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isles lookin for a scorer

Created by: Bennecon
Team: 2023-24 Toronto Maple Leafs
Initial Creation Date: Jul. 10, 2023
Published: Jul. 11, 2023
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Description
Are these close to enough value for both teams or are they way off.

To me they seem to work for both sides.

Isles want scoring

Leafs want different defense
Trades
1.
TOR
  1. Dobson, Noah
  2. Pageau, Jean-Gabriel
  3. 2025 2nd round pick (NYI)
Additional Details:
Leafs get good young defender would can put up some points.

JGP has some value but I’m not sure how much. He’s aging and has a big contract. But would be nice center depth for the leafs
NYI
  1. Nylander, William
  2. Timmins, Conor
Additional Details:
Isles were looking at the big Cat for his goal scoring. Willy brings the same things but in my opinion he’s better. Willy with Barzal would be a lot of fun to watch.

Timmins hasn’t had enough time in the bigs yet but definitely could be an everyday player. He is a good PP quarterback. With some development he could turn into something. Isles have a great D core to help shelter him at the start
2.
TOR
  1. Pelech, Adam
  2. 2024 2nd round pick (NYI)
Additional Details:
Jean-Gabriel Pageau

Pelech is the ideal Dman the leafs need
NYI
  1. Brodie, TJ
  2. 2024 3rd round pick (NYI)
Additional Details:
William Nylander


Brodie is a one year replacement for Pleech. He’s a good all around defender that can munch minutes
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2024
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Logo of the TOR
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2025
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Logo of the TOR
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Logo of the CHI
Logo of the TOR
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2026
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ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
22$83,500,000$88,394,084$0$0-$4,894,084
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,500,000$5,500,000
LW, RW
NMC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$11,640,250$11,640,250
C
NMC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$10,903,000$10,903,000
RW
NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,100,000$2,100,000
RW, C, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$11,000,000$11,000,000
C, LW
NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$925,000$925,000
LW, RW
RFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$3,000,000$3,000,000
C, RW
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,350,000$1,350,000
RW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,400,000$2,400,000
C
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,150,000$1,150,000
RW, C, LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$800,000$800,000
C, LW
RFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$775,000$775,000
C
UFA - 1
Logo of the New York Islanders
$5,000,000$5,000,000
C
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$7,500,000$7,500,000
LD
NMC
UFA - 7
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$4,687,500$4,687,500
G
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,000,000$2,000,000
LD/RD
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$4,150,000$4,150,000
RD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$766,667$766,667
G
RFA - 2
Logo of the New York Islanders
$4,000,000$4,000,000
RD
RFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,400,000$1,400,000
RD
RFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$800,000$800,000
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the New York Islanders
$5,750,000$5,750,000
LD
NTC
UFA - 6
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$796,667$796,667
LW, RW
RFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,625,000$5,625,000
LD
M-NTC
UFA - 1

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Jul. 11, 2023 at 10:15 a.m.
#1
Rip
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Dobson is not what TO need, Pelech is closer but he's not as valuable as Nylander.
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Jul. 11, 2023 at 10:16 a.m.
#2
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Quoting: RipNasty
Dobson is not what TO need, Pelech is closer but he's not as valuable as Nylander.


pageaus contract also sucks
Jul. 11, 2023 at 10:20 a.m.
#3
1GarthSnowFan
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Isles aren’t trading Dobson for Nylander. We get that you want a 6-4 top pair righty d man, but teams don’t normally trade those guys for a reason.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 10:27 a.m.
#4
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Quoting: Herb_Brooks
pageaus contract also sucks


Been saying that for years. It's funny how quiet isle fans have become. I remember a time when they all defended the several 30+ year olds making 5 mill for many years. And now they have to dump one each year to make the cap work.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 10:31 a.m.
#5
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The only reason Toronto should do this is because of the obvious thing of Willy being called William N-Islander.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 10:50 a.m.
#6
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Quoting: RipNasty
Been saying that for years. It's funny how quiet isle fans have become. I remember a time when they all defended the several 30+ year olds making 5 mill for many years. And now they have to dump one each year to make the cap work.


Pageau is about $1M overpaid, not a huge deal.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 11:04 a.m.
#7
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Quoting: Warrior24
Pageau is about $1M overpaid, not a huge deal.


For now but each year it's worse and worse
Jul. 11, 2023 at 11:12 a.m.
#8
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Quoting: RipNasty
For now but each year it's worse and worse


It will get better starting next year with cap growth. The problem for the Isles is not a single contract, it is multiple players being over paid by $1M. If you look at the totality of it, Horvat, Barzal, Lee, Palmeri, Pagaeu, and Czizkas should all be $1M less in the AAV. That is $6M that would be really helpful. While there isn't a single contract AAV that is too bad, that extra $1M that Lou gives out has been adding up.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 11:27 a.m.
#9
we miss leo k
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Quoting: RipNasty
Been saying that for years. It's funny how quiet isle fans have become. I remember a time when they all defended the several 30+ year olds making 5 mill for many years. And now they have to dump one each year to make the cap work.


eh, Josh Bailey was the only real turd of a contract on the team. As @Warrior24 said, all of the other contracts are just slightly overpaid guys - Palmieri has 2x$5M and scored at a 25 goal/50 point pace last year; JGP has been a 0.5/PPG 3C with good defensive value. Brock Nelson has been worth every penny and is probably a bargain at $6M, to be honest. Anders Lee is probably the worst value but he's still scored at a 28-29 goal pace since signing his big deal.
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Jul. 11, 2023 at 11:30 a.m.
#10
Bedard23
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Bad deal for both sides
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Jul. 11, 2023 at 11:58 a.m.
#11
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Quoting: Warrior24
It will get better starting next year with cap growth. The problem for the Isles is not a single contract, it is multiple players being over paid by $1M. If you look at the totality of it, Horvat, Barzal, Lee, Palmeri, Pagaeu, and Czizkas should all be $1M less in the AAV. That is $6M that would be really helpful. While there isn't a single contract AAV that is too bad, that extra $1M that Lou gives out has been adding up.


Barzal isn't overpaid
Jul. 11, 2023 at 12:00 p.m.
#12
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Quoting: dannibalcorpse
eh, Josh Bailey was the only real turd of a contract on the team. As Warrior24 said, all of the other contracts are just slightly overpaid guys - Palmieri has 2x$5M and scored at a 25 goal/50 point pace last year; JGP has been a 0.5/PPG 3C with good defensive value. Brock Nelson has been worth every penny and is probably a bargain at $6M, to be honest. Anders Lee is probably the worst value but he's still scored at a 28-29 goal pace since signing his big deal.


They are all overpriced and the term is the worst part, so many players who are going to be declining with years left of term
Jul. 11, 2023 at 12:02 p.m.
#13
we miss leo k
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Quoting: RipNasty
They are all overpriced and the term is the worst part, so many players who are going to be declining with years left of term


Brock Nelson has 73 goals over the past 2 seasons on a $6M AAV and you're calling him overpaid?
Jul. 11, 2023 at 12:17 p.m.
#14
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Quoting: dannibalcorpse
Brock Nelson has 73 goals over the past 2 seasons on a $6M AAV and you're calling him overpaid?


He's been better than I figured he would be but he's also over 30, his best days are likely behind him.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 12:25 p.m.
#15
we miss leo k
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Quoting: RipNasty
He's been better than I figured he would be but he's also over 30, his best days are likely behind him.


He's aging really well - very rare to see a guy have back-to-back career years in his age-30 and -31 seasons like he did. Never bet against father time, but I don't think it's insane to look to him for a pair of 30 goal/60 point seasons in the 2x$6M he's got left.

And to be fair - when you look at what guys are signing for in UFA, the only sore thumb deal on the Isles is Lee's. Pageau is a better version of JT Compher, who just signed a $5.1M AAV deal with Detroit; and Palmieri lines up with a guy like Jason Zucker's production last year at a similar AAV.

The issue is less that these guys are "overpaid" now and more that they're getting market rate on extensions, as opposed to a hometown discount - which is definitely something to quibble about, sure. They're nowhere near the bad tier contract of guys like Brendan Gallagher and Marc-Edouard Vlasic - they're just contracts you wish were about $1M lighter.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 5:30 p.m.
#16
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Bennecon
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Quoting: Not_Isles5513
Isles aren’t trading Dobson for Nylander. We get that you want a 6-4 top pair righty d man, but teams don’t normally trade those guys for a reason.


Team also don’t trade point per game 40 goal scores but here we are both team look for something that the other has. Seem to work good to me. It’s just the value that has to work
Jul. 11, 2023 at 5:32 p.m.
#17
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Bennecon
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Quoting: RipNasty
Dobson is not what TO need, Pelech is closer but he's not as valuable as Nylander.


Pelech as the leaf are constructed and going forward is probably more valuable to the leafs right now. The leafs have lots of goal scoring but definitely don’t have lots of good defencemen.
I agree Dobson isn’t the best fit right nowbut after klingberg is gone he would be a great player for the leafs.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 5:34 p.m.
#18
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Bennecon
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Quoting: IconicHawk
Bad deal for both sides


Means it’s even then. Don’t see why either team would say no for fit reasons
Jul. 11, 2023 at 5:34 p.m.
#19
1GarthSnowFan
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Quoting: Bennecon
Team also don’t trade point per game 40 goal scores but here we are both team look for something that the other has. Seem to work good to me. It’s just the value that has to work


Horvat and Meier were both playing at a PPG pace before their trades at the deadline this year, so that’s not remotely true. Obviously Nylander is better than Horvat, but he’s not gonna get more than Meier did just because of his age and contract status. Also worth mentioning DeBrincat didn’t get anywhere near what you’re asking for in this deal.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 5:35 p.m.
#20
1GarthSnowFan
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Quoting: Bennecon
Means it’s even then. Don’t see why either team would say no for fit reasons


Nylander is an expiring UFA who is four years older. Dobson is a 23 year old righty d man under control who still has room to grow. This makes sense for Toronto, not the isles.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 5:49 p.m.
#21
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Quoting: Bennecon
Pelech as the leaf are constructed and going forward is probably more valuable to the leafs right now. The leafs have lots of goal scoring but definitely don’t have lots of good defencemen.
I agree Dobson isn’t the best fit right nowbut after klingberg is gone he would be a great player for the leafs.


Every year it's the same thing. The leafs are very good defensively and score a lot. Come playoffs their scoring dries up a little and their defence gets blamed somehow. So better take one of their better scorers and move him for a defenceman. No, Pelech is not more valuable. This is the sort of made-up nonsense people use to justify lowering Nylander's value to ridiculously low levels.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 9:00 p.m.
#22
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Bennecon
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Quoting: Not_Isles5513
Nylander is an expiring UFA who is four years older. Dobson is a 23 year old righty d man under control who still has room to grow. This makes sense for Toronto, not the isles.


Ok then what about the other one. If the isles want a scorer they aren’t just going to get it for free. They’ll have to give to get that’s how it works
Jul. 11, 2023 at 9:03 p.m.
#23
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Bennecon
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Quoting: Not_Isles5513
Horvat and Meier were both playing at a PPG pace before their trades at the deadline this year, so that’s not remotely true. Obviously Nylander is better than Horvat, but he’s not gonna get more than Meier did just because of his age and contract status. Also worth mentioning DeBrincat didn’t get anywhere near what you’re asking for in this deal.


Different situations. Meier got a lot but it was in picks and prospects. That’s not what the leafs need.
debrincat basically go to choose where he went which took all the leverage away from the team.

The leafs have leverage cause there will probably be other team that want him or they cause just resign him and try and figure it out.
Jul. 11, 2023 at 9:07 p.m.
#24
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Bennecon
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Quoting: RipNasty
Every year it's the same thing. The leafs are very good defensively and score a lot. Come playoffs their scoring dries up a little and their defence gets blamed somehow. So better take one of their better scorers and move him for a defenceman. No, Pelech is not more valuable. This is the sort of made-up nonsense people use to justify lowering Nylander's value to ridiculously low levels.

I don’t think either of these trade are low values for the leafs. I realize they don’t score as much in the playoffs but what probably would help would be spreading out ur scoring so when player are playing well which seems to be all the leafs stars in the playoffs when it matters some other players can help.

Plus stopping more goals is never a bad idea. Also if u look at the leaf defence right now there’s no way u can look at it and say it’s impressive. That’s a fact. Championships are won with defence. Every team that’s won a cup recently has a better defence then the leafs by far
Jul. 11, 2023 at 9:13 p.m.
#25
1GarthSnowFan
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Quoting: Bennecon
Ok then what about the other one. If the isles want a scorer they aren’t just going to get it for free. They’ll have to give to get that’s how it works


Pelech has a NTC and without him the isles d core fell apart
 
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