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Controversial Cup Contender

Team: 2023-24 Toronto Maple Leafs
Initial Creation Date: Sep. 9, 2023
Published: Sep. 9, 2023
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Trades
1.
MTL
  1. Robertson, Nicholas
  2. 2024 1st round pick (TOR)
2.
TOR
  1. Afanasyev, Egor
  2. Fabbro, Dante
  3. 2025 1st round pick (TBL)
NSH
  1. Nylander, William
  2. 2024 3rd round pick (NYI)
3.
TOR
  1. 2024 2nd round pick (ANA)
Additional Details:
Worst case Anaheim can probably flip him for more at the deadline.
ANA
  1. Brodie, TJ
  2. 2024 4th round pick (TOR)
4.
5.
6.
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2024
Logo of the ANA
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the CHI
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the OTT
2025
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the CHI
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
2026
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
20$83,500,000$83,484,917$0$850,000$15,083
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$925,000$925,000
LW, RW
RFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$11,640,250$11,640,250
C
NMC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,500,000$5,500,000
LW, RW
NMC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$5,500,000$5,500,000
RW, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$11,000,000$11,000,000
C, LW
NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$10,903,000$10,903,000
RW
NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$3,000,000$3,000,000
C, RW
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Philadelphia Flyers
$3,000,000$3,000,000
C, LW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Vancouver Canucks
$925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$850,000$850K)
RW, LW
RFA - 1
Logo of the Vancouver Canucks
$725,000$725,000
LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,400,000$2,400,000
C
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$1,350,000$1,350,000
RW
UFA - 3
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$7,500,000$7,500,000
LD
NMC
UFA - 7
Logo of the Philadelphia Flyers
$5,100,000$5,100,000
RD
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$3,550,000$3,550,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,000,000$2,000,000
LD/RD
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$4,150,000$4,150,000
RD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$766,667$766,667
G
RFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$800,000$800,000
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Columbus Blue Jackets
$2,750,000$2,750,000
RD
UFA - 3
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,625,000$5,625,000
LD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$4,687,500$4,687,500
G
M-NTC
UFA - 1

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Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:58 p.m.
#51
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Did you ignore the stats I provided for you?

And yes, you seem to be missing the point that Myers went from being a Calder winner to never living up to his potential, on the same team as the other guy we're talking about here... he was still a solid top 4D after joining a much more competitive Jets team, so not sure whose point you're proving here...


Those stats are made up and you don't have any links to support them. Which is par for the course for you.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 1:58 p.m.
#52
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Did you ignore the stats I provided for you?

And yes, you seem to be missing the point that Myers went from being a Calder winner to never living up to his potential, on the same team as the other guy we're talking about here... he was still a solid top 4D after joining a much more competitive Jets team, so not sure whose point you're proving here...


ah yes, two cherry picked stats, totally makes up for every single other thing that exists that shows he's awful. Dude, you can find a stat to comfort anyone if you dig hard enough, and no Myers was awful in winnipeg, just like Risto.
But hey, the good news is is that Treliving isnt dumb enough to spend a cent to bring in either of these awful defenders so you wont have to eat crow about it and can just use the 'he was on bad teams' excuse until he retires
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:03 p.m.
#53
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
He's not just a big guy who throws hits. One would hope we can see the value in a toolset like he has, having watched the effect guys like Hyman and Knies have by retrieving pucks on the forecheck, creating space for their linemates and driving to the net. He has scored at a 25 goal pace over the last 3 years on a much worse Canadiens team and would be a good bet to score 30 on a line with Marner and Tavares. People like yourself never seem to learn from the playoff success of guys like Wilson, Anderson and Barbashev, all of whom played top line minutes in the Stanley cup final within the last 5 years. Go look at Barbashev's stats before Vegas acquired him, then look at the contribution he made in the playoffs and the contract he earned himself. Look at what Tampa just paid for a much lesser player in Jeannot to try and get that type of player. Obviously an overpayment, but Anderson is much more proven and we'd be getting him for much less.

Go look at Hyman's stats before we let him walk, or Wilson's career stats, or Marchment's before playing top 6 minutes on a contending team. Fair-weather fans who only follow the puck when they watch hockey fail to see everything that goes into a successful play and the importance of role players like this. He's more valuable than the small perimeter players we've built around, Nick Robertson among them.


Josh Anderson has 8 goals in 43 playoff games. If that's the playoff success you want, you are not really aware how hockey works.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:05 p.m.
#54
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Quoting: Ennis
He looks a bit better than he is due to playing under Torts and being slammed in minutes because they have no other RD.

You traded for him to replace him with Brodie, correct? Neither players are good offensively but Brodie is like 2x better defensively than Risto, why would you downgrade?
I also found it weird how above you mentioned you built a team better suited for playoffs, despite the fact that Risto has 10 seasons in the NHL and 0 career playoff games played. Once more, you're actually BETTER suited with Brodie.

Risto's days of being desireable are long gone. I don't think any team should even look in the direction of his contract.


He "looks a bit better than he is", as in one of the best defensive defensemen in the league last year despite, as you said, being one of the only RD on an awful Flyers team. Brodie has been better defensively yes, but he is on the decline and I believe the Leafs could unlock Risto's full potential, He was already better than Brodie last year, and bringing him into a more talented system with a more established structure should only improve that. He is also a better skater than Brodie, a better puck carrier, better offensively, much larger and more physical and obviously much younger.

A lot of what you're saying could just as easily have been applied to Schenn in the past, even more so. Risto just needs to clean up the mistakes in his game, just as Schenn did. He did exactly that last year, and there's no reason to think that can't continue to improve.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:10 p.m.
#55
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
ah yes, two cherry picked stats, totally makes up for every single other thing that exists that shows he's awful. Dude, you can find a stat to comfort anyone if you dig hard enough, and no Myers was awful in winnipeg, just like Risto.
But hey, the good news is is that Treliving isnt dumb enough to spend a cent to bring in either of these awful defenders so you wont have to eat crow about it and can just use the 'he was on bad teams' excuse until he retires


Cherry-picked stats?

https://theathletic.com/4750061/2023/08/07/flyers-rasmus-ristolainen/

He had a great season last year, especially to finish. That's not cherry picking stats....
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:14 p.m.
#56
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what ever helps you sleep at night, champ
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:14 p.m.
#57
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
He "looks a bit better than he is", as in one of the best defensive defensemen in the league last year despite, as you said, being one of the only RD on an awful Flyers team. Brodie has been better defensively yes, but he is on the decline and I believe the Leafs could unlock Risto's full potential, He was already better than Brodie last year, and bringing him into a more talented system with a more established structure should only improve that. He is also a better skater than Brodie, a better puck carrier, better offensively, much larger and more physical and obviously much younger.

A lot of what you're saying could just as easily have been applied to Schenn in the past, even more so. Risto just needs to clean up the mistakes in his game, just as Schenn did. He did exactly that last year, and there's no reason to think that can't continue to improve.


It cannot be applied to Schenn in the past, because Schenn has actually won two cups and 42 career playoff games experience, unlike risto's decade long NHL career and a whopping 0 playoff games to show for it.

Brodie is not on the decline, and just came off the best defensive season of his career. He's shown no signs of a decline and is in fact much better than Risto. Risto also isn't much better offensively, he scored 20 points in a top pairing role and his 5v5 offensive impact was in the negatives.
Brodie is exceptional at what he does in Keefe's system. Why would you bring in an overpaid DFD that looks a whole lot better than he actually is.

I honestly gotta agree with the other Toronto fans here. Nothing about this team is suited for the playoffs.

Risto stinks.
Josh Anderson plays like a bus with no driver and despite going on a cinderalla run one year with Montreal, is actually not at all a playoff performer.

You'd literally be better running it back with what Toronto actually has than overpaying for 3rd line/2nd pairing guys and saying "look, playoff guys!"
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:21 p.m.
#58
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Quoting: RipNasty
Josh Anderson has 8 goals in 43 playoff games. If that's the playoff success you want, you are not really aware how hockey works.


Or, Josh Anderson has 8 even strength goals in 43 playoff games, while playing a very unique role not based on goal scoring, but getting the puck to the goal scorers on his line, playing a much more physical role and being better defensively. He's paid 5.5 until he's 34.

Where, Nylander has 11 even strength goals in 50 playoff games playing on much more offensively talented rosters, is so bad defensively you have to hide him from top 6 matchups, scored one goal at 5v5 in 11 games this past postseason and is asking to be paid close to 10 mil until he's 36.

I'll choose door number one please!
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:21 p.m.
#59
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Quoting: RipNasty
Josh Anderson has 8 goals in 43 playoff games. If that's the playoff success you want, you are not really aware how hockey works.


Anderson is not at all a playoff performer. During Montreal's cup run, he was the most inconsistent player imaginable. Looked incredible for 1 game, then disappeared the next 3. Rinse and repeat.
Terrible defensive numbers and 3rd line production during his entire career.

I'm starting to see a trend of OP acquiring middle of the road players to play with the big 4 and then believing that will aid them in a playoff run.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:21 p.m.
#60
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
what ever helps you sleep at night, champ


There it is!
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:22 p.m.
#61
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Quoting: Ennis
Anderson is not at all a playoff performer. During Montreal's cup run, he was the most inconsistent player imaginable. Looked incredible for 1 game, then disappeared the next 3. Rinse and repeat.
Terrible defensive numbers and 3rd line production during his entire career.

I'm starting to see a trend of OP acquiring middle of the road players to play with the big 4 and then believing that will aid them in a playoff run.


OK so we're making stuff up now, hard to compete with that!
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:23 p.m.
#62
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Or, Josh Anderson has 8 even strength goals in 43 playoff games, while playing a very unique role not based on goal scoring, but getting the puck to the goal scorers on his line, playing a much more physical role and being better defensively. He's paid 5.5 until he's 34.

Where, Nylander has 11 even strength goals in 50 playoff games playing on much more offensively talented rosters, is so bad defensively you have to hide him from top 6 matchups, scored one goal at 5v5 in 11 games this past postseason and is asking to be paid close to 10 mil until he's 36.

I'll choose door number one please!


Anderson is not at all better defensively. He stinks in his own end. And he had all of the chances in their top 6 during that run and was still terrible. He was the best player you'd ever watched one single game and then you wouldn't even see him the rest of the series. Toronto should stay very clear of that.

The only reason why Montreal values him is because hes a great community guy and a great locker room presence. On the ice, his metrics have never indicated he's better than an average 3rd line guy.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:23 p.m.
#63
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
OK so we're making stuff up now, hard to compete with that!


Making what up? That Anderson isn't good? okay.....
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:24 p.m.
#64
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
There it is!


lol, you think Risto is good bud, you should probably calm your jeans
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:24 p.m.
#65
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
OK so we're making stuff up now, hard to compete with that!


Not the big 4 anymore. And yes, go look at Barbashev as the most recent example of exactly this type of move.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:25 p.m.
#66
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
OK so we're making stuff up now, hard to compete with that!


yeah bro, the guy with 14 points in 48 playoff games is a playoff performer! But hey, his xG% and evens on mondays in april is probably really really good or something.
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Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:27 p.m.
#67
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Not the big 4 anymore. And yes, go look at Barbashev as the most recent example of exactly this type of move.


Barby has scored 60 points before. Anderson has never surpassed 40.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:30 p.m.
#68
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Quoting: Ennis
Anderson is not at all better defensively. He stinks in his own end. And he had all of the chances in their top 6 during that run and was still terrible. He was the best player you'd ever watched one single game and then you wouldn't even see him the rest of the series. Toronto should stay very clear of that.

The only reason why Montreal values him is because hes a great community guy and a great locker room presence. On the ice, his metrics have never indicated he's better than an average 3rd line guy.


Nylander is better than Anderson defensively? This is where we call it a day buddy,

There's a reason Willy is sheltered to offensive starts away from top 6 matchups in the playoffs, while Anderson is started in the defensive zone much more than him.

Cheers, hopefully we change nothing and spend another decade laughing at this absolute failure of a team.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:35 p.m.
#69
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Nylander is better than Anderson defensively? This is where we call it a day buddy,

There's a reason Willy is sheltered to offensive starts away from top 6 matchups in the playoffs, while Anderson is started in the defensive zone much more than him.

Cheers, hopefully we change nothing and spend another decade laughing at this absolute failure of a team.


Huh? Anderson getting more dZone starts doesn't make him better defensively. And I also never said Nylander was better (even though he actually is).
Anderson is an absolute defensive myth.

And I don't know why you're comparing an overpaid 3rd line player to a b2b 80pt guy. Of course Nylander gets more oZ starts. He gets points. Anderson doesn't, lol.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:36 p.m.
#70
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
yeah bro, the guy with 14 points in 48 playoff games is a playoff performer! But hey, his xG% and evens on mondays in april is probably really really good or something.


Lol, he scored 5 ES goals in 22 games his last post season despite the fact goal scoring is not all he's capable. Nylander had 1ES goal in 11 games this past year and has 3 in over the last 2 post seasons, despite offense being literally the only thing he's good for.

I think that's enough for now.
Sep. 9, 2023 at 2:43 p.m.
#71
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Lol, he scored 5 ES goals in 22 games his last post season despite the fact goal scoring is not all he's capable. Nylander had 1ES goal in 11 games this past year and has 3 in over the last 2 post seasons, despite offense being literally the only thing he's good for.

I think that's enough for now.


He has 8 post season goals total. Total, in 43 games. But sure, he's a 'playoff performer'!. I also love you bringing up Nylander for no reason because you've clearly got a stick up there about who the actual playoff performer is.
But hey, if you wanna compare playoff 5v5 goals, Nylander had one less in 2020-21 than Anderson did in 15 less games. But hey! Keep digging, im sure you'll find something obscure that will show anderson is better in the playoffs
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Sep. 9, 2023 at 3:06 p.m.
#72
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
He has 8 post season goals total. Total, in 43 games. But sure, he's a 'playoff performer'!. I also love you bringing up Nylander for no reason because you've clearly got a stick up there about who the actual playoff performer is.
But hey, if you wanna compare playoff 5v5 goals, Nylander had one less in 2020-21 than Anderson did in 15 less games. But hey! Keep digging, im sure you'll find something obscure that will show anderson is better in the playoffs


You brought up goal scoring because you're unable to determine a PWF's value any other way than offensive production. Hyman scored 5 goals for the Leafs in 32 playoff games, I'm sure the Oilers really regret signing him at 7 x 5.5 when he was 29. Barbashev has scored 10 goals in 72 playoffs games but just got signed to a 5 x 5 contract at the age of 32 by the reigning cup champions,Definitely no value in a player like Josh Anderson though, who's 29 now and has 4 years remaining at a similar term to both. He definitely wouldn't improve offensively playing on a line with Tavares and Marner, Nylander would be much better with Tavares, dragging him down to 3rd line matchups so he can score a single even strength goal and avoid defensive assignments like the plague. Let's give that guy 4 mil more than Anderson until he's 36!

Almost like there's value beyond basic scoring that you're not able to account for....
Sep. 9, 2023 at 3:13 p.m.
#73
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
You brought up goal scoring because you're unable to determine a PWF's value any other way than offensive production. Hyman scored 5 goals for the Leafs in 32 playoff games, I'm sure the Oilers really regret signing him at 7 x 5.5 when he was 29. Barbashev has scored 10 goals in 72 playoffs games but just got signed to a 5 x 5 contract at the age of 32 by the reigning cup champions,Definitely no value in a player like Josh Anderson though, who's 29 now and has 4 years remaining at a similar term to both. He definitely wouldn't improve offensively playing on a line with Tavares and Marner, Nylander would be much better with Tavares, dragging him down to 3rd line matchups so he can score a single even strength goal and avoid defensive assignments like the plague. Let's give that guy 4 mil more than Anderson until he's 36!

Almost like there's value beyond basic scoring that you're not able to account for....


hahaha, oh my god this is delightful. "i brought up scoring because of YOU!". Sure you did champ, sure you did. Hyman was awful for the leafs in the playoffs, legit terrible and now he's found success being McDavid and Draisaitl's pinball bumper, good for him! Barbashev had a decent playoffs and now he has a contract that will age horrifically, bully for him! Josh Anderson stinks, his playoff results stink, his regular season results stink and he would stink on a line with tavares and Marner because he's a jumped up 3rd liner that weirdos who are obsessed with the idea of a power forward have pushed all sorts of obsessive thoughts on to.
He doesnt drive play, he doesnt defend, he doesnt do anything but skate fast in a straight line, fall over and occasionally rip a nice wrist shot. He is not any sort of playoff performer
Sep. 9, 2023 at 3:17 p.m.
#74
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Quoting: Affectionate_Side_64
Hey, i appreciate that. I usually return respect when it's given, but I'm definitely still guilty of shooting it back sometimes when it might be better to take the high road. Can't help myself I guess..

Cheers!


I’m the same man, we all are. But I’ve seen you take that high road when the low was reeeally tempting and far too easy. Cheers!
Sep. 9, 2023 at 3:32 p.m.
#75
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
hahaha, oh my god this is delightful. "i brought up scoring because of YOU!". Sure you did champ, sure you did. Hyman was awful for the leafs in the playoffs, legit terrible and now he's found success being McDavid and Draisaitl's pinball bumper, good for him! Barbashev had a decent playoffs and now he has a contract that will age horrifically, bully for him! Josh Anderson stinks, his playoff results stink, his regular season results stink and he would stink on a line with tavares and Marner because he's a jumped up 3rd liner that weirdos who are obsessed with the idea of a power forward have pushed all sorts of obsessive thoughts on to.
He doesnt drive play, he doesnt defend, he doesnt do anything but skate fast in a straight line, fall over and occasionally rip a nice wrist shot. He is not any sort of playoff performer


What exactly are you quoting there big guy? Here I was thinking these guys filled a particular role in which they retrieved pucks on the forecheck, got the puck to their skilled linemates and engaged in physical battles to create better opportunities for the skilled guys to score. I could have sworn that was the reason Barbashev played on the top line with Eichel on their way to the cup, or that Edmonton paid Hyman 5.5 until he's 38 to play with McDavid, or that Marchment got paid $4.5 to play top 6 for a conference final Stars team, or that Wilson played top line minutes with Backstrom and Ovie when they won their cup..

Thankfully you've shown me otherwise by bringing up offensive production. Now the only explanation can be that they won a lottery to play major roles on teams with much more tangible playoff success than the Leafs and were carried by their linemates as the prize.

I can't believe I thought there was a tried and true formula for playoff success that was being exemplified here. Now I realize it's best that the Leafs stick with small perimeter forwards and make sure our defense are slow, inept offensively and never taller than 6'1. Definitely seems like we're on the right track!
 
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