Sorry but Laf isn't worth 2 unprotected 1sts and a 2nd/top 5 prospect in our system. I think maybe look at a Dach type of deal which is a mid to late 1st.

I might have overpaid but yeah maybe less! (CGY pick has already ruling)

Hm tempting offer

Right, I forgot the Flames pick was protected, still wouldn't give up 2 1sts and Farrell though. Laf isn't worth more than Dach was, so it would be the Flames pick straight up for Laf IMO

I understand what you did, overpay with a possibility of having a bit less to pay in real life. Still, not a bad deal to get Laf, and would probably get NYR to move him.

Hopefully he would become the player he was supposed to be when he got drafted.

Hang on a second... I know it's a lot, but what are you getting.

1) We get the best player in the deal
2) We get a player who fits our timeline
3) We get a hometown hero
4) We get a proven NHL player over a bunch of unknowns
5) We get to accelerate just enough that 2025 is not gonna be that important for us at the draft

I think I would do a deal very similar to this one for Laf if it were ever on the table.

1. Is he the best player in the deal? Farrell is blowing away the competition in the NCAA, he may be under sized but it's not like he is playing against younger, weaker/less developed players in junior hockey either. Laf has struggled over 3 years in the NHL, so is he really providing NY with much more value than a 1st round pick? Even if the Rags aren't rebuilding getting another 1st gives them more assets to trade to help improve their roster for playoff runs over the next 3-5 years. Also considering the Rags only have one 2nd and one 3rd in the first 4 rounds over the next 3 years they could use a 1st to avoid completely decimating their prospect pool.

2. Farrell fits our timeline just fine, he is expected to be signed this year and start in Laval next season them be in the Habs lineup the following season.

3. How many struggling home town heros have actually worked out for the Habs? It's still a huge risk for Montreal that he won't progress any further.

4. Yes he is a proven NHL player but so is Armia, that doesn't mean we should break the bank to acquire him.

5. The 2025 draft isn't going to be that important in our rebuild as it stands now. There was an article last week or the week before ranking how close the top 5 rebuilding teams were to contending, Montreal was ranked 2nd on that list (I can't recall who was 1st sorry) based on prospect pool, draft capitol and team composition. In 23-24 with a healthy lineup the Habs should be able to finish in the 6-12 last range, in 24-25 they should be a bubble or WC team. Even with Laf this is not going to change much, if at all.

You want Laffy that bad, the cost is both 2023 1st round picks, 2024 1st round pick plus Xhekaj. Ranger will throw in a free serving of Poutine for the entire team.

Thanks for the thorough response. Let me return the favor:

1. Farrell is playing really well at the Junior level. So did Lafreniere if you recall (112 pts in 2019-2020). Performance in College/Junior is not always an indicator of expected performance in the NHL. Laf plays a better 2 way game than Farrell will IMO and has many more physical gifts.

2. Agreed. Farrell & Lafreniere are in fact the same age. One has been dominating Junior and one has been playing 2 leagues above in the NHL and contributing if not dominating.

3. Fair enough. But they didn't have the Habs secret weapon either: Chantal Machabee!

4. I do not get the comparison. When Laf was 20 he put up better points than Armia's best ever season. Now that he's 21 he's gonna end the year 10 points up on last year. He still has 4 more years to go before hitting his prime. So Laf has already shown more consistency in his first 3 years in the league than Armia has in his 8. I really appreciate you sir, but Armia was a poor choice for this argument.

5. Right now the Habs are "missing" 2 top 6 forwards, a top pair RHD, and a Goalie. Adding Laf removes one of those 4 missing pieces IMO... So it does change things. I do not believe Farrell will play in this top 6 anytime soon, but I hope I am wrong!

1. Farrell is in the NCAA, not junior hockey it's more on par with the AHL talent and development wise.

2. Again the NCAA is more in line with the AHL than junior hockey so dominating in the NCAA would be like dominating in Laval.

3. I don't think this is really a valid argument but even if I don't agree with it, I get your point here.

4. I wasn't comping the players just stating that just cause a player is in the NHL doesn't mean we should be overpaying them no matter where they were drafted or where they were born. If a player drafted 1st over all isn't performing 3 or 4 years into his NHL career, it starts to give the impression that they won't be the player they were expected to be. Does that mean they wo t ever put it together, no it just means that the team acquiring them is taking on just as much risk as the team trading them.

5. Suzuki, Caufield, Dach, Anderson and Gurianov are all top 6 forwards right now. Slaf is working his way there and then we have a whole slew of prospects and picks that could be top 6 forwards coming very soon. So I don't agree that we are 2 top 6 forwards short, an argument could be made for 1 short but not 2 IMO. RHD is another subject but even if we have no clear top pairing RHD right now we have 2 future top 4 RHD and Hutson plays the right side more than the left side so our future top pairing might be Guhle-Hutson with Harris-Barron as the 2nd pairing. As for goal tending, Monty has been great this year and could still develop into a starter or at 1B on a good tandem. We also have Dobes coming and I wouldn't rule out Primeau or the Habs signing Perets after the NCAA season.

Appreciate your response again sir!

1 & 2. Do you have any evidence to backup your assertion that NCAA is more like the AHL than the CHL? Everything I have ever read on the subject says otherwise and other than a few 4th years and a few top prospects, it seems like the majority of the guys who leave College hockey and don't retire end up in the AHL the ECHL or Europe.

3. Mad respect for Chantal!

4. I do not think it's fair to say Laf "isn't performing". He's been improving his point totals each year and he has another 4 years before he reaches his prime. Saying he's not performing would be like saying Dach is not performing. If the progress is not meeting your expectations... You might have had expectations that were not realistic. Very few players hit the NHL and start scoring at a ppg pace by age 21. Especially bigger body players, it can take them a while to grow into their bodies. Laf is gonna be a 30+ goal 60+ pts guy for a lot of years IMO.

5. Eer. Wouldn't it be more accurate to say, "we are hopeful and encouraged that Dach might be a top 6 but he has not proven anything yet?"

As for Gurianov & Anderson... I like them both, but they should not be on a top 6. They are secondary scorers at best (let them prove otherwise if they are not). You are not making it to the playoffs with both of those in your top 6. Maybe 1 as a #6.

1 & 2. When Montreal was first trying to figure out where it was best to send Caufield there were several articles debating the benefits of each league and most drew the conclusion that either path was acceptable but that the NCAA was coached in a heavier style. Here is a link to one such article

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/awinninghabit.com/2020/08/10/montreal-canadiens-big-ten-conference-news-cole-caufield/amp/

Here is a ranking of the world's top 10 hockey leagues

https://thehockeywriters.com/top-10-best-ice-hockey-leagues/

I can't find anyone like LeBrun or McKeen's ranking the leagues but I suspect the teirs would be similar.

3. That fair lol.

4. I didn't mean not performing, I meant underperformed thus far. My bad for the misrepresentation of my perspective. I agree that Laf still has the potential to be that type of player but can/will the Rags continue to wait on him to finally hit that level? I think management is becoming less and less enamoured with the idea than people realize. He was a healthy scratch and demoted him to the 4th line this year after all.

5. Dach is proving to be a top 6 player and how many more goals will Anderson have to score before you consider him a top 6 forward? I don't see very many 3rd or 4th line wingers scoring 20+ goals a year, there may be a couple but not many. Gurianov I will give you I guess. I also never accounted for Drouin or Monahan (because of UFA status), Gallagher (if healthy) or RHP (cause of rookie status) who has been absolutely tear up the league since being called up and is on a prorated pace of 28 goals and 44 points. I know RHP likely comes back down to earth an scores 20 ish goals and maybe 40 points but that is still good 2nd line winger numbers but there is also a chance this is just the beginning of another 30+ scorer in the Gallagher mold.

its Only fair to say that you miss an opportunity to cut it off lol

Good discussion here guys!

Your struggles are real

You can't be serious! If you are serious, you are either 12 and don't understand player values or think Lafreniere is better than McDavid! There isn't a GM on the planet who values Lafreniere at 3 1st round picks and a solid NHL D man!

Who said I thought it was his "value"? I said the "cost". Habs fans must have him because he is French, which is ridicules, and they continually post nonsense trades and offer sheet nonsense, so ok, here is the cost if you must have him, pay it or don't. Got it now?

Ok, got it, you are 12 and don't understand how the NHL works. Good to know thanks for clearing that up and welcome to my ignore list!

Awesome. Bye.

Interesting find on the article ranking leagues. I looked for something like that for a lot of time without success.

It's weird though: I have seen a lot of players come over from Swedish & Finnish top leagues for example who couldn't hack it in the AHL. I'm not sure I buy what that writer is selling.

I really like Dach and think he's gonna be a good one, but he and Laf are largely in the same boat. He has not put up 50 pts/season yet either.

Thanks for the chat!

Named me 3 players who received 3 first in the las 15 yrs!

Why are you asking me? I was the one who said he isn't worth 3 1sts

at the same time, NYR aren't trading Laf for two first rounders, two years from now. While Farrell is a decent prospect, he's still an undersized forward that is the same age as Laf but hasn't played in a single NHL game yet-- there is no knowing how he will fare (odds are stacked against him). NYR are competing now and this trade does not help that at all.

Sorry but the Rags absolutely take 2 1st and Farrell (even if they are 2 years from now) and then change their number so that Montreal can't change their minds. Laf at his current level of play is worth a 1st in the 11-32 range and maybe 2nd (depending on how late that 1st is) of you can get a 1st and one of the top 5 best prospects in the NCAA, then you take that every day and twice on Sundays. It doesn't matter if they provide less value to the current team than Laf, Laf's current role can easily be filled by another player, third line wingers are a dime a dozen. So let's not pretend that Laf is worth more than he is.

name me 3 players who received 3 first in the last 15yrs