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2022-23 NHL Season Discussion Thread #9: Bruce, There it Goes

Jan. 28 at 11:02 p.m.
#351
Db1899
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Quoting: Brian2016
Good players don't sign $9.15M AAV contracts. That's the problem. He was paid to be elite.


barzal is elite, he can't control who he plays with

your defense take isn't aging too well
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Jan. 28 at 11:03 p.m.
#352
Juiceman
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Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
That's funny because that's literally what Reilly is, except you could argue he's not even a 3rd pairing defender.


He isn't even that bad, he is just overpaid and underperforming
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Jan. 28 at 11:03 p.m.
#353
Db1899
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Quoting: Brian2016
Good players don't sign $9.15M AAV contracts. That's the problem. He was paid to be elite.


these are micro stats, not even analytics. Seems like he's pretty elite


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Jan. 28 at 11:04 p.m.
#354
KSIxSKULLS
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Quoting: Juiceman
He isn't even that bad, he is just overpaid and underperforming


Honestly I can see Boston doing the same thing again this year. It's not a coincidence they are doing so well while having so many players on expiring deals. Let's see how good Sweeney really is with who he resigns and for how much.
Jan. 28 at 11:05 p.m.
#355
Brian2016
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Quoting: Db1899
you're embellishing because you know you you can't come up with a rational argument - Can you prove I "flipped out on your back" ?- I don't flip out on anything on this site because I don't engage in something if I don't know what i'm talking about.

I want the isles to miss the playoffs, I'm not mad about it at all. The word bias is going to start losing it's meaning with you throwing it out there any chance you can. I don't root for the sabres, I have no dog in the fight


You began by stating a personal opinion - Quinn is better than Mercer - as fact. After you realized that several people found that opinion troubling, you changed up and said he'll be better in the future - impossible to argue against.
Jan. 28 at 11:05 p.m.
#356
aadoyle
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Quoting: Brian2016
He scored 60 points last season. He's way more physical. His cap hit and versatility makes him the most valuable Blue. Jarnkrok has never come close to 40 points and likely won't get there this season despite exposure to several elite offensive players. Barbashev is also gonna get a big raise this summer, while Jarnkrok just signed for $2.1M AAV. If Barbashevbrings the same return as Jarnkrok last year, all that says is that CGY way overpaid.


Teams look at this years results more. We all know last years was a fluke that was never gonna get repeated. Should have traded him in the summer if we go by that,

I see Barbashev going for a 2nd and 3rd based on recent trends especially if his new team works on an extension but lets see
Jan. 28 at 11:06 p.m.
#357
Db1899
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Quoting: Juiceman
42 points in 50 games isn't too bad considering he is playing with literal dud wingers. His offense is lower than most years, however he has a poor supporting cast. He isn't McDavid that can carry AHL depth to a conference final


He has the worst wingers of any 1st line center in the NHL and it isn't close. He still creates a ton in transition, his wingers just can't finish

this was from tonight, sets up beauvllier who puts into the goalies chest



Jan. 28 at 11:07 p.m.
#358
Brian2016
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Quoting: aadoyle
Teams look at this years results more. We all know last years was a fluke that was never gonna get repeated. Should have traded him in the summer if we go by that,

I see Barbashev going for a 2nd and 3rd based on recent trends especially if his new team works on an extension but lets see


If that ends up being the case than CGY got fleeced far worse than I thought.
Jan. 28 at 11:07 p.m.
#359
KSIxSKULLS
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Quoting: aadoyle
Teams look at this years results more. We all know last years was a fluke that was never gonna get repeated. Should have traded him in the summer if we go by that,

I see Barbashev going for a 2nd and 3rd based on recent trends especially if his new team works on an extension but lets see


Gotta think Barbashev will go for more than that based on his contract. He's only making 2.25 Million which is like what, 800-900k in cap space come trade deadline? The super tight cap teams could easily take that on. Gotta increase his value. Could see him getting a 1st tbh. Especially with how close these playoff/bubble teams are and with the teams wanting a slight edge wherever they can get one.
Jan. 28 at 11:08 p.m.
#360
Db1899
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Quoting: Brian2016
You began by stating a personal opinion - Quinn is better than Mercer - as fact. After you realized that several people found that opinion troubling, you changed up and said he'll be better in the future - impossible to argue against.


no I'm saying that Quinn is better right now and will be in the future. There's a much better argument that Quinn is better than Mercer. if you want to talk about bias...I can actually prove that Quinn is having the better season, there really isn't a good argument that mercer is outplaying Quinn
Jan. 28 at 11:10 p.m.
#361
KSIxSKULLS
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Quoting: Db1899
no I'm saying that Quinn is better right now and will be in the future. There's a much better argument that Quinn is better than Mercer. if you want to talk about bias...I can actually prove that Quinn is having the better season, there really isn't a good argument that mercer is outplaying Quinn


He's playing tougher minutes and outproducing him (which is really what matters at the end of the day). Maybe Quinn will be better one day, but him having good advanced stats while playing 4th line TOI isn't an indicator of it.
Jan. 28 at 11:10 p.m.
#362
Brian2016
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Quoting: Db1899
no I'm saying that Quinn is better right now and will be in the future. There's a much better argument that Quinn is better than Mercer. if you want to talk about bias...I can actually prove that Quinn is having the better season, there really isn't a good argument that mercer is outplaying Quinn


You get an A for persistence. I'm not gonna argue the color of the sky either.
Jan. 28 at 11:11 p.m.
#363
Brian2016
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Good evening everyone. Thank you all for the invaluable insights.
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Jan. 28 at 11:12 p.m.
#364
ARMCHAIRGMOFTHEYEAR
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My personal Top 10 D-Man Rankings RIGHT NOW:

1. Adam Fox
2. Lettuce Makar
3. Parker Wotherspoon
4. Josh Morrissey
5. Rasmus Ristolainen
6. Charlie McAvoy
7. Roman Josi
8. Sebastion Aho
9. Scott Morrow
10. Cam York
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Jan. 28 at 11:13 p.m.
#365
Juiceman
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Quoting: Db1899
He has the worst wingers of any 1st line center in the NHL and it isn't close. He still creates a ton in transition, his wingers just can't finish

this was from tonight, sets up beauvllier who puts into the goalies chest





Reminds me of when Bo Horvat was superglued to Loui Eriksson and Tanner Pearson, Jake Virtanen, and Sven Baertschi for a good chunk of his career
Jan. 28 at 11:13 p.m.
#366
Juiceman
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Quoting: ARMCHAIRGMOFTHEYEAR
My personal Top 10 D-Man Rankings RIGHT NOW:

1. Adam Fox
2. Lettuce Makar
3. Parker Wotherspoon
4. Josh Morrissey
5. Rasmus Ristolainen
6. Charlie McAvoy
7. Roman Josi
8. Sebastion Aho
9. Scott Morrow
10. Cam York


Wrong. Tyler Myers clears. Is anybody else in this list 6'8? Didn't think so
Jan. 28 at 11:14 p.m.
#367
Db1899
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Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
He's playing tougher minutes and outproducing him (which is really what matters at the end of the day). Maybe Quinn will be better one day, but him having good advanced stats while playing 4th line TOI isn't an indicator of it.


Mercer is not playing tougher minutes. Mercer's QOC IS 49%, Quinn's 52% . Mercer isn't getting that much more ice time than Quinn.

So you think Suzuki has been better than dach this season just because he's outproducing him (despite being worse at most other aspects of the game)
Jan. 28 at 11:15 p.m.
#368
SnakeDelilah
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Quoting: Db1899
these are micro stats, not even analytics. Seems like he's pretty elite




if that point production is out of 200 then i agree
Jan. 28 at 11:16 p.m.
#369
Db1899
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Quoting: Brian2016
You get an A for persistence. I'm not gonna argue the color of the sky either.


the difference between me and you is I would admit im wrong if you can prove me wrong with facts, you're stating your opinion. That holds a lot less weight when I can present multiple stats that show Quinn is the better player.
Jan. 28 at 11:16 p.m.
#370
KSIxSKULLS
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Quoting: Db1899
Mercer is not playing tougher minutes. Mercer's QOC IS 49%, Quinn's 52% . Mercer isn't getting that much more ice time than Quinn.

So you think Suzuki has been better than dach this season just because he's outproducing him (despite being worse at most other aspects of the game)


I think Suzuki has been better defensively yes, if we're talking about creating offensive chances? no. but I'm taking the player who translates those stats into actual impact. Give me Suzuki if we're talking from the start of the season to now. If we are talking about who I'm taking tonight; it's Dach based on how he's been playing recently.
Jan. 28 at 11:17 p.m.
#371
Db1899
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Quoting: SnakeDelilah
if that point production is out of 200 then i agree


didn't know point production was debatable.
Jan. 28 at 11:18 p.m.
#372
Juiceman
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Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
I think Suzuki has been better defensively yes, if we're talking about creating offensive chances? no. but I'm taking the player who translates those stats into actual impact. Give me Suzuki if we're talking from the start of the season to now. If we are talking about who I'm taking tonight; it's Dach based on how he's been playing recently.


Suzuki is actually very bad defensively lol. At the beginning of the season Habs fans told me Suzuki could be Selke level soon and I kind of believed them but his defense is not good. Dach is better defensively
Jan. 28 at 11:18 p.m.
#373
Db1899
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Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
I think Suzuki has been better defensively yes, if we're talking about creating offensive chances? no. but I'm taking the player who translates those stats into actual impact. Give me Suzuki if we're talking from the start of the season to now. If we are talking about who I'm taking tonight; it's Dach based on how he's been playing recently.


Suzuki hasn't been good defensively in like 3 years. He's running on reputation and work ethic at this point. Suzuki is a good player but he was getting lucky/benefiting from playing with caufield
Jan. 28 at 11:19 p.m.
#374
Juiceman
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Quoting: SnakeDelilah
if that point production is out of 200 then i agree


83% for 0.84 points per game.
Jan. 28 at 11:19 p.m.
#375
KSIxSKULLS
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Quoting: Juiceman
Suzuki is actually very bad defensively lol. At the beginning of the season Habs fans told me Suzuki could be Selke level soon and I kind of believed them but his defense is not good. Dach is better defensively


From the eye test, that makes absolutely no sense. Dach usually floats in the defensive zone while Suzuki actually battles for the puck and such. I wonder what metric causes that to mean Dach would be better. Very interesting.
 
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