad defending.
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Jan. 12, 2023 at 5:02 p.m.
#8
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Quoting: stephane_robidas
Habs don't have a dman for the PP and have several defensive defencemen


Montreal has Savard to eat (get killed) in tough minutes to protect prospects. And play RD, since he and Kovacevic are the only RD regulars, and Kovacevic isn't an NHL regular on a non-rebuilding team. They don't need a PP D-man because they're rebuilding. Plus he's the only regular Francophone skater other than Drouin (who at best will stick with the team until the end of the season), which is a big deal to the market. They aren't trading him.

Barrie can't play tough minutes anyway and he'd probably look in Montreal like Klingberg has looked in Anaheim.
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Jan. 12, 2023 at 5:52 p.m.
#9
Mac1010
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Quoting: ChiHawk
Meanwhile, Foegele is about a cap dump and JP isn't far behind

Barrie also is scoring all those points on the PP with McD and Drais...he's benefiting from those guys and at the same time defensively is not good. As fans, we get caught up in point production and when it comes to defenders, unless they are truly driving scoring and as much in 5on5, than it simply doesn't make up for bad defending.


as fans we also get caught up in how a player is portrayed or labelled. yes barrie will never be fantastic at defending. what he can do and has done is almost every year he has a positive goal share as well as positive in virtually every other metric at 5 on 5 for years. His powerplay production has been pretty consistent over his whole career showing its not just mcD and Dri. it just simply shows how people get one view of a player and can never see them in any other way....
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Jan. 12, 2023 at 6:40 p.m.
#10
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Quoting: ChiHawk
Meanwhile, Foegele is about a cap dump and JP isn't far behind

Barrie also is scoring all those points on the PP with McD and Drais...he's benefiting from those guys and at the same time defensively is not good. As fans, we get caught up in point production and when it comes to defenders, unless they are truly driving scoring and as much in 5on5, than it simply doesn't make up for bad defending.

Stop with the stupid narrative and read my post again. He's NOT "bad at defending" at all, that's utter bull****. He has posted positive GF% Rels at 5v5 in 9 of the 10 most recent seasons, including this one. Savard, meanwhile, has been negative for 4 seasons in a row, and 5 of the past 6.
Jan. 12, 2023 at 6:50 p.m.
#11
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Habs trade is more than fair but I might decline simply for the fact that Savard is a hometown guy who signed in MTL as a UFA. That is more valuable to me and to some of the fanbase than getting Barrie for the PP.
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Jan. 12, 2023 at 7:49 p.m.
#12
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Quoting: CD282
Stop with the stupid narrative and read my post again. He's NOT "bad at defending" at all, that's utter bull****. He has posted positive GF% Rels at 5v5 in 9 of the 10 most recent seasons, including this one. Savard, meanwhile, has been negative for 4 seasons in a row, and 5 of the past 6.


It's not "stupid" watch him on the ice play. Barrie isn't good defensively...doesn't mean he's terrible but he's not good.

Did I compare him for to Savard?
Jan. 12, 2023 at 7:51 p.m.
#13
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Quoting: mm1010
as fans we also get caught up in how a player is portrayed or labelled. yes barrie will never be fantastic at defending. what he can do and has done is almost every year he has a positive goal share as well as positive in virtually every other metric at 5 on 5 for years. His powerplay production has been pretty consistent over his whole career showing its not just mcD and Dri. it just simply shows how people get one view of a player and can never see them in any other way....


His PP ability on the point is not the issue, but he's rather one dimensional. As long as he is sheltered with a very good defensive pairing you can utilize him, but let's not pretend he has a ton of value being more one dimensional then a coach or GM would like out of defensive player be it a PP QB or not.
Jan. 12, 2023 at 8:00 p.m.
#14
Go Habs Go
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Quoting: Burnout
Montreal has Savard to eat (get killed) in tough minutes to protect prospects. And play RD, since he and Kovacevic are the only RD regulars, and Kovacevic isn't an NHL regular on a non-rebuilding team. They don't need a PP D-man because they're rebuilding. Plus he's the only regular Francophone skater other than Drouin (who at best will stick with the team until the end of the season), which is a big deal to the market. They aren't trading him.

Barrie can't play tough minutes anyway and he'd probably look in Montreal like Klingberg has looked in Anaheim.


This. Savard is needed to take tough minutes. Barrie can't handle a high defensive load, that's just not who he is. Barrie would be better than Savard for about 2 minutes a game. The other 18-20 minutes, Savard is the better choice.
Jan. 13, 2023 at 7:42 a.m.
#15
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Quoting: ChiHawk
It's not "stupid" watch him on the ice play. Barrie isn't good defensively...doesn't mean he's terrible but he's not good.

Did I compare him for to Savard?


It is stupid, because it ignores the facts. You wrote "defensively is not good" and "bad defending" and now you're walking that back I see.

And the trade is Barrie for Savard so if you didn't make that comp that's just more stupidity from you, because it's the whole point of the conversation.
Jan. 13, 2023 at 8:21 a.m.
#16
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Quoting: CD282
Stop with the stupid narrative and read my post again. He's NOT "bad at defending" at all, that's utter bull****. He has posted positive GF% Rels at 5v5 in 9 of the 10 most recent seasons, including this one. Savard, meanwhile, has been negative for 4 seasons in a row, and 5 of the past 6.


How does GF% equate to good defensive play? Savard is a defensive dman and is utilized and trusted in defensive situations much more heavily than Barrie. That's not saying one is better than the other, they play completely different roles though. So, I'm just not sure how that comparison is even related, let alone how the statistic you cited supports your argument.

And I am genuinely asking, because maybe I'm missing something.
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Jan. 13, 2023 at 9:15 a.m.
#17
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Quoting: Garak
How does GF% equate to good defensive play? Savard is a defensive dman and is utilized and trusted in defensive situations much more heavily than Barrie. That's not saying one is better than the other, they play completely different roles though. So, I'm just not sure how that comparison is even related, let alone how the statistic you cited supports your argument.

And I am genuinely asking, because maybe I'm missing something.

You win hockey games on goal differential. It's the single most critical contribution to winning, not offense, not defense, but the combination of both. That's why I'm not interested in this trade proposal - Savard loses his minutes year after year, while Barrie wins his year after year.

If you want to look at the defensive side only, here are some 5v5 numbers from this season and last combined:

GA/60
Barrie: 2.47
Savard: 3.26

xGA/60
Barrie: 2.60
Savard: 3.00

SCA/60
Barrie: 27.48
Savard: 34.20

HDCA/60
Barrie: 10.68
Savard: 12.84

Defensive Zone Faceoffs/60
Barrie: 18.14
Savard: 19.32

So Savard's defensive stats are between 15% and 32% worse despite getting just 6.5% more D zone faceoffs.
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Jan. 13, 2023 at 10:07 a.m.
#18
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Quoting: CD282
You win hockey games on goal differential. It's the single most critical contribution to winning, not offense, not defense, but the combination of both. That's why I'm not interested in this trade proposal - Savard loses his minutes year after year, while Barrie wins his year after year.

If you want to look at the defensive side only, here are some 5v5 numbers from this season and last combined:

GA/60
Barrie: 2.47
Savard: 3.26

xGA/60
Barrie: 2.60
Savard: 3.00

SCA/60
Barrie: 27.48
Savard: 34.20

HDCA/60
Barrie: 10.68
Savard: 12.84

Defensive Zone Faceoffs/60
Barrie: 18.14
Savard: 19.32

So Savard's defensive stats are between 15% and 32% worse despite getting just 6.5% more D zone faceoffs.


Oh ok. I see what you were getting at now.
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Jan. 13, 2023 at 10:39 a.m.
#19
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Quoting: CD282
It is stupid, because it ignores the facts. You wrote "defensively is not good" and "bad defending" and now you're walking that back I see.

And the trade is Barrie for Savard so if you didn't make that comp that's just more stupidity from you, because it's the whole point of the conversation.


Wow, the name calling continues; emotional much?

I did not compare the two of them, I simply commented on Barrie and what kind of player he is and which YOU responded to. I'm not comparing the 2 players in the context, simply what Barrie is worth when you extract the fact he's putting up career level points, mostly drive on the PP with McD and Drais and that defensively, he is still not considered a good defender.

You can wax poetic all you want with advanced analytics, but the reality is, they will never extract a player from the team around him and the competition he faces as widely discussed by the pros and the reason why the pros still rely on the eye test. Barrie defensively is still not very good as I originally said. PERIOD

It's simple...follow along.
Jan. 13, 2023 at 11:51 a.m.
#20
Mac1010
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Quoting: ChiHawk
His PP ability on the point is not the issue, but he's rather one dimensional. As long as he is sheltered with a very good defensive pairing you can utilize him, but let's not pretend he has a ton of value being more one dimensional then a coach or GM would like out of defensive player be it a PP QB or not.


once again no one is saying he is a top pair defenseman. and most defense are pretty one dimensional when you think of it. some are great at defending horrible offensively or they are great offensively horrible defensively. really only the great players can do both. so teams need a mix of both. Barrie has been very consistent over his career and has value. he is far from a cap dump that people like to think he is.
Jan. 13, 2023 at 12:09 p.m.
#21
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Quoting: mm1010
once again no one is saying he is a top pair defenseman. and most defense are pretty one dimensional when you think of it. some are great at defending horrible offensively or they are great offensively horrible defensively. really only the great players can do both. so teams need a mix of both. Barrie has been very consistent over his career and has value. he is far from a cap dump that people like to think he is.


The gap between offensive d men and stay at home d men is usually not as wide as it is in the case of Barrie. Erik Karlsson as example is more balanced despite being slanted more towards offense.

That said, as I noted in a earlier comment, Barrie's defensive stats are a result of his pairing and the team around him filling in that defensive gap...that's what good coaches do is make adjustments to play to a player's strength and use the scheme and other players to match together to overcome the player's individual deficiencies.

My point with Barrie is he's not good defensively if you watch him. While he's not "awful" he's not good. Offensively he's good, but his numbers are highly inflated by the PP and playing with Drais and McD who are arguable two of the best PP players in the league.

I'm not saying Barrie is worthless for the record in a trade, but another post mentioned he has 30 points and my comment was to quantify why and to also note his defense is below average....giving a balanced picture of who Barrie is meaning; he's not EK. In the right scheme and right pairing, he can be just fine, but let's not pretend he's EK.
Jan. 13, 2023 at 12:25 p.m.
#22
Mac1010
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Quoting: ChiHawk
The gap between offensive d men and stay at home d men is usually not as wide as it is in the case of Barrie. Erik Karlsson as example is more balanced despite being slanted more towards offense.

That said, as I noted in a earlier comment, Barrie's defensive stats are a result of his pairing and the team around him filling in that defensive gap...that's what good coaches do is make adjustments to play to a player's strength and use the scheme and other players to match together to overcome the player's individual deficiencies.

My point with Barrie is he's not good defensively if you watch him. While he's not "awful" he's not good. Offensively he's good, but his numbers are highly inflated by the PP and playing with Drais and McD who are arguable two of the best PP players in the league.

I'm not saying Barrie is worthless for the record in a trade, but another post mentioned he has 30 points and my comment was to quantify why and to also note his defense is below average....giving a balanced picture of who Barrie is meaning; he's not EK. In the right scheme and right pairing, he can be just fine, but let's not pretend he's EK.


So comparing Barrie to EK is like comparing jones to hedman they are an entirely different class of defenseman. (yes i know EK had a couple rough years after injury and trade but i would suggest those are the outlier not the norm)

I am not sure if you have watched the oilers much or not. they have tried Nurse and Bouchard on the PP with MCd and Dri and they struggle so to suggest barrie is only being propt up by them is foolish. Yes he plays with great players on arguably the best performing PP in NHL history but he is a significant part to it. if he wasn't he would have already been traded and bouchard taken his spot.

people think you can put who ever with those 2 and they will produce that is simply not the case and winger after winger has shown that.

I would also suggest barrie helps out his line and partner while he may struggle breaking up a cycle he is great at moving the puck and getting it to his forwards.

Still not sure why you are bringing up EK makes no sense and no one is ever making that comparison. now if you want to compare to savard which is who this trade was for we can have that discussion.
where i will stick with barrie for what he brings on the PP and 5 on 5 over what savard has done. you can look at @CD282 for that.
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Jan. 13, 2023 at 3:08 p.m.
#23
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Quoting: mm1010
So comparing Barrie to EK is like comparing jones to hedman they are an entirely different class of defenseman. (yes i know EK had a couple rough years after injury and trade but i would suggest those are the outlier not the norm)

I am not sure if you have watched the oilers much or not. they have tried Nurse and Bouchard on the PP with MCd and Dri and they struggle so to suggest barrie is only being propt up by them is foolish. Yes he plays with great players on arguably the best performing PP in NHL history but he is a significant part to it. if he wasn't he would have already been traded and bouchard taken his spot.

people think you can put who ever with those 2 and they will produce that is simply not the case and winger after winger has shown that.

I would also suggest barrie helps out his line and partner while he may struggle breaking up a cycle he is great at moving the puck and getting it to his forwards.

Still not sure why you are bringing up EK makes no sense and no one is ever making that comparison. now if you want to compare to savard which is who this trade was for we can have that discussion.
where i will stick with barrie for what he brings on the PP and 5 on 5 over what savard has done. you can look at CD282 for that.


Apologies you missed the context of my reference to EK but is based on your comment thinking D men are either offensive or defensive when the truth is the best ones do both well. The one dimensional guys don't. That's the comparison refuting your point.

I'm not bringing Savard into the comparison for the simple reason I mentioned to you above; another post mentioned he has 30 points and my comment was to quantify why and to also note his defense is below average....giving a balanced picture of who Barrie is meaning; he's not EK. In other words, just giving a full perspective on what Barrie is and isn't which is fair. Comparing Barrie to Savard is apples and oranges I'm sure you are aware, and not going to comment on it as such; it's subjective at best.

Barrie is more like Erik Gustafsson; great offensive d-man and PP player, but struggles at times defensively and needs to be sheltered defensively in order for him to make sense on the team. 60 points in 78 games at one point, 25 points in 43 games this season on not nearly as good as a PP as the Oilers and yet, Gus isn't a cap dump but isn't worth a ton in terms of trade value despite point production because of his defense deficiencies. I do believe Barrie is slightly better defensively then Gus, but Gus is slightly better offensively...similar players overall.
 
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