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Jets get better and get pick

Created by: Howie
Team: 2023-24 Winnipeg Jets
Initial Creation Date: Nov. 27, 2023
Published: Nov. 27, 2023
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Description
Both are cap dumps but Anderson is definitely lower value. Maybe the jets add a 3rd to make it even. Allows mtl to use the cap they save in years 3 and 4 on major FA and extensions and jets get a pick and a playoff type player. Lmk what you guys think
Trades
WPG
  1. Anderson, Josh
  2. 2025 1st round pick (CGY)
Additional Details:
Jets get Anderson who is a cap dump but worse than schmidt with 4 years left
MTL
  1. Schmidt, Nate
Additional Details:
Mtl dumps Anderson as he is making 8m in salary and help make a path for younger talent in the nhl assumes both waive for better opportunities
Buyouts
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2024
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2025
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Logo of the CGY
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2026
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ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
25$83,500,000$82,146,191$0$1,275,000$1,353,809
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$7,142,857$7,142,857
LW
UFA - 3
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$6,125,000$6,125,000
C
NMC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$3,437,500$3,437,500
RW, C
RFA - 2
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$4,000,000$4,000,000
LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$894,167$894,167 (Performance Bonus$850,000$850K)
LW, C
RFA - 1
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$6,000,000$6,000,000
RW, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$4,000,000$4,000,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$3,250,000$3,250,000
C
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$5,500,000$5,500,000
RW, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$1,350,000$1,350,000
LW, C, RW
RFA - 2
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$2,000,000$2,000,000
LW, RW, C
UFA - 2
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$2,166,667$2,166,667
RW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$775,000$775,000
LW, C
RFA - 1
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$1,000,000$1,000,000
C, LW, RW
RFA - 2
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$775,000$775,000
LW
UFA - 2
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$6,250,000$6,250,000
LD
NMC
UFA - 5
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$3,000,000$3,000,000
RD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$6,166,667$6,166,667
G
NMC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$3,900,000$3,900,000
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$5,875,000$5,875,000
RD
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$1,750,000$1,750,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$1,400,000$1,400,000
LD
RFA - 2
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$863,333$863,333 (Performance Bonus$425,000$425K)
LD
RFA - 1
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$775,000$775,000
LD/RD
RFA - 1
Logo of the Winnipeg Jets
$1,000,000$1,000,000
LD
RFA - 1

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Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:28 p.m.
#101
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
should be counted as one cuz this is thrown to many time for no reason


It isn't man cap dump is just an simpler way of explaining the cap to performance. It's no disrespect to the player and many fan bases use the term even mtl fans and maybe you at some point.
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:29 p.m.
#102
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
I also should be able to do a Ehlers Anderson swap if I wish so ... you guys use the ruling of trolling like a baseball bat instead of letting people defend themselves against the roaster !!


No because its so blatantly obvious your only doing it to TROLL. Your AGM not only doesn't make sense value wise but WPG would obviously not accept either. Come on now habitant. You seem to forget that Im a hardcore Habs fan too and even I don't think the value of this off. Again, that doesn't mean I, you, KH would accept.
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:30 p.m.
#103
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Quoting: F50marco
I mean its not a personal attack. Its a contractual term. All it means is a contract that can't be traded without a sweetener.


Exactly it's not anything against the player. They have families and need to provide and sure they would love to all perform on an elite level but that's the nhl and how you have amazing contracts and the cap dumps
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:32 p.m.
#104
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Quoting: F50marco
I mean its not a personal attack. Its a contractual term. All it means is a contract that can't be traded without a sweetener.


we shouldn't diminish the fact that always bashing players has an impact on how we perceive the AGM game here. You modo need to take into account how this site is becoming the brutality of a few managing an agenda to pull their way onto the thought of this sport or the AGM game.
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:33 p.m.
#105
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Quoting: VladislavTretiak
Montreal has a more urgent problem to solve, like finding a new home for Jake Allen

Anderson is not an issue at all. He's been unlucky, he's been scoreless for 20 games, and because of that he holds his stick a bit to tight in his hands -- a typical slump -- but other than that he didn't play badly at all. Anderson is clearly not a problem for Montreal, even though we would prefer to see him thrive and being rewarded for his effort and intensity.


Anderson plays a style that people love even if he's not rewarded which is fair but again paying 8m in salary for that is too much. Look at lowry on wpg for example 3.25m for a 3c that is the captain, one one of the best checking line in hockey rn and does anything for the team. Difference between them is Anderson could fall off or this could be the fall off of his play. Power forwards are a dying style due to the toll it takes on you and often overpaid for a shell of a player
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:35 p.m.
#106
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Quoting: GuyGuyGuy
If you need a forward, pay for him! And your argument is that Anderson only have 2 pts, so he is a bad player. Yet, you say that you need another forward like him. How incoherent…

Montreal doesn’t need any cap space. This offseason, they will have around 14m after the basic signings. Next offseason, 26m with their only 2 big contract to negotiate in the 4 years left of Anderson (Slaf and Guhle). After that, even more!

If they wanted to play Ylonen more, they could just play him more. It’s so dumb to think that Anderson eat minutes from him. And you traded us Schmidt, who would play instead of Xhekaj, Harris, Struble and eventually Hutson.

This trade seems only to benefit Winnipeg


To get a bottom six player and get an asset with him is the point. Not pay for the bottom six player and get compensation so we can have more assets for a major trade for a rhd. He is a playoff style player and getting a first with him is great. Him with lowry and iafallo/nino would really help him find his game again
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:36 p.m.
#107
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Quoting: F50marco
No because its so blatantly obvious your only doing it to TROLL. Your AGM not only doesn't make sense value wise but WPG would obviously not accept either. Come on now habitant. You seem to forget that Im a hardcore Habs fan too and even I don't think the value of this off. Again, that doesn't mean I, you, KH would accept.


I'm more hardcore than anyone here but do my «trolling» so badly, no if you let me put my way into account probably I could get close to what is the difference between a full season Ehlers going miles and then disappearing in the playoff to show the invisible Anderson how he is a great playoff player that any team need. But I wasn't able to answer more than 4 comments on each before being ruled out ...

I'm the worst agmer around but I defend my point and talk a whole lot about deal and how to be creative ... but you guys judge my cover over and over again ...
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:36 p.m.
#108
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
/thread plz this is just the usual westerner attacking habs players for the hundred time ... do some modo plz


I'm not a westerner I'm closest to Toronto my guy
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:38 p.m.
#109
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Quoting: F50marco
MTL has just as hard time attracting UFA's as WPG does. Also MTL already has literally OODLES of cap space so sign players if they wanted to. Honestly I feel like you're just doubling down here for now reason. You can make the argument the value isn't far off, maybe habs get a pick back, etc whatever. But trying to justify this as making sense when LITERALLY everyone in the post, including non Habs fans disagrees with doing this, should tell you something about the reasoning for doing it.


Mtl coming out of a rebuild with cap they can overpay to get an elite player. Jets on the other hand could have 20m and still no one major would sign, reason they are on 95% of ntc
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:38 p.m.
#110
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
we shouldn't diminish the fact that always bashing players has an impact on how we perceive the AGM game here. You modo need to take into account how this site is becoming the brutality of a few managing an agenda to pull their way onto the thought of this sport or the AGM game.


I don't have to do a thing just because you say so. I do what I believe to be right to the best of my opinion and the CF rules. If you have a problem with that, you can contact the CF email. If they say no more use of the cap dump term, I'll start removing it. Till then, you just have to realize that if it bothers you so much, you don't have to be here.
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:40 p.m.
#111
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Quoting: F50marco
I don't have to do a thing just because you say so. I do what I believe to be right to the best of my opinion and the CF rules. If you have a problem with that, you can contact the CF email. If they say no more use of the cap dump term, I'll start removing it. Till then, you just have to realize that if it bothers you so much, you don't have to be here.


This!
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:42 p.m.
#112
Le patriote
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Quoting: F50marco
I don't have to do a thing just because you say so. I do what I believe to be right to the best of my opinion and the CF rules. If you have a problem with that, you can contact the CF email. If they say no more use of the cap dump term, I'll start removing it. Till then, you just have to realize that if it bothers you so much, you don't have to be here.


the famous «Be Part of It or Exit» is proof that you guys are limiting the forum on the wrong basis!
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:44 p.m.
#113
Le patriote
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Quoting: F50marco
I don't have to do a thing just because you say so. I do what I believe to be right to the best of my opinion and the CF rules. If you have a problem with that, you can contact the CF email. If they say no more use of the cap dump term, I'll start removing it. Till then, you just have to realize that if it bothers you so much, you don't have to be here.


we literally have a sub-part of the forum on the suggestion side to help grow this site ... I did my part by actually pointing it to you ... now the community will have to read it. I know you guys wait for the ruling over you but showing so little interest in it shows that there might be mismanaging here ...
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:47 p.m.
#114
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
the famous «Be Part of It or Exit» is proof that you guys are limiting the forum on the wrong basis!


It isn't against the rules of the forum to use cap dump. Obviously if it's used and then they go.into detail trashing the player and being overall disrespectful to the player with comments that are directed towards the player to the personal level I agree 100%. But to get mad at use of the term cap dump when I went into detail that it's nothing against the players but more indicative of their value is where we disagree and to say that we should not use the term when you don't like it but clearly isn't against the rules of the forums isn't possible as saying everyone should not use it is not a solution. Capfriendly moderation team can't possibly go through all the use of terms that are towards players when the focus should be on the user's being respectful to one another. I'm sorry I used cap dump but I will still use the term in the future as I don't have any personal issues with the players but more about their value with again is opinionated.
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:47 p.m.
#115
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Quoting: Howie
Mtl coming out of a rebuild with cap they can overpay to get an elite player. Jets on the other hand could have 20m and still no one major would sign, reason they are on 95% of ntc


Overpaying free agents by magnitudes more than they're worth is not a good idea any way you look at it. MTL has been able to counter players not wanting to come here by drafting their own talent. That is what they're building now. This finished rebuild youre talking about is years away still. There is no rush to do this.

By the time they are out of a rebuild, Andersons contract will almost be over. They could just buy out the final year, etc.

The worst part is they'll be able to overpay free agents with or without moving Anderson. If getting rid of Anderson lets them pay those UFA's EVEN MORE, then its also a bad move in of itself. Again, your justification isn't making the Habs better and the thing that has a real tangible chance of making the Habs better, the 1st, is the thing they're losing in this deal.
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Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:48 p.m.
#116
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Quoting: Howie
I truly believe that Anderson needs to be traded man. He isn't helping the team. Ylonen could be such a good player too and no one would know if he doesn't get the shot. With a rebuild I understand keeping young assets and 1sts but again it's likely a late 1st in 2025 to get 5.5m cap and it's no guarantee the pick is anything. The part most mtl fans forget is looking at the draft history of their picks later isn't exactly the best they can do. So trading a pick that they can use the cap to sign someone that helps right away should be explored


He is not playing badly at all.

Anderson plays north-south and south-north. That's pretty much it. The problem right now is Martin St-Louis wants his players to get positioned where the puck will be going next. Sometimes it's north. Sometimes it's east, or west, or north-east-east. Anderson is north-south and he's a bullet train with grit. He's scoreless but he creates time and space for his teammates. He would thrive with any team that plays the good old Canadian hockey style. Bring back the 1975 Broad Street Bullies and he's your guy.
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Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:52 p.m.
#117
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Quoting: Howie
It isn't against the rules of the forum to use cap dump. Obviously if it's used and then they go.into detail trashing the player and being overall disrespectful to the player with comments that are directed towards the player to the personal level I agree 100%. But to get mad at use of the term cap dump when I went into detail that it's nothing against the players but more indicative of their value is where we disagree and to say that we should not use the term when you don't like it but clearly isn't against the rules of the forums isn't possible as saying everyone should not use it is not a solution. Capfriendly moderation team can't possibly go through all the use of terms that are towards players when the focus should be on the user's being respectful to one another. I'm sorry I used cap dump but I will still use the term in the future as I don't have any personal issues with the players but more about their value with again is opinionated.


that the problem with the capitalist-biased mind: valuing humans, instead of effort. Cap reality for a 20-goal top 9 players is valued at what 3,5 to 5,5 ?! Does the guy fit the requirements or did he meet those requirements prior to the contract dealing? If the answer is Yes, why a cap crunch situation should make a player a «dump»? It is flawed even in philosophic path dude.
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:53 p.m.
#118
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Quoting: VladislavTretiak
He is not playing badly at all.

Anderson plays north-south and south-north. That's pretty much it. The problem right now is Martin St-Louis wants his players to get positioned where the puck will be going next. Sometimes it's north. Sometimes it's east, or west, or north-east-east. Anderson is north-south and he's a bullet train with grit. He's scoreless but he creates time and space for his teammates. He would thrive with any team that plays the good old Canadian hockey style. Bring back the 1975 Broad Street Bullies and he's your guy.


Anderson just really isn't a modern day player which is a blessing and a curse. Sure he provides a lot of what is disappearing in the game but he is also not in tune with the modern play as a result. Sure he's creating but again 8m for 2 assists just isn't enough in the modern nhl considering his ice time and role. Like this guy could realistically be a 30 goal 50 point player but when he doesn't adapt to the modern game and plays a style that can drop production earlier in a career. Look at Ladd in nyi Martin with toronto. These players are paid big bucks on these intangibles but when it comes down to it its too much cap for the tangible things required
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:53 p.m.
#119
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
the famous «Be Part of It or Exit» is proof that you guys are limiting the forum on the wrong basis!


Yeah ok. Either way keep the convo on the actual AGM if you want to continue on this. Im done explaining for you.
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Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:56 p.m.
#120
Le patriote
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Quoting: Howie
Anderson just really isn't a modern day player which is a blessing and a curse. Sure he provides a lot of what is disappearing in the game but he is also not in tune with the modern play as a result. Sure he's creating but again 8m for 2 assists just isn't enough in the modern nhl considering his ice time and role. Like this guy could realistically be a 30 goal 50 point player but when he doesn't adapt to the modern game and plays a style that can drop production earlier in a career. Look at Ladd in nyi Martin with toronto. These players are paid big bucks on these intangibles but when it comes down to it its too much cap for the tangible things required


the 2 pts are nothing in his game to what he brings. He has drawn more penalties than any Eastern nhler so far by a mile. This is something that needs to be in your evaluation. This new-era game that you talk about uses this kind of data ...
Nov. 27, 2023 at 10:57 p.m.
#121
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Quoting: Howie
Schmidt could be a healthy scratch or see if he can be traded but 2 years compared to 4 is massive as cap is king in the nhl.

For the cap dump cost. Right now he has 2 points in 21 games. What if next year he's worse, gets injured, etc. The cost to trade a 2 point in 21 game player is less than a 5.5m with 10 points in 42 ahl games. Remember physical players like Anderson are walking time bombs which they can fall off a cliff at any moment based on his style of play. You can remove him allow Ylonen 18 minutes a night and maybe he becomes an even better lehkonen but mtl would never know without trading Anderson. Look at Gallagher for the contract like you mentioned ltir but look at Gallagher now he sure is playing okay but on a contending mtl team do you want him being paying 6m plus 100% no. No guarantee they are ltir retired but just end up like a Louie eriksson who made 6m and wasn't injured but wasn't nhl caliber.


Ylonen is being rotated with Armia and Pezzetta, whether Anderson is there or not won't likely affect his ice much. If he hadn't been scratched all season I might be tempted to agree with you but if he's being rotated with 4th liners and not playing above Pearson then Anderson isn't what's blocking his way.

The issue that I can't seem to get through here is that you're trying to fix a problem MTL don't have "NOW" and aren't even sure they'll have in the future. It's a bit like if someone was trying to sell you a tent because you might go camping in 2 years. You tell them that's great but you don't even know if you'll actually go camping though, so you'd rather wait until then to buy one. The salesman replies that prices might be higher at that point so you should buy his tent now just in case. You then reply that you'd rather wait to see if you actually need one before buying it, as it makes more sense to pay a higher price when you know you need a tent than to pay for a tent now and not be sure you'll actually need it.

We don't know what will happen this season, let alone next season or the one after that. What we do know is that the more term comes off a contract, the easier it becomes to move. Therefore if MTL don't need to move this contract now or next season then why rush to do so when the price to move said contract is not likely to be much higher when they eventually MIGHT, POTENTIALLY, find themselves needing to move it? It makes more sense to wait and see how things develop and act if needed, than act now at expensive cost for something that may never come to pass. Several years ago people made the same type of ACGM about Weber and Price's contracts that would have seen MTL pay dearly in assets to move potentially "problematic contracts" which never ended up being much of an issue for the team.

So to sum up, if there does come a time where MTL do need to rid themselves of Anderson's contract then whatever the price ends up being they will pay it. In the mean time they have no need to move his contract and so they won't.
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Nov. 27, 2023 at 11:01 p.m.
#122
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
that the problem with the capitalist-biased mind: valuing humans, instead of effort. Cap reality for a 20-goal top 9 players is valued at what 3,5 to 5,5 ?! Does the guy fit the requirements or did he meet those requirements prior to the contract dealing? If the answer is Yes, why a cap crunch situation should make a player a «dump»? It is flawed even in philosophic path dude.


Look at vlasic on sj. Obviously he was a beast for many years but looking at his contract now what would you give up to aquire him? Better question, what would it take to for sj to pay for mtl to get him. Mtl fans should know cap dumps well with Monahan who has really turned around got a 1st. Sure Anderson could be a 20-30 goal scorer but based on the cap hit and his play to this point not to mention other factors like term, actual salary, bonuses, player role and playstyle. He just isn't worth hid cap hit and should be explored dumping to any team as cap space rules the league and being able to get rid of a contract that could sour at any point.

Example for you. Nhl players are food and drinks in this scenario. Anderson is milk right on the expire date but it's not store brand milk either but not the expensive stuff. You think hey I have this milk and it's right on expiring you have a choice you can keep the milk and hope the it doesn't sour right away or you can get rid of the milk and let it be someone else's issue if it sours. You don't know if it's already sour or will sour the next day but you have this milk that's right on the edge of being thrown out or having potentially sour milk for days. Hopefully this makes sense.
Nov. 27, 2023 at 11:03 p.m.
#123
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
the 2 pts are nothing in his game to what he brings. He has drawn more penalties than any Eastern nhler so far by a mile. This is something that needs to be in your evaluation. This new-era game that you talk about uses this kind of data ...


https://twitter.com/HabsOnReddit/status/1729172814849261672?t=Bn4vbAtsetbrm1BcpfYCCg&s=19
This is from a habs account based on naturalstatrick. His drawn penalties are amazing not much else.
Nov. 27, 2023 at 11:06 p.m.
#124
Le patriote
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Quoting: Howie
Look at vlasic on sj. Obviously he was a beast for many years but looking at his contract now what would you give up to aquire him? Better question, what would it take to for sj to pay for mtl to get him. Mtl fans should know cap dumps well with Monahan who has really turned around got a 1st. Sure Anderson could be a 20-30 goal scorer but based on the cap hit and his play to this point not to mention other factors like term, actual salary, bonuses, player role and playstyle. He just isn't worth hid cap hit and should be explored dumping to any team as cap space rules the league and being able to get rid of a contract that could sour at any point.

Example for you. Nhl players are food and drinks in this scenario. Anderson is milk right on the expire date but it's not store brand milk either but not the expensive stuff. You think hey I have this milk and it's right on expiring you have a choice you can keep the milk and hope the it doesn't sour right away or you can get rid of the milk and let it be someone else's issue if it sours. You don't know if it's already sour or will sour the next day but you have this milk that's right on the edge of being thrown out or having potentially sour milk for days. Hopefully this makes sense.


I wouldn't use cap dump but nil value .... see the proper way to use wording to identify a deal ... No one will line up for Vlasic nor Gallagher. I can do that without insulting players or downgrading value using the right words. Using Milk to compare if he's fresh or not is also a bad way to put your opinion cuz so far your opinion is outdated milk to all of us and I wouldn't want to upset you with that!
Nov. 27, 2023 at 11:07 p.m.
#125
Le patriote
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Quoting: Howie
https://twitter.com/HabsOnReddit/status/1729172814849261672?t=Bn4vbAtsetbrm1BcpfYCCg&s=19
This is from a habs account based on naturalstatrick. His drawn penalties are amazing not much else.


I won't explain to you what you are trying to explain to me ... lol geez those Canadians sometimes ...
 
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