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Controversial Cup Contender

Team: 2023-24 Toronto Maple Leafs
Initial Creation Date: Sep. 9, 2023
Published: Sep. 9, 2023
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Trades
1.
MTL
  1. Robertson, Nicholas
  2. 2024 1st round pick (TOR)
2.
TOR
  1. Afanasyev, Egor
  2. Fabbro, Dante
  3. 2025 1st round pick (TBL)
NSH
  1. Nylander, William
  2. 2024 3rd round pick (NYI)
3.
TOR
  1. 2024 2nd round pick (ANA)
Additional Details:
Worst case Anaheim can probably flip him for more at the deadline.
ANA
  1. Brodie, TJ
  2. 2024 4th round pick (TOR)
4.
5.
6.
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2024
Logo of the ANA
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the CHI
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the OTT
2025
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the CHI
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
2026
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
20$83,500,000$83,484,917$0$850,000$15,083
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$925,000$925,000
LW, RW
RFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$11,640,250$11,640,250
C
NMC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,500,000$5,500,000
LW, RW
NMC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$5,500,000$5,500,000
RW, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$11,000,000$11,000,000
C, LW
NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$10,903,000$10,903,000
RW
NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$3,000,000$3,000,000
C, RW
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Philadelphia Flyers
$3,000,000$3,000,000
C, LW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Vancouver Canucks
$925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$850,000$850K)
RW, LW
RFA - 1
Logo of the Vancouver Canucks
$725,000$725,000
LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,400,000$2,400,000
C
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,350,000$1,350,000
RW
UFA - 3
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$7,500,000$7,500,000
LD
NMC
UFA - 7
Logo of the Philadelphia Flyers
$5,100,000$5,100,000
RD
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$3,550,000$3,550,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,000,000$2,000,000
LD/RD
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$4,150,000$4,150,000
RD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$766,667$766,667
G
RFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$800,000$800,000
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$2,750,000$2,750,000
RD
UFA - 3
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,625,000$5,625,000
LD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$4,687,500$4,687,500
G
M-NTC
UFA - 1

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Sep. 9, 2023 at 12:20 p.m.
#26
Puckhead
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EDIT not sure what happened there...
Sep. 9, 2023 at 12:22 p.m.
#27
Puckhead
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The lineup is fine.

Not a fan of the min 20 guys, prefer 21, 22 or even 23
Is the idea to taxi Podkolzin down for a D on back to backs...or now and then...so as to rest Gio and Reaves now and then?
Sep. 9, 2023 at 12:23 p.m.
#28
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Quoting: Jded
Sweet.

Also, I know we’ve had some disagreement in the past. Just wanted to say I’ve seen you pop up a few times the last week or so with great POVs and a super constructive approach to disagreeing with people (some of whom have had really ridiculous takes). Just wanted to say thanks and kudos, Capfriendly is a better place for it


Hey, i appreciate that. I usually return respect when it's given, but I'm definitely still guilty of shooting it back sometimes when it might be better to take the high road. Can't help myself I guess..

Cheers!
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Sep. 9, 2023 at 12:36 p.m.
#29
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Would it be reasonable to swap Afanasayev for Tomasino or Evangelista? That's what I was going with originally but it was quashed by another Preds fan on here.


Nashville isn’t moving either for Nylander.
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Sep. 9, 2023 at 12:41 p.m.
#30
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Quoting: Ennis
Nashville isn’t moving either for Nylander.


Did you just trick me into an argument? Lol. In all seriousness though, what do you think would be a fair offer for both?
Sep. 9, 2023 at 12:46 p.m.
#31
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Risto has always had a great toolset but has been stuck on ****ty teams. He ranked 12th in the entire league in xG suppression impact and was in the 76th percentile in overall xG differential impact despite being used in a shutdown role on an awful team. He's also had some pretty productive offensive seasons playing in a mostly defensive role. It's impossible for any D man who plays shutdown minutes on a bad team to put together good analytics, as was the case with Hampus Lindholm, Doughty before LA's resurgence, Seth Jones now, etc. That's why people who only look at the stats without contextualizing them are usually way off in the player evaluations.

Then they see a guy like Lindholm place 4th in Norris voting on a team with actual talent, or a guy like Barbashev win the cup playing first line minutes, and they all of a sudden forget about it all. Like i said earlier, do you not remember Andersen playing top line minutes for the team who beat the Leafs and went to the final only 3 years ago? Remember all the awful defensemen who helped them get there? Probably not.


Risto is just bad, he's always been bad. he is a reason all his teams have been bad and every single player improves when he isnt around. He's garbage. And no, it's not impossible for any defender to put up good numbers in those situations because good players do it all the time. Literally all the time, that's how you know they are good players. Not because they are tall and throw hits. Every single person who understands stats at all understands this, that's why smart teams dont trade for him.
Lindholm was a very good defender for a long time and then got old so he couldnt do it by himself anymore and then when he was put on a good team with support his hockey smarts were able to shine through Risto does not have that. He has never had that, he will never have that. Doughty is the same way, and he's still not very good anymore.

It's almost like when you use context, and contextualize the stats and situation it is very easy to see what is going on.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 12:59 p.m.
#32
Danny B is here
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Flyers accept
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:08 p.m.
#33
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
Risto is just bad, he's always been bad. he is a reason all his teams have been bad and every single player improves when he isnt around. He's garbage. And no, it's not impossible for any defender to put up good numbers in those situations because good players do it all the time. Literally all the time, that's how you know they are good players. Not because they are tall and throw hits. Every single person who understands stats at all understands this, that's why smart teams dont trade for him.
Lindholm was a very good defender for a long time and then got old so he couldnt do it by himself anymore and then when he was put on a good team with support his hockey smarts were able to shine through Risto does not have that. He has never had that, he will never have that. Doughty is the same way, and he's still not very good anymore.

It's almost like when you use context, and contextualize the stats and situation it is very easy to see what is going on.


You're truly oblivious dude. When you contextualize the stats, you can see they correlate to the strength of the team that player is playing on. It's literally plain as day when you look at the statistics for guys like Doughty, Lindholm, Jones, Orlov, Muzzin, Martinez, literally every defenseman who has played on both good and bad teams, but in your opinion what's actually going on here is that Lindholm was good, but then when his team started to suck he was old, but then when he went to a better team he went from being old and bad to 4th in Norris trophy voting because HE WAS PUT ON A GOOD TEAM WITH SUPPORT! You finally got there, I'm so proud of you.

Risto has never had the opportunity to play on a good team and was always employed as a shutdown defender despite the "statistical data" suggesting he was the worst defensive player, almost like his usage had something to do with that... You think any one of McCabe, Holl, or Lyubushkin is more talented than Risto? He was a former 8th overall pick and has a great toolset. He just needs "A GOOD TEAM WITH SUPPORT".

And no, it's literally never the case that defenders tasked with shutdown minutes on rebuilding teams have good anayltics, not for Norris winner Drew Doughy, not for Norris runner-up Seth Jones, not for 4th place finisher Hampus Lindholm, not for anyone. Why? Because hockey is a team sport, something that should be very easy to understand.

Not to mention that he actually put up pretty solid numbers in his role this past year, more impressive even than Sanheim and Provorov. Meanwhile fans like you think Hollowell, Mete and Benn are all top 4 defensemen as soon as they have to fill in for injuries on a team like the Leafs.

You're truly hopeless, so I think this is farewell my friend.
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Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:12 p.m.
#34
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Did you just trick me into an argument? Lol. In all seriousness though, what do you think would be a fair offer for both?


I didn’t trick you into anything. I just stated Nashville wont move our best young forwards when we’re amidst a retool. Nashville isn’t the destination for Nylander
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Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:14 p.m.
#35
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
You're truly oblivious dude. When you contextualize the stats, you can see they correlate to the strength of the team that player is playing on. It's literally plan as day when you look at the stats of guys like Doughty, Lindholm, Jones, Orlov, Muzzin, Martinez, literally every defenseman who has played on both good and bad teams. But in your opinion what's actually going on here is that Lindholm was good, but then when his team started to suck he was old, but then when he went to a better team he went from being old and bad to 4th in Norris trophy voting because HE WAS PUT ON A GOOD TEAM WITH SUPPORT! You finally got there, I'm so proud of you.

Risto has never had the opportunity to play on a good team and was always employed as a shutdown defender despite the "statistical data" suggesting he was the worst defensive player, almost like his usage had something to do with that... You think any one of McCabe, Holl, or Lyubushkin is more talented than Risto? He was a former 8th overall pick and has a great toolset. He just needs "A GOOD TEAM WITH SUPPORT". And no, it's literally never the case that defenders tasked with shutdown minutes on rebuilding teams have god anayltics, not for Norris winner Drew Doughy, not for Norris runner-up Seth Jones, not for 4th place finisher Hampus Lindholm, not for anyone. Why? Because hockey is a team sport, something that should be very easy to understand.

Not to mention that he actually put up pretty solid numbers in his role this past year, more impressive even than Sanheim and Provorov. Meanwhile fans like you think Hollowell, Mete and Benn are all top 4 defensemen as soon as they have to fill in for injuries on a team like the Leafs.

You're truly hopeless, so I think this is farewell my friend.


Lol, literally every single smart stats person that exists, many of which are now employed by actual NHL teams have been saying Risto is garbage for years. Just because you cant understand the difference between a player who was good and cant do it by themselves anymore and a guy who has always been terrible doesnt change that. It is a very very very simple line of thought, I mapped it out for you hansel and gretle style, you can re-read the comment if you need a re-fresher but Risto and Lindholm are not the same, they've never been the same, they will never be the same and you might as well be comparing Colton Orr as a goal scorer to Ovie after ovie's 32 goal season for how much it makes sense.
Risto sucks and WILL DRAG DOWN ANY GOOD DEFENDERS HE PLAYS WITH BECAUSE HE ISNT GOOD. He dragged down better players in buffalo, he's dragging down better players in Philly and he'd do it in toronto, tampa, colorado or vegas.

It's hilarious that someone who is still convinced after nearly a decade in the nhl that risto is good is calling someone else hopeless. You've been carrying this torch for a while eh? Time to let go.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:19 p.m.
#36
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
Lol, literally every single smart stats person that exists, many of which are now employed by actual NHL teams have been saying Risto is garbage for years. Just because you cant understand the difference between a player who was good and cant do it by themselves anymore and a guy who has always been terrible doesnt change that. It is a very very very simple line of thought, I mapped it out for you hansel and gretle style, you can re-read the comment if you need a re-fresher but Risto and Lindholm are not the same, they've never been the same, they will never be the same and you might as well be comparing Colton Orr as a goal scorer to Ovie after ovie's 32 goal season for how much it makes sense.
Risto sucks and WILL DRAG DOWN ANY GOOD DEFENDERS HE PLAYS WITH BECAUSE HE ISNT GOOD. He dragged down better players in buffalo, he's dragging down better players in Philly and he'd do it in toronto, tampa, colorado or vegas.

It's hilarious that someone who is still convinced after nearly a decade in the nhl that risto is good is calling someone else hopeless. You've been carrying this torch for a while eh? Time to let go.


Yeah, Risto might have shown promise in Buffalo, but has not lived up. OP calling him an “8th overall pick” was funny, considering he is nowhere close to that skill set.

Toronto would have been much better off signing Schenn to a 2.5-3m deal than to trade and pay Risto a whopping 5m. He looked good defensively last year because that’s all he really does, and he’s not near worth as much as he makes.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:23 p.m.
#37
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Quoting: Ennis
Yeah, Risto might have shown promise in Buffalo, but has not lived up. OP calling him an “8th overall pick” was funny, considering he is nowhere close to that skill set.

Toronto would have been much better off signing Schenn to a 2.5-3m deal than to trade and pay Risto a whopping 5m. He looked good defensively last year because that’s all he really does, and he’s not near worth as much as he makes.


Risto is basically the Tyler Myers story, big man who can skate shows offensive promise but never develops a defensive game past chasing guys for hits and putting himself out of position, but people have tall boi dreams of those first few seasons dominating their thoughts when they see em.
And you're right, I think that Schenn deal is flat out awful and he's not gonna be the guy he was for 7 games of the playoffs going forward but I take it every single day over that Risto contract even if schenn cost a 2nd and risto was free
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:23 p.m.
#38
Rip
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
See Stanley Cup champion Ivan Barbashev as the most recent example of just how wrong you are.


What are you even talking about now? What does that have to do with Anderson? And do you know what's really telling about you? Only non leaf fans agree with you. Every leaf fan comes to tell you on all your posts that your making the team worse and then you insult them. That's your aim
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:24 p.m.
#39
Rip
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
We have different team building philosophies, mine just so happens to align more with teams who have actually had success. Do you not remember two years ago when Anderson was playing top line minutes for the Habs team that knocked us out of the playoffs and went on to the Cup final?

Clearly not.


Yours is to make the team worse so you can insult leaf fans. Which is why you have attacked my intelligence for pointing out (with supporting evidence) how wrong you are. You're here to troll. Nothing more
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:26 p.m.
#40
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
Risto is basically the Tyler Myers story, big man who can skate shows offensive promise but never develops a defensive game past chasing guys for hits and putting himself out of position, but people have tall boi dreams of those first few seasons dominating their thoughts when they see em.
And you're right, I think that Schenn deal is flat out awful and he's not gonna be the guy he was for 7 games of the playoffs going forward but I take it every single day over that Risto contract even if schenn cost a 2nd and risto was free


For a team like Nashville, I think it’s fine. We aren’t pressed for cap and I think Schenn can replicate what he did for Reilly for Josi, who desperately needed a DFD to help elevate his offence.

But either way, Risto isn’t worth half his contract. Dude stinks.
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Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:43 p.m.
#41
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Edited Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:48 p.m.
Quoting: JaredOfLondon
Lol, literally every single smart stats person that exists, many of which are now employed by actual NHL teams have been saying Risto is garbage for years. Just because you cant understand the difference between a player who was good and cant do it by themselves anymore and a guy who has always been terrible doesnt change that. It is a very very very simple line of thought, I mapped it out for you hansel and gretle style, you can re-read the comment if you need a re-fresher but Risto and Lindholm are not the same, they've never been the same, they will never be the same and you might as well be comparing Colton Orr as a goal scorer to Ovie after ovie's 32 goal season for how much it makes sense.
Risto sucks and WILL DRAG DOWN ANY GOOD DEFENDERS HE PLAYS WITH BECAUSE HE ISNT GOOD. He dragged down better players in buffalo, he's dragging down better players in Philly and he'd do it in toronto, tampa, colorado or vegas.

It's hilarious that someone who is still convinced after nearly a decade in the nhl that risto is good is calling someone else hopeless. You've been carrying this torch for a while eh? Time to let go.


Uhhh... did you miss the part where i said he was in the 94th percentile for defensive xG impact, 12th among all D? In a defensive role? On the Flyers? I'm not saying he's ever lived up to his draft position, nor that he will. I am saying that he was drafted there at the time because of his toolset, and that he could absolutely be a solid top 4 on this Leafs team.

He had very impressive statistics from last year for controlled entries, controlled exits and entry breakups, tangible data that you can directly attribute to him, rather than possession stats for a defensive defenseman on a bottom feeder team. He also had a better goal differential than Sanheim, Provorov and York despite being used in a much more defensive role.

The best bets you can make are on talent and potential. His issues were real; his positioning and decision making were often very questionable. Thankfully these are easier to fix than a plain old lack of talent. Impossible to say unless it were to actually happen but there's reason to believe he'd be great as a partner for Rielly, just as Lyubushkin and Schenn were despite being even less impressive statistically throughout their careers.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:43 p.m.
#42
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Edited Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:48 p.m.
Quoting: JaredOfLondon
Risto is basically the Tyler Myers story, big man who can skate shows offensive promise but never develops a defensive game past chasing guys for hits and putting himself out of position, but people have tall boi dreams of those first few seasons dominating their thoughts when they see em.
And you're right, I think that Schenn deal is flat out awful and he's not gonna be the guy he was for 7 games of the playoffs going forward but I take it every single day over that Risto contract even if schenn cost a 2nd and risto was free


See above.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:44 p.m.
#43
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Quoting: Ennis
For a team like Nashville, I think it’s fine. We aren’t pressed for cap and I think Schenn can replicate what he did for Reilly for Josi, who desperately needed a DFD to help elevate his offence.

But either way, Risto isn’t worth half his contract. Dude stinks.


See above.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:46 p.m.
#44
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
See above.


Lol, sure thing bud. You hold on to that dream.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:49 p.m.
#45
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
Lol, sure thing bud. You hold on to that dream.


Funny you use Myers as an example, a guy who literally played on the same team during the same period and won the Calder his rookie season.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:50 p.m.
#46
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Funny you use Myers as an example, a guy who literally played on the same team during the same period and won the Calder his rookie season.


yeah, and if you read the rest of the comment you'd understand why. hint, he isnt very good either
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:53 p.m.
#47
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Uhhh... did you miss the part where i said he was in the 94th percentile for defensive xG impact, 12th among all D? In a defensive role? On the Flyers? I'm not saying he's ever lived up to his draft position, nor that he will. I am saying that he was drafted there at the time because of his toolset, and that he could absolutely be a solid top 4 on this Leafs team.

He had very impressive statistics from last year for controlled entries, controlled exits and entry breakups, tangible data that you can directly attribute to him, rather than possession stats for a defensive defenseman on a bottom feeder team. He also had a better goal differential than Sanheim, Provorov and York despite being used in a much more defensive role.

The best bets you can make are on talent and potential. His issues were real; his positioning and decision making were often very questionable. Thankfully these are easier to fix than a plain old lack of talent. Impossible to say unless it were to actually happen but there's reason to believe he'd be great as a partner for Rielly, just as Lyubushkin and Schenn were despite being even less impressive statistically throughout their careers.


He looks a bit better than he is due to playing under Torts and being slammed in minutes because they have no other RD.

You traded for him to replace him with Brodie, correct? Neither players are good offensively but Brodie is like 2x better defensively than Risto, why would you downgrade?
I also found it weird how above you mentioned you built a team better suited for playoffs, despite the fact that Risto has 10 seasons in the NHL and 0 career playoff games played. Once more, you're actually BETTER suited with Brodie.

Risto's days of being desireable are long gone. I don't think any team should even look in the direction of his contract.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:54 p.m.
#48
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Uhhh... did you miss the part where i said he was in the 94th percentile for defensive xG impact, 12th among all D? In a defensive role? On the Flyers? I'm not saying he's ever lived up to his draft position, nor that he will. I am saying that he was drafted there at the time because of his toolset, and that he could absolutely be a solid top 4 on this Leafs team.

He had very impressive statistics from last year for controlled entries, controlled exits and entry breakups, tangible data that you can directly attribute to him, rather than possession stats for a defensive defenseman on a bottom feeder team. He also had a better goal differential than Sanheim, Provorov and York despite being used in a much more defensive role.

The best bets you can make are on talent and potential. His issues were real; his positioning and decision making were often very questionable. Thankfully these are easier to fix than a plain old lack of talent. Impossible to say unless it were to actually happen but there's reason to believe he'd be great as a partner for Rielly, just as Lyubushkin and Schenn were despite being even less impressive statistically throughout their careers.


This is all made up

https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playercompare.php?fromseason=20222023&thruseason=20222023&stype=2&sit=5v5&score=all&stdoi=oi&rate=y&p1=8474673&p2=8477499&loc=B&gpfilt=none&fd=&td=&tgp=410&lines=single
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Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:55 p.m.
#49
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
yeah, and if you read the rest of the comment you'd understand why. hint, he isnt very good either


Did you ignore the stats I provided for you?

And yes, you seem to be missing the point that Myers went from being a Calder winner to never living up to his potential, on the same team as the other guy we're talking about here... he was still a solid top 4D after joining a much more competitive Jets team, so not sure whose point you're proving here...
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:58 p.m.
#50
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Uhhh... did you miss the part where i said he was in the 94th percentile for defensive xG impact, 12th among all D? In a defensive role? On the Flyers? I'm not saying he's ever lived up to his draft position, nor that he will. I am saying that he was drafted there at the time because of his toolset, and that he could absolutely be a solid top 4 on this Leafs team.

He had very impressive statistics from last year for controlled entries, controlled exits and entry breakups, tangible data that you can directly attribute to him, rather than possession stats for a defensive defenseman on a bottom feeder team. He also had a better goal differential than Sanheim, Provorov and York despite being used in a much more defensive role.

The best bets you can make are on talent and potential. His issues were real; his positioning and decision making were often very questionable. Thankfully these are easier to fix than a plain old lack of talent. Impossible to say unless it were to actually happen but there's reason to believe he'd be great as a partner for Rielly, just as Lyubushkin and Schenn were despite being even less impressive statistically throughout their careers.


The best bet you can make is on talent and potential eh? Which is why you trade Nylander for older worse players all the time. Or Liljegren for older worse player. You're just a troll
 
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